Algeria, Angola, Bennin, Botswana, Burkina Faso, Burundi, Cameroon, Canary Islands (Gran Cnaria & Tenerife), Cape Verde, Central African Republic, Chad, Comoros & Mayottee, Cote dIvoire, Democratic Republic of Congo, Djibouti, Egypt, Equatorial Guinea, Eritrea, Ethiopia, Gabon, Gambia (Fajara), Ghana, Guinea, Guinea-Bissau, Kenya (Nairobi), Lesotho, Liberia, Libya, Madagascar, Malawi, Mali (Bamako, Djenne', Mopti, Se'gou, Timbuktu), Mauritania, Mauritius, Morocco, Mozambique, Namibia, Niger, Nigeria, Republic of Congo, Reunion, Rawanda, Sao Tome & Principe, Senegal (Dakar, St-Lois), Seychelles, Sierra Leone, Somalia, South Africa (Cape Town, Jeffreys Bay, Johannesburg), Sudan, Swaziland, Tanzania (Zanzibar), Togo, Tunisia, Uganda, Zambia (Victoria Falls) and Zimbabwe
2. Searh the whole Antarctican region...
3. Countries of Asia:
Afghanistan, Bangladesh, Bhutan, Brunei, Cambodia, (Phnom Penh, Siem Reap), China (Beijing, Hainan Dao, Hong Kong, Kunming, Macau, Shanghai, Tibet), East Timor, India (Benglore, Delhi, Goa, Hyderabad, Jaisalmer, Kolkata, Mumbai, Udaipur), Indonesia (Bali, Jakarta, Java, Lombok, Sumatra), Japan (Fukuoka, Kyoto, Nagoya, Osaka, Sapporo, Tokyo...), Kazakhstan, Kyrgyzstan, Laos (Luang Prabang, Vientiane), Malaysia, Maldives, Mongolia, Myanmar, Nepal (Kathmandu Pokhara), North Korea, South Korea, Pakistan (Karachi, Lahore, Islamabad...), Philippines (Manila..), Singapore, Sri Lanka (Colombo), Taiwan (Taipei), Tajikostan, Thailand (Bangkok, Chiang Mai, Ko Chang, Phuket...) Turkmenistan/Turkey,Uzbekistan, and Vietnam (Hanoi, Ho Chi Minh..)
4. Middle East:
Bahrain, Iran, Iraq, Israel, Jordan, Kuwait, Lebanon, Oman, Of Course Qatar, Saudi Arabia, Syria, The Palestinian Territories, United Arab Emirates and Yemen...
5. Caribbean:
Anguilla, Antigua & Barbuda, Aruba, Bahamas (Nassau), Bardados, Bonaire, British Virgin islands, Cayman Islands, Cuba (Havana), Curacao, Dominica, Dominican Republic, Grenda, Guadeloupe, Haiti, jamaica, Martinque, Monserrat, Puerto Rico, saba, Saint Kitts & Nevis, Saint Lucia, Saint martin, Saint Vincent & the Grenadiness, Sint Eustatius, Sint Maarten, Trinidad and Tobago,Turks & Caicos, US virgin Islans
6. Central American COuntries;
Belize, Costa Rica, El Salvador, Guatemala, Honduras, Nicaragua, and Panama
7. North American Teritories;
Bermuda, Canada, Mexico and United States of America
8. South American Countries are;
Argentina, Bolivia, Brazil, Chile & Easter Island Colombia, Ecuador & the Galapagos Islands, Falkland Islands, French Guiana, Guyana, Paraguay, Peru, Suriname, Uruguay and Venezuela
I'm thankful to your kind words, I really need such great words/prayers like these... Kindly remember me in your good words. Thanks again... Stay safe and Peaceful...
In reading your replies, It seems you are undoubtedly a good philosopher on your own terms. You have definetly the answer to your question, there is no need to fast forward my statement.
I wish I could take language And fold it like cool, moist rags.
I would lay words on your forehead. I would wrap words on your wrists.
"There, there," my words would say Or something better.
I would ask them to murmur, "Hush" and "Shh, shh, it's
What a Co-incidence... someone just msg me that he/they want to runaway from these "Mythical, real, religious, Believers/non believer's satirical debates" My answer to you that we can Run where ever we like, but we can not run out of this Universe... Even After Death... so tell me if you can not runaway from this Universe then where where u when u was not born... If All the Pillars of Society gets together under one Umbrella and start thinking .. they can not bring even one close answer to the nature's truth... Unless they seek the help from religious Entities (here Messengers of the Protectors are the only Entities)
i do appreciate ur private messages, and welcome all of U and your Comments/believes, but I would like to request you to pls Post something here as well coz your donation in this coz will be rewarded and benefited to the mankind in the shape of Peace....
How many things do we need/posses and believe are the necessaty of our daily life as a Human Being; lnecessityit this way... this is a major Fact of our Life that; 1. (Now a Days)We Earn to Eat and maintain our Living Standard on daily basis; 2. We Seek Help from each others to build better society and protect it's future; We need to reveal/discover the hidden secrets of our life and this Universe as well...and lots of similar things that we all need on our daily basis to be upgrade daily; infact in all of the above; the most common and important thing is "WE"; and all what we are erning and doing in our life needs a deep knowledge and understanding; therefore; we (Human Being) decided to divide the responsibilities among each other to the best of our knowledge and understanding with the Subject; We have Created the following subjects; and still Creating More to Facilitate everyone around us... A Scientist, A Gardner, A Mechanic, A Tailor, A Contractor, A Merchant, A Historian, A Philosopher, A Cleaner, A Leader are the few examples of the Society Pillars; infact where ever we look around us we see tons of different subjects who are holding our society on their shoulders; whereas the common objective of all these subjects are One and Only ONE and that is to provide better living and Prosperity for the living Creatures on the Face of this Universe...
... any Disruption/alteration or deviation of any of the above subject/pillar by any one individual or group is dealt with according to the full extent of the law (established and enforced by their founders/leaders in order to protect these mini societies Pillars and subjects...) These Pillars of our Society are still intact because there is a Leader and his sub ordinates for each and every Pillar who ensures the protection of it's boundaries and it's rules and regulations; as well as the society's... We have not Noticed even One single thing/example In our Daily life's routine, which is baseless, lawless (without any rules and regulations) and has under no leadership. IS there anyone Can present one Example of any holding Pillars of the society without leadership and which is not protected by it's own Rules and Regulations. One pillar cannot differ with other's rules and regulations such as mathematics rules can not conflict with Physic's formulas, nor all these different rules and regulations of thousand's of Pillars conflicts with our (human being's) general interests and ByLaws;
The Conclusion of this debate is that "We have noticed and Proved that their is no society/group/Culture/Religion/company/believer/non-believer and even a country without it's leadership and bylaws, even an Animal does have their leaders and strictly follow Nature's By laws with in their clan to whom they follow; only one example to refresh your memories; have u ever seen a Duck leading his clan/society... Therefore When we Look around this Universe we see very systematic and organized very well balanced rotation of the Universal System; so far we have not noticed any deviation/alteration and Disruptions in this Universe; which tells us that these mechanism is running and protected by some rules and regulations, and we have discussed and proved above that where ever we find rules and regulations; their must be a protector/leader who ensures the protection of it's by laws and boundaries... therefore WE THE HUMAN BEING CAN SAY THAT IT IS PROVEN THAT THEIR MUST BE SOME POWER HOLDING LEADER DOES EXISTS ANYWHERE, WHO ENSURES THE PROTECTION OF THE UNIVERSAL SYSTEM; NOW TELL ME WHO ELSE THAT COULD BE?... WE CAN CALL HIM PROTECTOR OF THE UNIVERSE/ GUARDIAN / HEALER / LORD / GOD / ALLAH / BHAGAWAN ... CALL HIM WHATEVER YOU FEEL IS RIGHT IT DOSEN'T MATTER TO HIM COZ HE DOES EXISTS AND HAS HIS OWN IDENTITY; AND THAT IDENTITY WE CAN REVEAL IF WE STAY INTACT AND PEACEFUL... Chao... Chill again... coz it's my resting period, I'm going to hibernation after this... Take Care Guys... Keep Posting peace message coz there is no harm in it... Peace for those too who don't believe in peace...
JUST CURIOSITY...Animals and other Creatures are Much Higher Than Human Beings in Numbers and Percentages; if we still need to follow the highest numbers, Why we don't start following them, though few among US Praise and worship them; why we all should not join them...do u still think or believe that we need to follow the highest no's/percentage?
My Dear Adey; for your kind references and help in future, I'm giving you the names of Almost all countries and their populated Cities (best Known to me), I'm only seeking your help in finding the name of the Countries where these Moari & Aboriginoal, Atheists, Agnostics and Deists and similar other non belivers of God can be Found...
Though the List is too Big, therefore; For Your Convenience I'm Copying only Countries Of Africa and Asia Here;
all Other Countries From Caribbean, Central, North and South America, Europe, Middle East, Pacific and Antarctica will be posted later as I finish typing them (SKDKAK... sorry Dear, Can't Copy and Past them here, Coz U can't find them all together... he eheheh)
R U READY MR.. ADEY.?... just update me with their presence in any of the following countries, with their percentage... No rush just take your time;
1. Countries found in Africa are as follows:
Algeria, Angola, Bennin, Botswana, Burkina Faso, Burundi, Cameroon, Canary Islands (Gran Cnaria & Tenerife), Cape Verde, Central African Republic, Chad, Comoros & Mayottee, Cote dIvoire, Democratic Republic of Congo, Djibouti, Egypt, Equatorial Guinea, Eritrea, Ethiopia, Gabon, Gambia (Fajara), Ghana, Guinea, Guinea-Bissau, Kenya (Nairobi), Lesotho, Liberia, Libya, Madagascar, Malawi, Mali (Bamako, Djenne', Mopti, Se'gou, Timbuktu), Mauritania, Mauritius, Morocco, Mozambique, Namibia, Niger, Nigeria, Republic of Congo, Reunion, Rawanda, Sao Tome & Principe, Senegal (Dakar, St-Lois), Seychelles, Sierra Leone, Somalia, South Africa (Cape Town, Jeffreys Bay, Johannesburg), Sudan, Swaziland, Tanzania (Zanzibar), Togo, Tunisia, Uganda, Zambia (Victoria Falls) and Zimbabwe
2. Countries and their (major populated cities) within Asia:
Afghanistan, Bangladesh, Bhutan, Brunei, Cambodia, (Phnom Penh, Siem Reap), China (Beijing, Hainan Dao, Hong Kong, Kunming, Macau, Shanghai, Tibet), East Timor, India (Benglore, Delhi, Goa, Hyderabad, Jaisalmer, Kolkata, Mumbai, Udaipur), Indonesia (Bali, Jakarta, Java, Lombok, Sumatra), Japan (Fukuoka, Kyoto, Nagoya, Osaka, Sapporo, Tokyo...), Kazakhstan, Kyrgyzstan, Laos (Luang Prabang, Vientiane), Malaysia, Maldives, Mongolia, Myanmar, Nepal (Kathmandu Pokhara), North Korea, South Korea, Pakistan (Karachi, Lahore, Islamabad...), Philippines (Manila..), Singapore, Sri Lanka (Colombo), Taiwan (Taipei), Tajikostan, Thailand (Bangkok, Chiang Mai, Ko Chang, Phuket...) Turkmenistan/Turkey,Uzbekistan, and Vietnam (Hanoi, Ho Chi Minh..)
let me Add Middle East without their major cities coz of space and time...too; Alphabetically starts from Bahrain, Iran, Iraq, Israel, Jordan, Kuwait, Lebanon, Oman, Of Course Qatar, Saudi Arabia, Syria, The Palestinian Territories, United Arab Emirates and Yemen...
... You work on these countries in the meantime I'll gather other names of the Countries for your research.... Thanks for your help Adey... Chill man, this is the Cost we all must pay if we need to find the truth; Hopefully you must be enjoying this too... Chill and Peace again and Again...
thanks for your participation and comments here, all comments and belivers and non belivers can come and debate here... This may lead us towards the prosperity and the Peace among mankind, Despite of our Believes and Practices; if we all come and unite to some common conclusive points...Keep Peace, and Help Maintaining it all the times... Peace on you and the People around U... just Convey the Peace Message to Everyone...
stay focused..the truth will make you a better person..
One common trait of the one who senses that he/she is about to lose the arguement is to divert the subject matter; get personal etc...seems we have this theme recurring in the atheists posts
ah..........one of our god fearing friends from across the pond.....So God exists.........yes in peoples minds and hearts.........and thats it. "Certain people have a problem with using their minds" yes are you are a prime example my friend. If you want to beleive in God, than thats good for you but don't belittle people who dont or have other views, its their right, as it is your right to beleive in God.
The bedouin was asked how he concluded that a man and his camel had been in this place. He pointed to the footprints in the sand and the camel droppings. This is enlightened thought. He didn't see the camel or the man but through the rationale thought he came to the truth i.e the footprints were not made my themselves and neither was the camel droppings; they didn't just appear!
Yet when it comes to the creation of the universe, certain people have a problem with using their minds and resort to 'science'. As if science has an answer for everything. Science has been abused by the west and the atheists to try and make a theory called evolution into some sort of fact when it couldn't be further from the truth.The same scientists are now amending their 'facts' to take into account new discoveries..so much for their theories being fact! In fact scientific thought must be limited to a particular methodology of study of the characterisitics of the material objects subject to various conditions. Science cannot be used to make deductions about matter things which cannot be put under such conditions such as the origin of the universe.
If the magnificient complex time peice such as the watch is crafted by an expert then what about the universe? Is it not inevitable that this most complex of creation, which runs perfectly to a predefined system is dependant on the one who created it?
It is only the whim and desire of the few which blind them to the obvious.
Only 3 religions have Adam in their creation 'story'.
Some other religions have a 'first human' story that has similarities to the Abrahamic faiths, others like Maori and Aboriginal, to name but two, have vastly different and much more inventive creation stories.
As over half the world's population are not allied to the three Abrahamic faiths then these do not believe the Adam myth.
To count the number of people who actually dis-believe this myth we can categorize them as follows:
Those of other non Abrahamic faiths, atheists, agnostics and deists = 3.5 billion(approx)
Christians and other members of the Abrahamic faiths who see the creation story as an analogy = 1 billion (at the very least)
So the very maximum percentage of the world's population that believe this MYTH is about 30% and probably less (20-25%).
I'm afraid you are in a small minority of earth dwellers who believe this MYTH.
Peace
I don't go to mythical places with strange men.
-- Douglas Adams, The Long Dark Tea-Time of the Soul.
Peace for everyone... Would u pls mind explaining me your version of "Just convert by faith and true heart not by force or tradition. Follow your heart and not the others."
before U post your version; I would like to post mine first, correct me where I am wrong or mis understood and Why? Thanks in Advance...
I rather say this way .. .. actually I believe in "Supremacy of Heart over the Brain and the Body" "Only in few cases I allow My Brain to take Control Of the Body but still My brain functions/Act under the Supreme Command of my Heart" therefore all the evidences must go through my heart before analyzing by my brain, after analyzing the details brain sent his conclusion to the heart for the final review, where after analyzing the conclusions received from brain, heart gives the command to the brain to order the body parts to act accordingly...
Therefore, I strongly believe if anything does goes through someone's heart to his brain, it's actually tells him that the thing is Pure in it's Nature, otherwise it would have not gone through the heart... Peace
Un intentially we all use heart to function before Mind, let me give u an example; When ever U R Excited about anything or want to laugh,,, notice your heart palpitation, whenever U are sad or pressurized check your pulse again, Similarly, when U wrongfully shows your anger, your brain functions only, because heart goes into Hibernation, This act know as INSANITY among Human Being.. and do not come under any jurisdiction of any law Religion or Land... whereas the law applies on those wrongful acts committed under the Supremacy of Heart through Brain vice versa U'll be awarded if you act benefited other mankind or any other creatures existed on this planet... (Those Known as Noble People)
wise men needs just a hint, but i'm explaining lot here... Do U know Why?///?? .. For P E A C E .... Peace man...
Sorry Adey... I'm editing here again, coz i missed one point that u have said about 100% non belivers Do Not believe in Adam, Can U Just name me which Groups of non belivers of religions U R reffeing to; Please... Thanks... Peace again...
Peace on you Mr. Adey...how r u doing today? if I may, than let me say something in the begining that whatever I'm posting here is my personal point of view, and has nothing to do with any religion or group, i also appreciate very much if someone differs with my point of view, because his difference of opinion raises questions and i need those questions for my research which helps me raching my goals/destination. i always accept solid evidences only based on Nature's truth / history and the most important thing is Human's nature/interactions ...i do have a difference of opinon with others but i don't dis-respect anyone's personality/believes and i don't like to be disrespected by anyone... BECAUSE I DO EXIST
My way of thinking and believing things is different from the others, it's only because I accept and believe all the theories that comes to me until it's proven FALSE/WRONG, vice versa, IF SOMEONE TELLS ME THEIR IS NO GOD, I ACCEPT HIS THEORY UNTILL IT'S PROVEN DIFFERENTLY IN THE OTHER HAND IF HIS OPONENTS TELLS ME NO... THERE IS A GOD AND HE DOES EXISTS THEN I ALSO BELIEVE HIS THEORY UNTILL IT'S PROVEN FALSE/WRONG.
threfore, I request U to tell me who was the first man came into existence and how? What was his name, and Where U can Find His Family memebers. Do U have any details of any Ancectors of any family, who claims that their Ancestors were present 1000's of years ago or in such period of time when this universe came into existence?(I want U to know that i know them by their names each and their every Living
family members, I do have all the names with their places of birth, their no's of family members, and their childrens, children's family members... I would like to know your vesion,
by the way Malaysia is a Muslim Country 68% muslims, 20% buddhists, 9% Christianity, rest 3% are othr minorites... they all Believe in Adam and his First existenc as a Human Being/messanger on this plant. prove me If i'm wrong... till 15th century hinduism was the most recognised religion, Later 98% of hier population Converted to Islam, whereas all these currently 20% Folowers of Hindiuism Came From India's Tamil area to practice their religions...
I gave U my brief introduction, I'm not stranger to u anymore, U can come with me anywhere you want. Chao ... n Take Care.. Peace ...
Peace for everyone... Would u pls mind explaining me your version of "Just convert by faith and true heart not by force or tradition. Follow your heart and not the others."
before U post your version; I would like to post mine first, correct me where I am wrong or mis understood and Why? Thanks in Advance...
I rather say this way .. .. actually I believe in "Supremacy of Heart over the Brain and the Body" "Only in few cases I allow My Brain to take Control Of the Body but still My brain functions/Act under the Supreme Command of my Heart" therefore all the evidences must go through my heart before analyzing by my brain, after analyzing the details brain sent his conclusion to the heart for the final review, where after analyzing the conclusions received from brain, heart gives the command to the brain to order the body parts to act accordingly...
Therefore, I strongly believe if anything does goes through someone's heart to his brain, it's actually tells him that the thing is Pure in it's Nature, otherwise it would have not gone through the heart... Peace
Sorry mate, I'll think you will find that 100% of non believers do not recognise the existence of Adam. I don't even think the Malaysian Astronaut believes in Adam, even if he does believe god created the Universe.
And I say this with respect to you but it beggars belief that anyone, in this day and age, with all our knowledge about biology ,chemistry, physics and earth science can still believe in Adam & Eve and the Abrahamic creation myth as a literal truth.
I don't go to mythical places with strange men.
-- Douglas Adams, The Long Dark Tea-Time of the Soul.
Peace man... and Good Morning as Well... Pls Enjoy the research work, presented by anyone, don't get personal, keep peace all the time... because only peace is key to our existence in this world... Peace again... .
I'm not a god/God (neither with Capital "G" nor Small "g") because people think that they can discuss/blame/deny/insult/question bla bla bla... HIM... Only Because HE never Answered us(people) Directly (SO FAR we know of), neither HE showed HIS interests who is saying WHAT? and whatever people's believes are? So I'll not talk or represent God here, Because if there is a God and Who ever He is; then I assure you He don't acknowledge our representation to HIM. Now You beleieve in me or not but I do represent myself and I don't allow anyone to represent me, therefore I represent Myself to you by answering your queries as Follows:...
My Dear SKDKAK.... We human Being (Specially, I) are Not HIM (god)... We do Response to the Queries; accordingly ,and if any query doesn't fits the Nature's Law... than Nature's law will prosecute those who doesn't comply... Therefore, i take the Liberty to Answer you Now as you Wished. No Heart Feelings Please...
Now back to your (hypothetically Series Of Un-Just Questions) Despite Whatever U and Others Believe in, just simply Can you please Give me the name of a person whom you know/believe or forced to believe in (because U don't have any alternative Name besides their's) came to existence in this world; WHAT WAS HIS NAME?;
Pls Do not think Too Much We all Know he was Adam... and he was also a Messanger, First messanger for all the exsisting religions on this planet; every-other non-belivers/non-followers of religions also do beleive on his (Adam's) existence as well....
by the Way For your knowledge and Information, Animals, Plants, Wind, Solar Systems, Sky ... infact This Whole Universe and it's Contents were pre-existed way before Human Came into Existence, I told u earlier in different forum (where No one Dare to Comments on the subject, I created that Forum only to get the true results based on my theory about All of US that; What We as a Human Being Want to Know and want to Discuss and What we are afraid to know and discuss and Why?)that Animals are THE MOST KNOWLEDGEABLE Creatures on the face of this Universe, they born knowledgeable and powerful, whereas a Human Being gain his knowledge based on his surroundings. Pls check your Surroundings, i not compatible with the society then still u have the chance to upgrade, that's why we are Human Being because we can Alter/Upgrade our knowledge to the Findings/results which are benefited to all of us and other creatures as well... if anyone Among Human Being doesn't Upgrade his Vision and Practices based on the true findings/results than he must be PREJUDICE OR INSANE, he should not consider his self as a Human Being...
Regarding your another hypothetical Question about Messengers, Do you think that someone care what do you believe in or not, but I do care what all the existing religions and their followers, science and other school of thoughts strongly believe that the one who came/born/sent first was "Adam" and he was the First Human Being and The Messenger of God...
So My dear SKDKAK... Think Positively, because Adam was the first human being and messenger of God (I didn't said messenger of Allah/Bhagwa/Lord...any other name of gods) was the same person The value of your questions DIES here.. THE END...Finito, Khalas, Finish,Tamam Shud... Since u don't take advices but this is Free ... Pls Think .... and think many times before U post anything; anywhere;
About your Fingers Pointing towards my research work,(U said was Copied-Pasted from Googleeeee) My Dear SKDKAK, I don't mind at all whatever your believes are; I totally support u by all means because your Comments shows that you need help, Serious Help... Do U know Why? because Neither U can Find/Prove that My Research work is Copied and Pasted from any book/net nor You can Prove about my writings that were someone talked/said earlier; it is better for you to prove yourself that you are knowledgeable than an Animal and your existence has benefited to the mankind/Creatures, than discuss something else
Finally your last Query about Eid; it's mean A thing which Comes back to it's order again, (muslims when they fast during the Month of Ramadan, they actually disrupt their daily routines, and Eid means they should come back to Their Daily Routine with the knowledge and results they gain during the period of Ramadan... but for you my Brother, EID will be the Day when you able to Distinguish Human Being from Animals. CAN U? I DARE U to prove that U have one Quality, which is u believe is better than an Animal... No Heart Feelings again, Coz I'm giving you an opportunity to think and research about something, which you have never thought about in your life ever... once again Peace Man... and Maintain It peacefully.... take Care... I'm Waiting... he hhe eheeeee...Chill man, No heart Feelings again...
Adey: ur """Creationism" or "Intelligent Design"" is superb. Just wanna ask these so called scientists.. What was Allah doing before he sent his messenger on earth. We (Humans) were here before his messengers came here... SO, what say.. Just a simple question for them
SZafar: U have been doing a vanishing act too often. Why do u have to just do copy paste from goooooooole. Use ur grey cells and also ur hands and lets know the real you not the goolge copy-pase Zafar.
What is the plan of Eid celebration. Anything special ??
but I found this wonderfully funny little story, well it made me laugh:
"Do people say they have evidence of God? I thought the whole point is that for faith to exist it has to be something you can't prove but believe to be true anyway? No one "believes in" gravity. All you have to do to prove it exists is to stand over a baby with a sharp knife and drop it. To prove that a benevolent deity exists the knife would probably have to stop falling and swerve into you while a burning bush across the road shouts out "die!"
:P
I don't go to mythical places with strange men.
-- Douglas Adams, The Long Dark Tea-Time of the Soul.
Do you understand the meaning of a common discussion forum. It means where all are welcome and share thoughts and understand the viewpoint of others. If there is a problem for you not able to understand few people here then u need to ask for it and you will be enlightened to the extent possible.
""I have noticed here that many of them even doesn't know what they are talking about? what is their beleive, what is their religion? Are they on the right path?""
Since when did you think we are here to disclose all our beliefs and religion. Or are you one among those that belong to the thought of ONE and only one religion is a fact and rest all are junk amd garbage.. Mind you there are a lot of them around. In any case, it realy doesn't matter whether you are one among the many or a person who really believes in all religions and faiths.
"Some trends developing in the USA such as "Creationism" or "Intelligent Design" prove by scientific evidence that all living things were created by Allah."
You will not find one scientist who says this is science, this is psydo-science with no evidence to back it up. You should read what some of these 'Intelligent Designers' believe(and CAN NOT prove),it's hilarious!
Please check them out, it's anti-science and in a lot of cases damn right lies.
PEACE
I don't go to mythical places with strange men.
-- Douglas Adams, The Long Dark Tea-Time of the Soul.
What about when that "perfect and complex organism" goes wrong and the "development of the glorious human" is perverted by such conditions as pre-eclampsia? This is the commonest and most dangerous complication of pregnancy, and women and many babies still die because of it. Where does this fit into the miracle?
***********
"There's this thing called being so open-minded your brains drop out". - Richard Dawkins
A proper survey conducted by a reputable publication actually asking foremost scientists what they believe and with percentages.
"How do you explain the fact that intelligent people believe in gods?
This is absolutely untrue especially among scientists.
Recent demographic surveys of the United States of America indicate that as of the year 2000, 14% of Americans did not consider religion to be an important part of their lives. This figure is up from 10% in 1990. Only 0.5% of the population at large responded that they were atheist. However, this number skyrockets when you switch the focus to scientist and rises even higher when one considers “greater” scientists.
In 1914, psychologist James H. Leuba conducted a landmark survey of belief among scientist. Leuba found that the majority of a randomly selected scientist doubted the existence of god. When he narrowed his sample to the “greater” scientists, doubt rose further. He repeated the survey 20 years later and found that the percentages of those doubting the existence of god had risen further.
In 1998, the publication Nature repeated Leuba’s survey. The results are summarized in the table below. For purposes of the modern survey, “greater” scientists were defined as members of the National Academy of Science.
Year
1914 1933 1998
Atheist 52 % 68 % 72 %
Agnostic 21 % 17 % 21 %
Believer 27 % 15 % 7 %
Doubt is highest among NAS biologist at 95%. Physicists come in a close second at 93% while mathematicians are at the low end with 86% either atheists or agnostics.
In addition, most well known and widely published scientists have stated publicly that they are either atheists or agnostics including Noam Chomsky, Steven Hawking, Richard Dawkins, E.O. Wilson and the late scientists Carl Sagan, Stephen Jay Gould, and Richard Feynman. Surveying the history of physics, I can only find one notable name of an individual who believed in the existence of god and was a regular attendee of a religion, namely James Clerk Maxwell who born, lived and died a Scottish Presbyterian."
See Leading Scientists still reject God. Nature, Vol 394, July 23 1998, www.nature.com/nature.
I don't go to mythical places with strange men.
-- Douglas Adams, The Long Dark Tea-Time of the Soul.
And among His Signs, He shows you the lightning, by way both of fear and of hope, and He sends down rain from the sky and with it gives life to the earth after it is dead: verily in that are Signs for those who are wise. (Surat ar-Rum: 24)
Science leads us to the conclusion that the universe has a Creator and this Creator is perfect in might, wisdom and knowledge. It is religion that shows us the way in knowing Allah. It is therefore possible to say that science is a method we use to better see and investigate the realities addressed by religion. Nevertheless, today, some of the scientists who step forth in the name of science take an entirely different stand. In their view, scientific discoveries do not imply the creation of Allah. They have, on the contrary, projected an atheistic understanding of science by saying that it is not possible to reach Allah through scientific data: they claim that science and religion are two clashing notions.
As a matter of fact, this atheistic understanding of science is quite recent. Until a few centuries ago, science and religion were never thought to clash with each other, and science was accepted as a method of proving the existence of Allah. The so-called atheistic understanding of science flourished only after the materialist and positivist philosophies swept through the world of science in the 18th and 19th centuries.
Particularly after Charles Darwin postulated the theory of evolution in 1859, circles holding a materialistic world view started to ideologically defend this theory, which they looked upon as an alternative to religion. The theory of evolution argued that the universe was not created by a creator but came into being by chance. As a result, it was asserted that religion was in conflict with science. The British researchers Michael Baigent, Richard Leigh and Henry Lincoln said on this issue:
For Isaac Newton, a century and a half before Darwin, science was not separate from religion but, on the contrary, an aspect of religion, and ultimately subservient to it. ...But the science of Darwin's time became precisely that, divorcing itself from the context in which it had previously existed and establishing itself as a rival absolute, an alternative repository of meaning. As a result, religion and science were no longer working in concert, but rather stood opposed to each other, and humanity was increasingly forced to choose between them...23
As we stated before, the so-called split between science and religion was totally ideological. Some scientists, who earnestly believed in materialism, conditioned themselves to prove that the universe had no creator and they devised various theories in this context. The theory of evolution was the most famous and the most important of them. In the field of astronomy as well certain theories were developed such as the "steady-state theory" or the "chaos theory". However, all of these theories that denied creation were demolished by science itself, as we have clearly shown in the previous chapters.
Today, scientists who still keep to these theories and insist on denying all things religious, are dogmatic and bigoted people, who have conditioned themselves not to believe in Allah. The famous English zoologist and evolutionist D.M.S. Watson confesses to this dogmatism as he explains why he and his colleagues accept the theory of evolution:
If so, it will present a parallel to the theory of evolution itself, a theory universally accepted, not because it can be proved by logically coherent evidence to be true, but because the only alternative, special creation, is clearly incredible.24
What Watson means by "special creation" is Allah's creation. As acknowledged, this scientist finds this "unacceptable". But why? Is it because science says so? Actually it does not. On the contrary, science proves the truth of creation. The only reason why Watson looks upon this fact as unacceptable is because he has conditioned himself to deny the existence of Allah. All other evolutionists take the same stand.
Evolutionists rely not on science but on materialist philosophy and they distort science to make it agree with this philosophy. A geneticist and an outspoken evolutionist from Harvard University, Richard Lewontin, confesses to this truth:
It is not that the methods and institutions of science somehow compel us to accept a material explanation of the phenomenal world, but, on the contrary, that we are forced by our a priori adherence to material causes to create an apparatus of investigation and a set of concepts that produce material explanations, no matter how counter-intuitive, no matter how mystifying to the uninitiated. Moreover, that materialism is absolute, so we cannot allow a Divine Foot in the door.25
On the other hand, today, just as in history, there are, as opposed to this dogmatic materialist group, scientists who confirm Allah's existence, and regard science as a way of knowing Him. Some trends developing in the USA such as "Creationism" or "Intelligent Design" prove by scientific evidence that all living things were created by Allah.
This shows us that science and religion are not conflicting sources of information, but that, on the contrary, science is a method that verifies the absolute truths provided by religion. The clash between religion and science can only hold true for certain religions that incorporate some superstitious elements as well as divine sources. However, this is certainly out of the question for Islam, which relies only on the pure revelation of Allah. Moreover, Islam particularly advocates scientific enquiry, and announces that probing the universe is a method to explore the creation of Allah. The following verse of the Qur'an addresses this issue;
Do they not look at the sky above them? How We have built it and adorned it, and there are no rifts therein? And the earth - We have spread it out, and set thereon mountains standing firm, and caused it to bring forth plants of beauteous kinds (in pairs). And We send down from the sky blessed water whereby We give growth unto gardens and the grain of crops. And tall palm-trees, with shoots of fruit-stalks, piled one over another. (Surah Qaf, 6-7, 9-10)
As the above verses imply, the Qur'an always urges people to think, to reason and to explore everything in the world in which they live. This is because science supports religion, saves the individual from ignorance, and causes him to think more consciously; it opens wide one's world of thought and helps one grasp the signs of Allah self-evident in the universe. Prominent German physicist Max Planck said that "everyone who, regardless of his field, studies science seriously is to read the following phrase on the door of the temple of science: 'Have faith'". According to him, faith is an essential attribute of a scientist.26
All the issues we have treated so far simply put it that the existence of the universe and all living things cannot be explained by coincidences. Many scientists who have left their mark on the world of science have confirmed, and still confirm this great reality. The more people learn about the universe, the higher does their admiration for its flawless order becomes. Every newly-discovered detail supports creation in an unquestionable way.
The great majority of modern physicists accept the fact of creation as we set foot in the 21st century. David Darling also maintains that neither time, nor space, nor matter, nor energy, nor even a tiny spot or a cavity existed at the beginning. A slight quick movement and a modest quiver and fluctuation occurred. Darling ends by saying that when the cover of this cosmic box was opened, the tendrils of the miracle of creation appeared from beneath it.27
Besides, it is already known that almost all the founders of diverse scientific branches believed in Allah and His divine books. The greatest physicists in history, Newton, Faraday, Kelvin and Maxwell are a few examples of such scientists.
Max Planck
Max Planck Isaac Newton
Sir Isaac Newton
In the time of Isaac Newton, the great physicist, scientists believed that the movements of the heavenly bodies and planets could be explained by different laws. Nevertheless, Newton believed that the creator of earth and space was the same, and therefore they had to be explained by the same laws.He expanded this view in his book stating that the perfect system of the sun and planets could only survive under the control and dominance of a mighty and wise being.28
As is evident, thousands of scientists who have been doing research in the fields of physics, mathematics, and astronomy since the Middle Ages all agree on the idea that the universe is created by a single Creator and always focus on the same point. The founder of physical astronomy, Johannes Kepler, stated his strong belief in God in one of his books in which he declared that we, as poor, inadequate servants of God, have to see the greatness of God’s wisdom and might and sumbit ourselves to Him. 29
The great physicist, William Thompson (Lord Kelvin), who established thermodynamics on a formal scientific basis, was also a Christian who believed in God. He had strongly opposed Darwin's theory of evolution and totally rejected it. He explained shortly before his death that when it looks at the origins of life, science certainly confirms the existance of that Great Power.30
One of the professors of physics at Oxford University, Robert Mattheus states the same fact in his book published in 1992 where he explains that DNA molecules were created by God. Mattheus says that all these stages proceed in a perfect harmony from a single cell to a living baby, then to a little child, and finally to an adolescent. All these events can be explained only by a miracle, just as in all the other stages of biology. Mattheus asks how such a perfect and complex organism can emerge from such a simple and tiny cell and how a glorious HUMAN is created from a cell even smaller than the dot on the letter. He finally concludes that this is nothing short of a miracle.31
Some other scientists who admit that the universe is created by a Creator and who are known by their cited attributes are:
Robert Boyle (the father of modern chemistry)
Iona William Petty (known for his studies on statistics and modern economy)
Michael Faraday (one of the greatest physicists of all times)
Gregory Mendel (the father of genetics; he invalidated Darwinism with his discoveries in the science of genetics)
Louis Pasteur (the greatest name in bacteriology; he declared war on Darwinism)
John Dalton (the father of atomic theory)
Blaise Pascal (one of the most important mathematicians)
John Ray (the most important name in British natural history)
Nicolaus Steno (a famous stratiographer who investigated earth layers)
Carolus Linnaeus (the father of biological classification)
Georges Cuvier (the founder of comparative anatomy)
Matthew Maury (the founder of oceanography)
Thomas Anderson (one the pioneers in the field of organic chemistry)
I'll write in my spare time another perspective; Proving the Existanse of GOD and His Religion by using basic rules and Regulations; set by Intelectuals and Scholars, One can not research if he didn't oblige the Laws/Rules... I'm sorry Dear, that's all for the day, I'm so tired need s a complete rest, Hope to C y again, Bye...
"without seeking any help/reference from any existing religion these days, word of mouth or book references..." we have to find our own path.
You're quite right of course in this respect, so I'll share this point of view: People that do not believe in a god are more moral than those that have a default, not my responsibility, god back-up. The quote is from the film maker David Cronenberg:
"It was apparent to me that religion was an invented thing, a wish-fulfillment thing, a fantasy thing. It was much more real, dangerous, to accept that mortality was the end for you as an individual. Murder...(is a) physical act of absolute destruction because you're ending something, a body, that is unique. That person never existed before, will never exist again, will not be karmically recycled, will not go to heaven; therefore I take it seriously."
Those of us that rationally don't believe tend to treat life as a very serious and unique time which impacts on our morality to a great degree; we don't need a hereditary acquired mental disorder to find our way in, and make sense of, life. Sorry if that sounds harsh, and its not pointed at anyone personally as I understand its the greatest benignly(in most circumstances) intended hoodwink in the history of our species, but i call it as I see it.
I don't go to mythical places with strange men.
-- Douglas Adams, The Long Dark Tea-Time of the Soul.
I do not differ at all, but if someone needs to prove some thing like this topic he needs to decide the boundries first, in which he needs to look in, got to involve each and every espect of it's surroundings to know and prove the subject, which is I'm doing... without seeking any help/reference from any existing religion these days, word of mouth or book references...
I agree with aak point of view that its the reponsibility of one to find the right path for his survival on the day of judgement. One cannot say that he was born in XYZ religion therefore he was not aware of the right path. Al Mighty has given so many options to mankind to find him, so many maricles around us, who is the creator of Universe? the sky, sea, earth?
What about the Prophets ? Who were those ? Messengers of Allah (GOD) ??
Instead of discussing what we don't know is useless, we should first do the research from the reliable sources, from the religious people discuss the religion and see which religion is inviting you for your better life and your generations and once we have the true knowledge of religion then we should discuss on it.
I have noticed here that many of them even doesn't know what they are talking about? what is their beleive, what is their religion? Are they on the right path?
This is a discussion for Academic researchers and Philosophers or a religious students who are searching for the truth; though various philosophers from different school of thoughts have discussed FOR and AGAINST the Existence of GOD; but I'm refraining myself to seek any example or help for any religion or thoughts into my discussion;
Usually we discuss only those things, whom are Known to us by any means... (There is no Question about it, that; We all aware of this fact, that; there are some means of knowing someone or something, Via News Media, Views of others, by writing/reading, by the world of Mouth, Visual experience, Advertisement, by smelling, tasting or feelings, by using Our Instinct and Miracle,..etc.., are some examples I can add here, in fact it could be anything else, which conveys something in us; give us the knowledge to discuss about that thing,
it is quiet obvious that NO ONE among us (mankind), can discuss about a thing that we don't know about... (Dear Reader; I don't know who is reading this; therefore I can not discuss/comment about U, at least i need a least info about u to discuss such as, your Gender, Name, Place, Education, Reason to Interest in, Age, School of thought u belongs to, or u post some comments back to me... ect...)
If uptil now, this point is clear to u, than we can proceed further and U can follow me; otherwise; Please "STOP HERE"... DO NOT PROCEED... convince me first about your views in this regards... and I'll try to redirect my search based upon your views, others who understand this point can proceed...
In order to prove the above Subject; Selected for this Forum by Gypsy; I need to discuss few more things about the WORD G.O.D (God), we need to know that; how this WORD G.O.D (God) came into EXISTENCE in our dictionaries and from their to our Daily USE, This is another fact that any WORD we use in our daily life has some meanings/values based on our Custom, society, Location, Language and Believe; but when someone use the WORD G.O.D (God),Even though, he is referring to the One he believed that his Mighty Power; he has to define It's meanings using his own way of believes... because there is no Physical Evidence of GOD, so far, nor anyone has/had seen Him ever Before, till to date; October 07, 2007; all the meanings and explanation used by human being about GOD are self-explanatory and different among different groups/religions;
Since the WORD G.O.D (God) does Exists in our dictionaries, therefore, we can say that there was something un seen, superlative power, to someone or some group of people in early ages; who introduced the word "GOD" among the mankind; Maybe they felt, assumed, realized, invented, created, his word, whatsoever was the reason, my conclusion is that this WORD G.O.D "God", does exists in our Dictionaries; My Conclusion to this paragraph is Whether U believe in the WORD G.O.D (God) or not but infact it does exist in our dictionaries, and dictionaries doesn't belongs to any group or religion... therefore we can say that the WORD G.O.D (God) does EXISTS, who-ever denies this fact must have some solid contradictory grounds; and I would like to hear about your views in this regard, others who are Agreed to this conclusion; can proceed further with me...
Since we are agreed with the Existence of the WORD G.O.D (God), that the WORD God does exists in our world at least in dictionaries/books;
Now we need to know what is the Meaning of GOD?
Before I proceed further here... I have a QUESTION from ALL of YOU, I challenge every existing Human Being, through this Forum to give me the actual Meanings of the word "ODG" and "OGD"... REMEMBER this, that; these words "ODG" and "OGD" Can be used as an abbreviations to any name of the group/organization, What i need U 2 search and tell me the actual Meaning of OGD and ODG... ... ... ... Come on Guys how much time do u think u need 4 research... come back... These Words Does not Exists to carry any meaning within them, these words OGD and ODG are meaningless words and only can be used as an abbreviations to some group or Organizations, phrase... DESPITE of all these meaningless words "ODG" and "OGD" they do Exists among us... and some particular people and the people concerned to use these terms "ODG" and "OGD" for their own use and benefits... these words "ODG" and "OGD" has NULL value among the other Human Beings... my second conclusion is that these words "ODG" and "OGD" does not belong to any group / religion / organization / school to thoughts / or any philosopher... therefore anyone can use these abbreviations "ODG" and "OGD" to their own use and benefit, for an example I SAY HERE THAT OGD IS THE ABBREVIATIONS OF "ON GOOD DEEDS(OGD)" AND ODG IS THE ABBREVIATIONS OF "OVER DIZZY GOATS(ODG), is there anyone who have any ground to object my explanations to the words "ODG" and "OGD"? Anyone can use these words the way they feel is right, and who ever intends to deal with u must use and accept your terminology for "ODG" and "OGD", whereas if u come to me that u need to follow my terminology not others; my conclusion from this debate is that the WORD "ODG" and "OGD" has three Alphabets used in the Name of G.O.D (GOD) if we assume that when this word was invented/created, every human being used this word GOD for their own purpose and benefits differently when used in their own Language, Culture, Society, Religion, etc... therefore we find different names such as El/Elohim, Bhagawan, Allah, Holy Trinity/Ghost/Spirit, Jehovah, Zeus, Lord, Ishvar, OM, Khuda' and many more are the names used by different people, Groups, religions, Since the English is from one of the most widely spoken language of our time, so when people from other believes and areas translate the meaning of their Creator into English; they choose the most commonly translation used in English Language; which is GOD/Lord; (After the 9-11's brutal incident Allah is the most popular word after God/Lord, used among us), therefore my third Conclusion is that If one needs to know the meaning of GOD/Lord, he must have look into the other details/definition used by other religions and groups using under their Perspective; but the General meanings of God is the Creator of the Universe and Mankind, and the Crator of all the Creatures in this Universe, So if we are Discussing about the One who is the Creator of this Universe and Everything Existing here within this Universe is reffered to HIM, than we simply have reached the conclusion that God of all religion and Groups mentioned above, DOES EXISTS... ...
FINAL CONCLUSION;
THUS; THE DISCUSSION ABOUT THE EXISTENCE OF GOD DOES ENDS HERE; COZ THE NAME OR WORD GOD DOES EXIST FOR EVERY HUMAN BEING IN THEIR DICTIONARIES AND BOOKS; ONLY THE REAL EXISTENCE WAS QUESTIONED HERE; AND THE REAL EXISTENCE OF GOD IS PROVEN BY THE GROUPS/RELIGIONS WHO NAMED HIM TO BELIEVE HIM AS; EL, ALLAH, LORD, HOLY TRINITY, ISHVAR, BHAGAWAN, KHUDA' ZEUS, JEHOVAH, AND LOTS OF OTHER NAMES COMMONLY OR PRIVATELY USED BY DIFFERENT HUMAN BEINGS, ACTUALLY IS THE SAME WHEN TRANSLATED INTO ENGLISH; ALL THESE DIFFERENT NAMES OF GOD, IN DIFFERENT GROUPS AND CULTURES; AND THEIR NUMBER OF WORSHIPERS/BELIEVERS PROOVES THAT THE GOD DOES EXISTS TO BE PRAISED BY THE MANKIND;
ANSWER #2. BASED UPON ABOVE CONCLUSION WE CAN SAY THAT GOD DOES OT POSESS ANY RELIGION COZ RELIGION MEANS A GROUP OF WORSHIPER/PRACTITIONERS AND GOD DOES NOT FITS IN THIS CATEGORY TO WORSHIP/PRACTICE SOMEONE OR HIS OWN LAWS... IT IS DISCRIMINATORY TO GOD IF HE ADDOPT/SUPPORT ANY PARTICUALR RELIGION COZ HE IS THE LORD OF ALL MENKIND, AND HE SETS THE RULES AN REGULATIONS FOR THAT RELIGION, FOR THAT PARTICULAR PERIOD OF TIME/AREA/PEOPLE, UNLESS HIS FOLLOWER DOSEN'T MAKE BRING ANY MAJOR CHANGES/AMMENDMENTS IN THE RULE AND REGULATIONS OF THAT RELIGION; IF THE RELIGION'S LAW ARE PURE, AND BENEFITED TO HIM AND OTHER MENKIND, THEN GOD OWN THAT RELIGONS AND THEIR FOLLOWRS AS WELL; THEREFORE WE THE PEOPLE NEED TO BELONG WITH A RELIGION TO BELONG WITH GOD; GOD DOES NOT NEED TO BELONG TO THE RELIGION TO BELONG WITH US, COZ WE CAN NOT BE BENNIFITED TO GOD IN ANY MEANS... THAT'S ALL FOLKS FOR TODAY...
Finally I would like to add that after all these efforts writing all these here I still say that this is my personal point of View to the question about the existence of God?
if still someone is not Satisfied/agreed than I will try to use some other common examples around us, for that u need to ask me personally by messaging me, I assure u that I'll try not to seek any support from any religion/Group to Proove your Question. I appreciate your comments and views in this regard, pls update me as well, Thank You, Zafar Naqvi
Something along the lines of there is no power except in Allah the all powerful. It's a common expression used by Arabs to signify impatience. It is usually said in place of "counting to ten" in engligh to gather yourslef before a reply. At least that's my take on it....am I right Frog?
As for the OP...Gypsy hasn't posted in awhile, I got defensive because Adey, Skdkak, and others (me too) were throwing thoughts around when you made your comment. Still I like this thread and gave her credit for posting it. If you find it (and others of her posting) not to your liking, you can easily avoid them.
Stay safe all.
Perfection does not exist. The question therefore, is: what level of imperfection are we willing to settle for?
Millions of people used to Believe in Zeus and Odin, and we now are certain that they were wrong Canarybird....so it doesn't matter how many believe, its WHAT they believe in that counts.
And the fact that MOST people follow the ten commandments....which they themselves come from Hamurabi's code (thousands of years before Moses) should give you a clue about what is divine and what is man made.
But like I awlays say...whatever works for YOU (people in general).
Stay safe all.
Perfection does not exist. The question therefore, is: what level of imperfection are we willing to settle for?
Anybody care to explain what Froggy is upto and what is he trying to communicate. ""لا حول ولا قوة إلا بالله العلي العظيم ""
I thought he knew english a little time ago .. can't say anything now.
As I have refereed many many times in this forum.. when you try to put some logical and rational question to some characters ... they go into their shell and resort to many things, one of the example is above ...
""1)If you think its a waste of time to post in threads which contain so called rubbish questions...then why are you posting in it?
2)And even if you do think it's a rubbish question....maybe others don't....who made you the police of what we should consider rubbish or not?""
Chill dear. there are a lot of Frogs here who by nature live in a pond or a well . do not know the outside world. And when you try to show them a lake, sea or a river.. frogs cant digest there is something larger and better then the well it lives in.
These characters have a habbit of meddling in other's affairs without contributing anything whether for or against.
Ask these characters any academic question and they become blank..
Lets not dilute what we are discussing.. we have better things to discuss than frogs .. do not waste your energy on unwanted things.
One does not arrive at a stage where he says that he has the absolute truth. Hence, no one can speak of God in absolute terms, due to his human limitations. Man’s search for God is constant and continuous. This striving takes him one step closer to God every day.
Finally, God is the absolute, and we all deal with relative truth. All that we speak of religion, all that we speak of God, all that we speak of saints, everything is only relative. We can never be absolute in our expression of God. We can never comprehend Him, and even if we start to express it, we only create mistakes. That humility is needed in every religion, and every religious leader. Only God is absolute, and we all deal with relative truth. All our expressions, our methodologies, our dogmas, our rituals, and liturgies, are relative.
[img_assist|nid=28861|title=believe and u will see...Life is as simple as we make it complicated|desc=|link=none|align=left|width=122|height=180]
It's only a discussion people and it is more interesting than jibber jabber as many of QL participants have a very different view on God or religeon for that matter.
Throughout mankind people have believed in various Gods or idols to prevent them living without hope and as mentioned above security.
There are many things in the world that can't and don't have an explanation and which leaves room for serious doubt, however, don't you think is is a little mysterious that so many millions of people, whether Muslim or Christian believe in one God and that belief is carrying a great many followers who have not seen God but believe in him anyway.
We don't really know if God gave Moses the ten commandments but we do live our lives according to those commandments (most of us).
Under the motto seeing is believing is irrelevant in this case because we will believe what we want to whether we see it or not.
not to be worry frog. the writer not to be question now. i to be write all answer to gyspsy in morse code and writer gypsy to be still put head on wall bang bang to understand code. she to be say only what what what friendraj. hey hey hey !!!!
At the beginning I was commenting, but when I saw that the writer keeps on asking the same questions which are provoking more than anything else, I did speak out my heart. The so called writer did not accept critics and she started responding on a sarcastic tone....so what would you expect from me ? to stay in my corner? I prefer people who try to provide answers rather than those who keep on questioning anything and everything. Unfortunately this is the case for this thread author. Try to track her writing and you will see yourself : Asking about Marriage , religion, God pffffffffffff .
I'm spicing up the does God Exist thread, so now I want you to tell me that if he/she/it/what? does exist, what religion does ? belong to?
Then Prove it. Mawahahahahahaha.
No seriously, prove it.
IF THAT IS WHAT YOU CALL A SERIOUS THREAD , THEN I WOULD GO READ SOME JOKES FOR SURE, but before I would just tell you again: your posts are full of nonsense and you're making people lose their precious time in responding to such rubbish questions.
I find myslef unable to agree or disagree with you because i'm not understanding your point exactly.
Are you saying God does not exist because we made up the word? Obviously the words (language), the ink, the books themselves are all man made, but we are discussing if the message is too.
Do you think it was also made by man, or truly divinely inspired by a powerful creator who sent messengers?
Stay safe all.
P.S. No need to send me those lengthy copies of your posts in my PM, I can read the threads just fine.
Perfection does not exist. The question therefore, is: what level of imperfection are we willing to settle for?
While it MAY be true (or not, we are not certain)....it would seem to indicate that ANY belief will do.
After all, we have had (recorded human history) that predates the current incarnation of God by a few thousand years....and mankind survived.
But that is a great point....our belief in God now, does for us exactly what belief in older mythologies did for earlier humans....provide a security blanket for our fears.
But most believers today foam at the mouth when I call their religions mythologies too lol.
Also, I realize that a LOT of people need something to believe in, but not ALL do....i'm just fine admitting I don't know what comes after death (for example)....and i'm not immoral or evil (at least I hope not).
Stay safe all.
Perfection does not exist. The question therefore, is: what level of imperfection are we willing to settle for?
at least u can admit whatever u feel and what ur Instinct is guiding u towards... Therefore I have mentioned at the end that this is my point of view and I'm waiting for your approval otherwise if anyone has any objection than he must raise his objection particularly to the topic by explainig me in details what he is objecting and What is the Reason> then I'll try my level best to answer again..
U have proved your point of view and you are in agreement with all that you have written.
But theoritically writing and assuming does not prove anything. We are just trying to put some thoughts here and are guaging what common people have thoought about God.
When all of us agree with it or with any or all that you just wrote - then only can u cnclude "DOES EXISTS... ..."
Just by ur concluding nothing happens. All have to agree with you
Peace on all of U; hello skdkak and ragnarock.. how r u guys today... hope better... enjoy the reading and keep posting here.... i'll be back for the update, after 3 hrs from now. thanks
Very enlightening thus far Adey and Skdak (and everyone else), but I fear the question of God(s)'s existence will never be agreed upon by everyone.
Either you choose logic and go the athiest's way, or you go with faith and believe...but in all my years of discussing this, it ALWAYS boils down (eventually) to: It's god's word, who do you think you are that you know more than god!
I guess we all know which side of the debate i'm on....but in the end, to each his own...and I cannot stress this enough....as long as you let everyone Chose what works for them!!!
Stay safe all.
Perfection does not exist. The question therefore, is: what level of imperfection are we willing to settle for?
that creatures are all the same is WRONG- they are not all the same. Crocodiles for example are different depending where in the world they are. Why did a creator make different 'drawings' of them?
Darwin's theory of natural selection is a well supported 'theory' but evolution is a fact- you can actually see it at the virus level, do you think 'god' just alters viruses to be drug resistant to punish us?
In that case 'god' is still creating, so it didn't take 6 days as two of 'his' books say.
Thus 'his' books are contradictory and as god is infallible then these cant be 'his' books or 'his WORD'.
Thus you cant use these books as evidence for god.
So what other proof you got?
I don't go to mythical places with strange men.
-- Douglas Adams, The Long Dark Tea-Time of the Soul.
1. If u read the topic again ""does God Exist thread..." we started with if (IF) God exists.
2. we are trying to go cronologically. When u agree God exists then only can we go ahead and discuss the second part ""what religion does ? belong to?""
Can u decide which topic we should discuss, coz we were discussing Which Religion God Belongs too and now we r discussing about the exsistece of the God, and How? Come on My Dear... Pick Your Topic, I believe in this case We must Choose Exsistence of God, since exsistence is not proven, how cum V can Jump to discuss God and His Religion
if i ask all of u to draw a pictre or write down an essay, do u think that you can draw identically ideal pictures and write same essay using same wordings as others, I believe it is not possible for any ordinary Human Being, if some special people, try to Draw an Identical Pictre then there must be a dispute among them claiming which picture belogs to whome because both pictures ar identical, whereas all the Creatures in this Universe, and their species are Identicaly same, lets say picture of Palm Tree and write an essay on Palm tree.. There Picture's size, colors, combinations, number of scatches, amout of time to complete, will be different... and anyother can tell the difference between both pictures even though both had drawn palm tree on a paper..similarly both explaining about palm tree, but using their own words/sentences... whereas We don't see any difference in this Universe among any CREATURES, which leads us to the conlusion that thir must be ONLY ONE CREATOR who created them so perfectly.. have u seen a body without face? meaning, that the face is the only part of our body which differenciate us among eachother, circulation of our solar system around their orbit gravity for US but tree grows against gravity Y? lots of these questions and their answers leads us towars the ONE CREATOR OF ALL THESE CREATURES AND UNIVERSE. Coz we don't See any difeerence/conflict and trouble in this World. therefore, based on this, we can asume that their is Only One Creator, who is the Creator of Eyerything, us and around us,;
The whole World's been waiting for such proof since man first thought up the idea. and we are still waiting.
I don't need to prove he/she/it doesn't exist, as you don't need to prove a negative, the same way I don't need to prove that Santa Claus, fairies, or Unicorns don't exist.
I don't go to mythical places with strange men.
-- Douglas Adams, The Long Dark Tea-Time of the Soul.
There r two meanings of this Question let me start with first one; Do U know what is the meaning of Religion; I believe Religion means "A Group or Set Of Common Belivers and practitioner;" if I am right than allow me that i can explain u more here but it seems good enough for wise people. Therefore, my friend, No one can Associate God with any particular Religion b/Coz Religion Belongs to Group and God meant to be EQUAL for all mankind. 2nd answer is; .. God Can not Belong to any religion, coz he will be confined in a particular group, can be questioned and measured by others according to the believes he posess, therefore God can not become a beliver/follower of any Religion, even His Own, and the one whome can be questioned, measured and confined in a Group can not be god, thus, the question is irrelevant...
Now let me change my own answer entirely different way and perspective; eventhough, if we study different religions, we will not find even one example in which someone(prophecies) narrated anything from the God that He said that He like this Particular Religion, infact He does said that He like the group of people who refrain thereselves from evil, who helps needy, dosen't steal, rape, lie and kill innocent; etc... Meaning, anyone who dosen't harm anyother creatures INCLUDING HIS SELF, is blessed by God, and God called them from a set of belivers/Followers of God; God named and called those set of peoples differently on different ocasions, but the meaning of all names are same; those names are; People, Believers, Student, Followers, Peace Lovers, Surrender of their Souls, properties, families when required/needed by God beliver society's law, Fighter against any agression til it ends, Fighter - to bring peace, justice and harmony among Menkind, Figters against their own sins, protector of Mankind, peace, obedience, is the set rules for this group of peoples; eventhough God named these set of Group differently but He never said that He is a part of this Group. HE (God) said that these Criterias are for your own good, if u want to live peacefully, my dear, If we are from this set of people mentioned above then God dosen't need to join us coz He is the One Who sets these rules and regulations for menkind, for our own benefits, Not to become Beliver/Follower of His Own Rules...
"Even an atheist is somehow related to religion. When an atheist opposes God, he/she is indirectly accepting there is God. You cannot be opposing something when there isn't anything."
But boy, are you SOOOO WRONG!!! You have missed the whole point completely, which god am I accepting Odin, Jesus, Allah, Shiva, God, Wicca, etc etc???
I don't oppose god/s, that would make me a Satanist. When I have proof of any god I will believe. There are, and I can't stress this more strongly, NO SUCH THINGS AS GODS.
See, you are still trapped in the bubble of 'if there is no creator, then who made all of this/us'?
A-Theist means NO SUPERNATURAL GODS/CREATORS.
Sorry just to put you right on a few things, wasn't shouting just emphasizing. :-)
Peace
I don't go to mythical places with strange men.
-- Douglas Adams, The Long Dark Tea-Time of the Soul.
I never said to scrap and do away with religion. Follow what you feel good and do not impose ur religion on others. Live and let live.
And stop derograting other faiths and religion.
I was listening to FM qatar about a month back. Islam was being preached (not a bad idea) but along with it hinduism / christanity and all other possible religions was being referred and their existence being questioned. I mean - this is state sponsored preaching a particular religion and at the same time saying all sorts of things about others.
You will find such people in a TON and more than that here and elsewhere in QL too.
"some people stressing on a particular religion / faith being the best and the only one to follow. For them all other religions are satanic religions and all non-believers (READ - not following a particular religion) will go to hell.
if u are good - u have heaven here on earth itself. and if u do bad - ur hell is also here. U (not in particular you in person) dont have to actually look forward what happens to ur body and soul after u are gone."
So the answer (to get back to the OP) is do away with all religion and just be. And try to be good. :-)
I don't go to mythical places with strange men.
-- Douglas Adams, The Long Dark Tea-Time of the Soul.
U are following what u are born into and I am following what I am born into. Same case with all of us.
What I am saying is all lead to same goal only means and the way is different. I was only referring w.r.t some people stressing on a particular religion / faith being the best and the only one to follow. For them all other religions are satanic religions and all non-believers (READ - not following a particular religion) will go to hell.
if u are good - u have heaven here on earth itself. and if u do bad - ur hell is also here. U (not in particular you in person) dont have to actually look forward what happens to ur body and soul after u are gone.
To some extent all religions are irrational. Its how man has interpreted the books and teachings. Most of the religious customs (of any and all religions and faiths) on this planet are man made.
Even an atheist is somehow related to religion. When an atheist opposes God, he/she is indirectly accepting there is God. You cannot be opposing something when there isn't anything.
We say mankind started from XYZ... date depending upon which religion you belong to.
Was God insane before he sent his/her first / last messenger and all of them in between. (messengers of all religions are included - i am not targetting any particular religion).
What did he think before God'd first messenger came here.
What were humans following before a particular messenger came.
If we think any one particular religion is pure and all other religions are not what God is related to, then my friend God has done lot of mistakes and still doing one.
he sent his 1st messenger - then he/ she thought it needs to be updated and revised.
He continued correcting his/her mistakes and is still not perfected as to what his created mankind should follow.
My assumption is GOD / ALLAH / BHAGWAN / etc etc are a bunch of ....... somewhere and look down on earth for what they have created and enjoy the fun between themselves.
that all religions have to be by their very nature irrational then?
In the OP it says "prove it" It's up to religions to prove god, I'm just giving them the opportunity - so far no one has.
The typical 'religious' devotee believes in something they cant prove and then cries off for protection quoting 'sacred' texts which again offer no proof.
This debate goes way over the head of most religious followers, but those like PM, DG and army001 at least investigate what they believe and for that they have my respect. I still think they are wrong.
One of my friends was struggling to become a Muslim, after having been brought up a Roman Catholic, and we often read and debated what was in the Quran. When his father died he could not square what it said about life after death in both religions and he came to the conclusion there was no such thing as god if these were supposed to be his revelations. He began to use the brain that has been developed over eons. At least he used it, whatever conclusion he came to(god/no god/which religion)was a choice and not blind faith without evidence. The indoctrination (here's the controversial bit) of children is a form of child abuse IMHO , and it impairs critical thinking for life when it comes to religion. It's very difficult to entirely break free from it, some people disown all religions but remain deists i.e. that there is a creator of the universe but it has had no interaction with humans, does not intervene in the world and in fact does not care. But most find it difficult to break away from the idea of of a creator.
Reading your post again you may well be agreeing with me, cant really tell. :-)
Peace
I don't go to mythical places with strange men.
-- Douglas Adams, The Long Dark Tea-Time of the Soul.
Cool Down My Dear Skdkak... paitence is the key to the knowlege, through your brain to Command your heart, under the Natures Law, if U understand the Meanig of this... U'll find ll the answers ... chill bro.. got to go now... c ya.. chat with u guys later.. bye
if not then I'm posting here below... I didn't ask anything about an Atomic Bomb, it's used as an example to prove the Questioner's Question about GOD... and your concern about people bringing Islam in their Discussion..
Surely, Everyone who is gonna read my question, their INSTINCT immediately tells them that I,(Zafar) seems very stupid to ask such question here, because No one on this forum has any knowledge about the Assembly of an Atomic Bomb, and if for instance there is one who is capable to answer my question will not answer this question to me... because He don't know how knowledgeable I am to handle his answer... so Y i asked something, which I'm not supposed to ask, and Y people are posting their Blogs here since we all are not capable to discuss GOD and His Exsistence... the Only reason i'm discussing here is that God Allowed Mankind to Discuss HIS Exsistence and Qualities, but once those r proven to us then we r bound to respect and follow... so if u asked the question from everyone then u'll get the answer u asked for
Szafar: I do not understand why u are asking me abt the knowledge of making a A.B..b. We had our first blast of it in 1974 and surely had the knowledge since 1964.
There is a lot of this knowledge in this region. Why don't u ask ur friends in Iran / Iraq (was supposed to have it as per uncle Sam) / even pakistan has it (thanks to their neighbour China and a friend korea)..
After our blast long back.. we do not read the latest about it as we have delegated this job to very good people. we just live happily (if we are allowed to do so).
Gypsy: Your forum is going in all possible directions but not where it is supposed to. I would be a spectator from now on and only comment if there is a good suggession from a good soul..
Surely, Everyone who is gonna read my question, their INSTINCT immediately tells them that I,(Zafar) seems very stupid to ask such question here, because No one on this forum has any knowledge about the Assembly of an Atomic Bomb, and if for instance there is one who is capable to answer my question will not answer this question to me... because He don't know how knowledgeable I am to handle his answer... so Y i asked something, which I'm not supposed to ask, and Y people are posting their Blogs here since we all are not capable to discuss GOD and His Exsistence... the Only reason i'm discussing here is that God Allowed Mankind to Discuss HIS Exsistence and Qualities, but once those r proven to us then we r bound to respect and follow... so if u asked the question from everyone then u'll get the answer u asked for
Hot or cold potato.. that i do not know but whenever u try discuss any damn thing under the sun with a muslim and he is unable to answer ur rational questions in a proper and rational and logical point of view.. he will surely take support of Islam and try to prove it to u somehow.. And if u r a non-muslim, u do not have an option but to shut ur ears or argue..
A proper discussion then is thrown to garbage.
No hard feelings to any muslim (My closest and greatest freinds are muslims and have great regards to them and their religion).
threfore, people take the support of thier religion, when their Ego tells them that he is about to fall down, so instead of accepting his defeat and surrendering to brighter thoughts, he/they stood against their INSTINCT, and try to USE the Boundries and Pilars of thier Faith, by knowingly that others will not question any religion's Boundries and It;s Foundation/Pillars..
you are 100% correct. As this is the forum for discussion and regarding ur second last post - I felt u are going in a direction which does not fit ur personality (that u have created) and surely does not fit into this forum. so was my reply.
To answer your question: It's because most (and I am aware that I am generalizing) Muslims in this area have not had access to Comparative Religious Studies. As most (generalizing again) non-Muslims have, then our common point of focus and discussion is Islam.
Hope that answers your question.
Peace
I don't go to mythical places with strange men.
-- Douglas Adams, The Long Dark Tea-Time of the Soul.
I was almost loging off, but saw ur post, decided to come back.. Dear SKDKAK We r not discussing any religion here, what we r discussing is "What is the Religion of God", though the answer is very simple, which i already answered earlier in my post, but i took very long run to come to the Conclusion and i didn't seek support from any faith, religion, and book references in my posts, because God Belongs to all menkind, It is only Menkind who does not belongs to the GOD... I am not draging this topic to prove any religion specially Islam, because God Does not belongs to Muslims only; let me add one thing here for your kind information and Knowledge that. All the Religions including ISLAM are the best religions to follow, but their followers are the worst examples on the face of earth. it is only the follower who made changes and braught ammendments to his religion believes, they have changed the norms and values of the religion to fulfill their needs. and we the follower let them do these changes, because we belive in hem most rather than God, their is no problem in any religion to follow .. all religion leads u towads God; the only secret is we need to follow the religion 100% acoording to their Teachings...
Have we heard Christanity, Hinduism, Buddhism, Zoorashtraism or any other religious words and meanings written in this forum.
I have not seen any of the above religious topics discussed or referred to in detail and in depth. But what I can see here and in many many many more topics in QL that Islam being preached and referred to in length.
SZafar... You seemed to be a very logical and rational person. But sorry to say.. u too are going in the expected direction.
This is not the problem with you but a lot of guys get Islam in one or the other form in any topic whether it be religious topics / national topics or any other.
In the path of searching the true values set for menkind, one must not believe on anyone and anything until it's proven to him by his own instinct, because the human INSTINCT never lies... coz it's not under our control I'ts called Nuf-se-Ammara and Nuf-se-Sue... if we follow our own instinct without any prejudice, then it will be lot easier for us to Understand the possibilities to Answer the Question "in which Religon God should belongs too" you will get the answer by using your own instinct knowledge.
Gypsy; What has happend to ur forum. Guys have forgotten the real topic to discuss abt God and it existence and religion.. but I can see lot of things writen. One thing that I could see is Terrorist and terrorism.
Now that we are in this topic.. Let me inform.. there was a report in One national daily news paper of India as below.... And it is impt. for all.
""Today in Mumbai Mirror (India) Daily, it is written that so many terrorists and under world people has got connecting through orkut. Like Dawood Ibrahim,Chotta Shakkil ....so many people are getting new man power through Orkut only. The IB (Intelligent Beureau) has started their investigations. So please reduce the contacts through Orkut.
It is usual that we receive friend request from unknown people. But if
you actually do not know that person it is good to reject that request.
Because, if one terrorist is found by Police, his entire friend's list
will be carefully followed. And if you are there, you also will be in trouble.
So be careful! Also forward it to all your friends.
You may be thinking that why these people are adding so many friends
through orkut. It is simply because to mislead the Police. When Police get a huge friend list they will be concentrating on them.
They may be innocent people. At that time the real terrorists can
escape. So friends, please forward this information to all you know.""
I'm sorry Mr. Ram U've missed the answer earlier, I already answered this question in the begining and i would like to give u the answer again in detail: Since the value of this question ends automatically when someone asked about the religion of God? for an example let me tell u the story; A Mosquito complains against Wind in the Court of SULEMAN stating that Wind, Blows him away and bother's him in flying too much, Soleman Called The Wind to testify, when wind came... U Know what happened again? Mosqito disapears again... Wind blow him away, and the Case was dismissed automatically, since the Complainant was not there anymore... let me come to the point; There r two meanings of this Question let me start with first one; Do U know what is the meaning of Religion; I believe Religion means "A Group or Set Of Common Belivers and practitioner;" if I am right than allow me that i can explain u more here but it seems good enough for wise people. Therefore, my friend, No one can Associate God with any particular Religion b/Coz Religion Belongs to Group and God meant to be EQUAL for all mankind. 2nd answer is; .. God Can not Belong to any religion, coz he will be confined in a particular group, can be questioned and measured by others according to the believes he posess, therefore God can not become a beliver/follower of any Religion, even His Own, and the one whome can be questioned, measured and confined in a Group can not be god, thus, the question is irrelevant...
Now let me change my own answer entirely different way and perspective; eventhough, if we study different religions, we will not find even one example in which someone(prophecies) narrated anything from the God that He said that He like this Particular Religion, infact He does said that He like the group of people who refrain thereselves from evil, who helps needy, dosen't steal, rape, lie and kill innocent; etc... Meaning, anyone who dosen't harm anyother creatures INCLUDING HIS SELF, is blessed by God, and God called them from a set of belivers/Followers of God; God named and called those set of peoples differently on different ocasions, but the meaning of all names are same; those names are; People, Believers, Student, Followers, Peace Lovers, Surrender of their Souls, properties, families when required/needed by God beliver society's law, Fighter against any agression til it ends, Fighter - to bring peace, justice and harmony among Menkind, Figters against their own sins, protector of Mankind, peace, obedience, is the set rules for this group of peoples; eventhough God named these set of Group differently but He never said that He is a part of this Group. HE (God) said that these Criterias are for your own good, if u want to live peacefully, my dear, If we are from this set of people mentioned above then God dosen't need to join us coz He is the One Who sets these rules and regulations for menkind, for our own benefits, Not to become Beliver/Follower of His Own Rules... NEED MORE>..??
"If we have reached the Conlusion; that there is only one Creator of this universe, so pls let me know that i shold go ahed and discuss who that creator might be?"
All this time and u were proofing that there is only one creator ..
Please concentrate in the topic question.. what religion does GOD belong to? and how u can proof it .. don't deviate to other topics or people are rally going to get bored .. if u have a point then please share it with us .. if ur have other points non-related to our topic as corne suggested u can open a new thread to discuss it ..
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http://www.showcaseyourmusic.com/LittleGuitarist
"Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake."
If we have reached the Conlusion; that there is only one Creator of this universe, so pls let me know that i shold go ahed and discuss who that creator might be?
take an example of two people,, any religon and group u choose... give them a task to draw any one picture, lets say picture of Palm Tree and write an essay on Palm tree.. There Picture's size, colors, combinations, number of scatches, amout of time to complete, will be different... and anyother can tell the difference between both pictures even though both had drawn palm tree on a paper..similarly both explaining about palm tree, but using their own words/sentences... whereas We don't see any difference in this Universe among any CREATURES, which leads us to the conlusion that thir must be ONLY ONE CREATOR who created them so perfectly..
Let me Phrase this way if every one is reading and believing the same I'm writing down, I believe there will be no conflict among any of us and everyone can say that they are right,.. Repeat this Loudly pls...
My Dad is beter than any other person in the world
when I say my dad against ur dad, conflict starts here when i give my judgement on someone's dad, basically, our nature dosen't allow anyone to give judgement on someone's private matter... so pls refrain
MY question to U pls read carefully; especially Cornellian, I'm sorry about my French,
if i ask all of u to draw a pictre or write down an essay, do u think that we can draw identically ideal pictures and write same essay using same wordings, I believe it is not possible for any ordinary Human Being, if some special Human Being, try to Draw an Identical Pictre then there must be a dispute among them claiming which picture belogs to whome, whereas all the Creatures in this Universe, and their species are Identicaly same, have u seen a body without face? meaning, that the face is the only part of our body which differenciate us among eachother, circulation of our solar system around their orbit gravity for US but tree grows against gravity Y? lots of these questions and their answers leads us towars the ONE CREATOR OF ALL THESE CREATURES AND UNIVERSE. Coz we don't See any conflict and trouble in this World.
God will be Exsisted automaticall to all Mankind, when we start denouncing terrorist, one can not find and see God, if someway he/we/they supports terrorism, either, financialy, morally, by voting and electing them, or anyotherway, it's mean we/he/they can not find the exsistence of GOD, Because God created this univers, BALANCED, and Peaceful for all the creatures on this planet
Religion is "supposed" to bring peace and harmony, unfortunately religion is the reason most wars happen, and alot of hatred is formed. It's not that religion tells us to kill others, but human interpretation and ego leads to it. It's kinda like my dad is better than ur dad argument.
Wheter U call yourself Muslim, Jews, Hindu, Christian etc,.. or u believe none of them, but U R A HUMAN BEING, for being a Human Being we all love peaceful atmosphere around us, so Y we r Discussing Religion, which is not harmful to eachother, instead of Bringing Peace and Harmony among the MANKIND
Gypsy...shhhhh....I just said that so that he wouldn't go on explaining! hehe.
SZ, I would love to continue arguing about terrorism and muslim consent and all that, but it's off topic, so open a new thread and we can debate it there.
Do u think that 1% can survive without the support of 99%, I am one of 99%, and everyday i denounce everybrutal act commited by anyone, If We 99% don't allow and give excess to these 1%, I assure U my friend, it will take only one NINO second to bring peace in our region and in this world...
I said Osama Bin laden and his followers are the true examples of those terrorist who Called theirselves Muslims of that time, but Killed other Muslims brothers, women and Children, even killed Prophecies and their Progney... But Y the Muslims of TODAY Do not Denounce their Brutal act, and their So called leadership... eventhough Everyone knows those Murderors, but most of the Muslims call their names very respectfully...
Terroist or terrorism supporter where ever they are must be brought to Justice, because they r destroying the peace of all the mankind. if u know anyone around u, U must try to stop THEM... easy way or hard way, choice is yours... If u do not stop them, means U r with them and there is no space for u in ISLAM because Islam is for Peace not for Distruction. Let me Rephrase again, ALL THE MANKIND (PEACELOVER) WHATEVER RELIGION OR GROUP THEY BELONGS TO IF THEY ARE PEASE LOVER THEN THEY ARE UNDER THE FLAG OF ISLAM, DESPITE OF THEIR DIFFERENCES.
before I refresh your memory about Islam, i want u to know that I Belong to ISLAM (PEACE)
There are 124 thousands prophisies in Islam and Most of the Prophits were Brutally assasinated and tortured within the same nation they preached... eventhough the Last Prophet and His Progney was Brutally assacinated by the SO-Called Muslims of That Time, Now a days People Like Osama and his belivers/followers are the true example's of those so called muslims... Can U explain which Islam U r talking about... ?
Ok I started reading some of "the prophet"'s posts but my brain couldn't handle the nonsense anymore. Sorry.
As for Alexa's comment, there's alot of hypocrisy here. Alot of people only talk about religion but only few actually follow it. If everyone here followed Islam properly, things would've been much different.
I don't see anything wrong with this thread. Don't you sit by yourself and ask:
- Why God is a male not a female?
- What is spirit? And why when the Creator claims it back, we rot and decay?
- What it means when you’re alone and find yourself singing, as if you hear some music in your head? Do we have jukebox installed in us?
- Was Jesus beautiful?
- Why some people only know god existed when they've seen death with their own eyes, but were saved?
- Humans have 5 clear senses, but what is the sense of guilt???
- Why Quran is in Arabic?
- Why there is abject poverty if god promised to support his creation?
- Where god came from and when?
- What is this guiding inner voice you hear often, but you don’t see it shaped in any form you can recognize?
- What is conscience and where it exists in your body?? How do you weigh it?
- God appears to believers in different shapes and speak to them all in their languages, how can he accommodate and master all that without a flaw?
- What does god want from us, he is all powerful and needs no one, yet his remembrance is the feast for believers?
- What do we mean by soul searching? Where is that huge space we dig into to search, if our bodies dimensions are less than 2X1 (height and width in meters)?
- Why do we say my aching heart is broken? Although science (lab) shows it is pumping and pulsing!
This thread's mean purpose is to invoke criticism of other's religion so I am gonna stay away from it and keep my thoughts to myself. I respect all religion and believe that people have the right to live and practice their faith freely and athesits also have the same rights just like other religious believers
Anmials posess knowledge and power, way before we gain ours, when we born or came to exsistence in this universe these mamals (moter in animals) respected our presnce among them and tells other animals to respect us as well. they didn't bother u at all since u were born/hopeless, now since u r in power u need to help them too and don't bother them as well... Misconduct is our behaviour with them...
if one come and go with his own choice than he could decide which direction should he go, Since We didn't choose where to born and Die, therefore still we can not decide which direction we might go. but there is another fact. if one need to go somewhere, he sets his points from A - Z he starts from A and Ends at Z... whatever comes in between are the temporary stopover or resting places... coz our ultimate goal is to reach Z from our starting point A...If one in this Universe has st his points then he/they can find the answer theirselves very easily... Have u set your points of directions?...
If u have ever supported/agreed or feel proud to discuss any Misconduct or behavior(whatever is the Extent), eventhough with Mammals too, than believe me one day Nature will bring justice on you and will do the same to you, it dosen't matter how good or bad we R no one is allowed to do unjust, only deal with him according to his act, and up to the extent that they deserve not a single penny more... No Excuse
I mean any sexoffender, male or female, place your male/female loveone into the car and think again what would u say now...
if one still think that act is ok then i must dare to place your motheer in that place and now think and tell me how much is your blood presure now... I'm Sory .. Just an example, anyone's mother is my mother and I can not diferrenciate between mothers the most respected personality after any Creator.
Do U still call that homosexual, a Teacher or he was pretending as a teacher, and posses no qualit for being in that possision... we leave our children to their trust that they'll help us raising our children with us, better in our Society... Since we all are crimnals that's why we talk about that homosexual, and we still called his as a TEACHER, if we r truthful to ourselfes then we must punish to that homosexual so harshly that no one cn even dare to think to look at someone's child... but once again since we all are criminal therefore we criticize someone's act but by enjoying it... SO SHAME FOR MANKIND...
just round the corner, it was closest and it was free. When I was older the French teacher got caught having sex in the back of her car with two 15yr old boys during lunch break.
My school closed 8yrs after I left
Much like an organised religion really.
And thats a true story.
I don't go to mythical places with strange men.
-- Douglas Adams, The Long Dark Tea-Time of the Soul.
this is my picture, Indeed, One need to discuss the truth, must not conseal his self and Identity, hiding yourself means that u r not truthful... purposely U can Conseal yourself, in order to protect from being disclosed to some un seen danger,, Yes it's ok...
#4. We had authurity to discuss about school and it's policies prior to entering the school, now we cann not differ with them if still someone intends to differ with school's policies and it's authorities, either he must leave the School or he will be expelled, So Point No. 4 is if one need to object on God's Exsistence, either he has to Leave his World/Universe or he will be Expelled by his CREATOR (GOD)
To study in this world there r two many schools around us I mean for us and our children. there is one thing COMMON. we choose our shool by ourselves, we decide where to go, how to pay, what to study, what will be the outcome/end result of the study. let me begin here step by step here for better understanding and remember only talk about mutual and common grounds among mankind, at this point, pls. do not discuss ur faith with me...
step #1. we have absolute authority and power to choose our shool, we try to match our standard of living with the school in order to compete in the society;
#2. We set the Goal/achievments in our mind after the completion of the school (rewards), therefore we choose our own subjects/majors,
#3. we need to prove the school authority that we are capable of joining you by giving an aptitude exam and by paying their Fees.
#.4 once we enter/join our school, we loose all our rights to discuss about the school, raising any issue against the school and it's policies, we do not have the power to change any teacher or princpal of the school, all we have to do is follow our teachers and to succeed weneed to pass the exam... NO ONE CAN SAY THAT HE PAID every month and he is entitled to jump into another grade, one can not even jump grades in shool without giving an exam, how can u people talk about GOD, and u r not even entered into the bouries of HIS SCHOOL..
Dude, we have no idea what are you talking about. And I can you for a fact that no one even bothers reading your posts, cos at least I tend to overlook at your lines. So please don't bother yourself putting in so much of efforts.
Well said. I guess thats why we all are quite content following religions that we do.
I FEEL, we have been brought up getting convinced that our religion is the right or true religion. It is drilled into us to such an extent that most of us even fail to look beyond and try to accept that the other religion could equally make sense. By saying this, I don't mean to say that God belongs to any particular religion.
Religion has been so much tied up with God that we just cannot think of non-existence of any religion, it sort of means that you don't believe in existence of God totally.
250,000 years since humans came into being, isn't it amazing to imagine that more than half of the world's population is actually deprieved of God's "True" religion, with due respect to whatever religion a person is following. I do not have proper statistics of wolrd population based on religion, but am pretty sure that no religion actually exceeds 50% of world's population. So which means that does God actually want majority of his creations on planet earth to burn in hell or be on the ignorant side? Shouldn't at least the majority have been on the right side 250,000 years on?
1. mankind is not allowed and capable of lifting their both legs in the air at the same time. the energy/power we posess in our body to run, if someday we get sick, meaning we can loose some of our powers either to move, talk, think, eat, speak etc... or may be toatl failure of power,one can not genrate his own powers, how com he is capable of generating any rules and regulation about any religion.
2. wahatever we have around us is invented by mankind, none of the things are been created my mankind, coz they were pre exsited and we just invent them... if we r inventors than who is the CREATOR. and where he/they r?
At last!!, I've found my prophet! I have no idea what you're talking about but it has that unfathomable religious thing going on. I will follow you to the end of my days. he he :-)
1,2,3...."I was lost but now I'm found"
I don't go to mythical places with strange men.
-- Douglas Adams, The Long Dark Tea-Time of the Soul.
I'm not getting personal with anyone, I'm just answering ur queries by using the common INFORMATION available around us, I don't want to raise any issues, discussed/proven by any religion or school of thaughts earlier, because those are ther's not ours and GOD is ours, for everyone, if he is not for everyone, than this is Discremination to us, and Discreminator can not be a god...
My Question to al of U, When u was born, Do u able to Speak? What Knowledge u posess at that time, do u remeber anything? etc... if the answer is none of the above... then answer me how u gain Knowledge, if someone told u about, than it's not knowledg, it's a transfermation of words, if u read to know anything than, u r not knowledgeable... if one don't know about what is KNOWLEDGE, how cum he talk about GOD, THE MOST KNOWLEDGEABLE
when we use term PERSON it's mean someone,... that someone/person has their own desires, fellings, and interest as we all have ours, if someone claim hisself god, then there must be a conflict between u and him. IF U CAN CREATE CONFLICT WITH ANYONE, THAT ANYONE CAN NOT BE god BECAUSE HE IS NOT EVEN CAPABLE OF RESOLVING DISPUTE. one can not resolve a simple disput can not become god, so my dear any person can not be a god.
So far, the Menkind are the Most powerful force on this universe. and The Animals are least fowerful than the menkind... AM I Right??? So Think and Think... Y the Animal's baby is so Strong than a Menkind, that whenever they born, They Born With knowledge, Power, Sight, Smell, I mean that they Born with Complete Powers, that they need to survie in this world, They born with the Knowledge, what to Eat, Where to Go, how To Walk and Talk. etc.. whereas, a Human Baby is So Hopeless, couldn't able to move, drink, think, see, talk.. No powers at all ... Do U know Y?
Who told u that religion are made by man kind ??? ohhh people i really don't know how do u believe in those things .. do u think that the human being were able to put rules to this world .. I'm not convinced with that point .. u r free to believe in wut u believe and i believe in wut i believe ..
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http://www.showcaseyourmusic.com/LittleGuitarist
"Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake."
Religion runs by Followers, and Follower is not powerful enough and Capable to call himself god. so your point "Which religion GOD follows", the answer is follower cn not become god, since he is a follower. therefore GOD does / Can not not Posess any religion.
U must respect others Views, whatsoever... coz respecting their Views will not harm U at all... so Y disrespect?... Never get personal coz getting personal means U R not thinking properly and u need a treatment.
Ok too much reading for a Friday morning (my day just started :P)...so..
I believe that God does exist. My proof (and it convinces me, doesn't have to convince u all) is science. Most people would tend to believe that "God" and science are contradictory, but I don't think so. Let's start with the Big Bang theory...how did it start ? expansion of energy, but where did this energy come from ? Something must have created it because it can't create itself...and here's where God comes into play.
What religion does he belong to? None because God didn't create religion, man kind did. So if he doesn't belong to any religion, why I am following the religion that I am ? Well cause different religions have slightly different teachings (even though they're all based on the same fundementals)and I like the teachings of my religion, they make sense to me and the stuff that dont make sense I question them till I understand. So that's why I follow it :-)
This Goat vs Dog, +/- are the true natural examples around us, I put these examples because all the Belevers and Non belivers of any religion believes in these facts and can not DENY to the Nature of this TRUTH... so since we r Discussing GOD, we should use common examples to reach who could be a GOD, and HOW he posess this Possesion... It's kind of way of Investigation of any story, by reporter, and crime by Agency... it's called Investigation
Searching for the truth. Still lot to be revealed, and believed accordingly (as per the unseen rules set forth around us by the nature...). there will be no conflict among anyone if they attend same school, same class, wear same uniform, and speak same language. this world will become heaven-on-Earth. its very easy and simple.
Look around u, there are at least two very popular animals among us, just take an example of a dog/Cat vs Goat/sheep, lets talk about Dog/Cat First: these animals are the most beloved animals by human on our planet; 96% off the population Don't eat Dogs/Cats instead 50% raise them and take good care of them. Their Birth ratio is much higher than a Goat/Sheep, they even live longer than Sheep/Goat, in the other hand, 80% of our population eat Goat/Sheep, 19% raise or care about them, but their numbers are growing everyday, whereas, despite of all love and care, dog/cat won't grow like Goat/Sheep, dog only Gather, when they need to attack their opponents, despite of their brutal and deadly act against their opponents, human love them very much, and ignore their Nature to Kill... Goat/Sheep always lives together in a CLAN under Leadership, they even jump from one end to the other after their Leader, there will be lot i can add here the reason of this example is that this is the way of differentiating between Right & Wrong, Good & Bad, Halal & Haram, Halal things, Right things, and Good things always Lives Togather & Longer, Never stays apart, eventhough u kill them, their number grows, higher everyday, Haram is Haram, we haven't seen their Clan, it dosen't matter how u take care and preserve them, U can not succeed ever, to have them sit down on one ground, eventhough all of the universe make one Coalision Force under One Flag, when they have fillfilled their stomatch after brutally snatching their opponents, they will disburse again, till further ATTACK.
So U can say that, all the evil Forces belongs to One CLAN and all the Good Nature Belongs to one CLAN, their is nothing inbetween, now ask yourself WHICH CLAN U SUPPORT AND BELONGS TO;
The reason of my point is ur discussion about GOD... therefore If I join U guys, then I must Introduse myself and the community in which i live... if we become a member of the community than we can discuss GOD, and I'll be happy to share my VIEWS with u too...
to know this answer, One must understand Who he is, and where he stands, One can not Understand his self, sould not posess the right to discuss about other's specially GOD.
Thank U for Inviting me here, since ur msg was private, I would like to keep ur name private... unless u disclose yourself... by the way my name is Zafar Naqvi
hello Guys, I said Hello + Guys, Because I don't know what is your daily practice, to introduce yourself to others (Salam, Namaste, Good Morning, Ola, Kamosta... Bla, bla, bla...)and what is your gender, Male Female there is nothing inbetween, One who don't exsist in Male and Female Category, is actually a Defected part of either Male or Female, all known as COMMUNITY, my point is either you are a maleperson or Female person of this Community, there is nothing in-between... Hope U can understand this point very easyly that this universe is devided into two Genders/forces called Male/Female, +/- there is nothing in between...If u know anything which comes and can exsist in between these Categories, U R most welcome to share with me... Before U start with me U got to Know me, Who I am and What believe I posess and Why? thanks...
What i saying is rules adhered by humans is more because when it is implemented by state and not what is written in religious books. Do read my post once again an reply all the points. y pik only some part of it.
As for killing.. Humans also kill each other and we have killed so many of them even animals will be ashamed of their being beast.
Screwing = I have been reading ur comments. ur english is not that bad that u cant write "love making or making love" in palce of what word u chose.
Sorry Ram, but the Adam and Eve story is just that, a story. I mean if you believe it that's great, however, I don't. Humans live in a complex social system and have for a millenia, in the cave man system it would have been very similar to the way wolves, lions or more accurately chimpanzees and gorillas live today, in that you would not kill or steal from a member of your pack. Yes there is fighting with other "stranger" groups, but for the most part that is nothing more then basic squabbles within the "family" unit. Now we've evolved past family units, so that now, more or less we are living in much bigger more complex family units, which means that we need to write the laws down and agree to them. However, these laws are just the simple extension of those common sense morals we had when we were in the smaller family unit.
If we had never had these morals we never would have evolved into what we are today, we would have killed each other off long before religion was ever even thought of.
"I fight with love and I laugh with rage, you have to live light enough to see the humor and long enough to see some change." Ani Difranco
Gypsy "They are basic social morals that we developed as cave men and have expanded upon as we've evolved." that's not right Gypsy ..
Go back to history of Adam and Eve and their sons ... When on of them killed his brother bcuz of a woman ... cave men used to kill each other and stealing .. it was the rule of the jungle .. The stronger last longer .. we human being did not developed it .. or u wouldn't know that it's something wrong until there is a religion or rules told us that it's wrong ... Now u ur self know it bcuz u were not born in the cave men Age .. but if u were born in that age u would find it the right thing to survive ..
but now bcuz since u were born u r in a society of rules and restriction .. so u automatically Gain it ..
"Ram, No you probably won't convince me, I've thought about these things for a long time and come up with my opinions, however I am always interested in listening to others points of view, and respect them. Also I think talking about lifes big issue can sometimes be a good way to pass the day."
Very good thing to listen to others and respect their point of views, But wut does listen mean? is it just that wave sound that goes into ur ears .. Listening or respecting other points of view means at least give urself a chance to think about it .. or it will be useless and waste of time ..
sdkak Tcom was right .. animal kill each other from the same type and some of them eat its kids .. However I will consider ur example that they don't do so but as u said "but it does not happen. they kill other animals." U just said it .. they KILL other animals .. so they still kill .. if there were a religion book or rules for them they wouldn't do this or at least the rate of killing will be at its lowest .. Do not make a comparison between Man kind and animals .. God has gave u mind to use it .. to think about life issues ...
"as for ur screwing females.. its a very derogatory word. If two people have mutual sex, u cant tell its screwing." English is not my mother tongue and I'm not that good in English so this is the word i know to describe a man having sex with a woman .. Sorry if i used it wrongly i didn't mean any offend ..
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http://www.showcaseyourmusic.com/LittleGuitarist
"Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake."
The bigger picture is your are still wrong .... btw why r so imature as to attack on a person who does not agree on your views cant u put your vies across without personal attacks
If you can't change your fate, change your attitude.
Rules might have been writen in all and any religious book but I do not think these rules are (were ever) follwed to the letter ever by humans of any faith / religion.
I think rules have more to do with laws of a state.. check the history even when religion across the world was prevalent but b'cos autocratic rules.. people were killed for fun and games and for similar reason..
If rules were written in religious book and we all were to follow them cent percent .. can you tell
Ram why dont animals of same species kill each other.. animals do not have any religious book. In ur view point.. then dog should kill dog.
tiger should kill tiger.. but it does not happen. they kill other animals.
as for ur screwing females.. its a very derogatory word. If two people have mutual sex, u cant tell its screwing.
But rules like don't kill, don't steal, etc predate religion. They are basic social morals that we developed as cave men and have expanded upon as we've evolved. I personally believe that not killing, etc is an ingrained value in most people, which is why the majority of the world will never kill anyone.
Ram, No you probably won't convince me, I've thought about these things for a long time and come up with my opinions, however I am always interested in listening to others points of view, and respect them. Also I think talking about lifes big issue can sometimes be a good way to pass the day.
"I fight with love and I laugh with rage, you have to live light enough to see the humor and long enough to see some change." Ani Difranco
If there were no rules from the beginning how can u differentiate between right or wrong ... for example: if i didn't know about any religion i would have been drinking, screwing girls and might be killing peoples who annoy me .. without knowing that this is a bad thing ..
Whether u like the rules or not doesn't change the fact ..
If u r working in a dep. u like ur job and u r doing well in it but there r some rules and restrictions .. which u can do ur job without it .. but u still have to do it .. Why?? if u answered this question u will be answering urself ..
Suppose u r the Head of a section, and this section is a new section in ur company .. u gonna do one of 2 things:
1- follow the company rules
2- Create ur Own Rules
if there is no rules how the employee will know if he make a mistake .. or if he came late or not .. there is not certain timing ... but if there is certain timing starting work from 7 am .. he will be dead sure when he comes at 8 the he delayed means he did a mistake .. otherwise he will never know it ...
Gypsy i like the way u drive the conversation, at least u r listening to others point of view. whether to be convinced or not this is another issue ...
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http://www.showcaseyourmusic.com/LittleGuitarist
"Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake."
Frog, all the people participating in this thread don't seem to think I'm being culturally insensitive, they see no issues, perhaps you should calm down and go read some joke threads or something.
Ram, but what if you don't like the messages that the messengers are sending. I mean some of their messages are good, but I don't agree with a lot of it and think I can live a better life without their rules. Especially since I don't believe God gave them those rules. I don't know, do you really think you would be a bad person if you had never heard of Islam or Christianity or any religion?
FriendRaj...What?
"I fight with love and I laugh with rage, you have to live light enough to see the humor and long enough to see some change." Ani Difranco
I've just raised the topic people, my own personal beliefs don't really weigh into this. Personally I think God's a scientologist.
............. so now I want you to tell me that if he/she/it/what? does exist, what religion does ? belong to?
No seriously, prove it.
Madam Gypsy ------- what you to be say ???? you ask question than to be say another thing. bluff bluff bluff. so that is to be why you are to be hide face.
Plz chill out .. this is not a place for fight .. we r just discussing
At least we shud accept others point of view even if they don't have point at all ..
GYPSY: to live this good life u r talking about u shud do wut messengers said and to do so u shud believe in in messenger so u will be believing in their message (which is the Religion)
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http://www.showcaseyourmusic.com/LittleGuitarist
"Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake."
If you really think lenghty posts are better than I would have lost my time. I tought you were more intelligent than that. I hope u will have more '' cultural awareness and respect'' next :)
I'm sorry Frog who said I don't have a boyfriend? Just because you don't like an intelligent women who talks about life's big issues, doesn't mean other men don't. As for lame...well 3 pages doesn't say lame to me. How's your threads going?
"I fight with love and I laugh with rage, you have to live light enough to see the humor and long enough to see some change." Ani Difranco
Your discussions are a bit lame . Always asking about the silly ways of life . I know now why QL is becoming so boring. Too much talk about nothing. You'd better find a boyfriend instead of that who let you down. I can understand him, you're nagging all the time. arffffffffffffffffff
Frog, if you don't like it, don't read it. I'm trying to pass my time by getting into intellectual discussions, whereas you are trying to pass the time by complaining. TO each his own.
Ram, can't people live a good life without perscribing to a particular religion or beliving that God had messengers?
"I fight with love and I laugh with rage, you have to live light enough to see the humor and long enough to see some change." Ani Difranco
Not sure if this was a general question from you to the forum at large: "...So Ram, Jauntie, etc, if you don't believe that God follows any particular religion, why follow a religion?"
But if you were asking me, directly, then the answer is that I was merely saying God, by virtue of who He allegedly is! (and where Christians and Muslims are concerned), is on a somewhat higher plane than His followers.
I didn't say that I follow any particular religion myself.
This is a very very good question .. i really like it and i'm gonna answer it .. and there is no place for fight .. i'm an open minded guy and we r discussing such an important issue ..
There is another vers says that who believed in GOD, his BOOK(S) and his Messenger(s) will go to heaven ...
I did not deviated .. The Christianity is also having a religion book which is from allah .. and so on other religions (not all of them)
and i believe in God and his Books (plural) and his messengers (all of them) that is the faithfulness ...
So it doesn't mean that Islam is that religion which belongs to God .. other religions where from God too .. and we muslims shud believe in them too .. If we really understood wut islam meant ..
Gypsy: again to answer ur question why do we have to follow a religion??
How can God judge u without following a certain religion ..
it shudn't be written in ur Id that u r a christian but u might be following it by nature and u don't know ... by refraining from doing bad things u r following a certain religion .. but to be one of those who r going to heaven u shud believe in God (and Only God), His Books and his messengers (again all of them) ...
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http://www.showcaseyourmusic.com/LittleGuitarist
"Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake."
You've just said that God doesn't belong to any religion then how do you know that Qur'an is indeed the book of God. Which means Islam is the right religion and God belongs to Islam.
I am not trying to create a fight here or drag the issue. But its like an un-ending loop. We just seem to contradict ourselves each time.
My dear Gypsy your posts become a bit redundent. Are you serious about all these questions ? U're neither for Marriage nor for religion. And you are sure of nothing. Well My answer once for all is : God Exists and we are not supposed to prove it for you simply because you 're not looking for something to convince you. Unfortunately u're just messing around . What a pity and what a loss of time .
Gypsy: Good Question but as i answered u b4 .. it's Rules .. something that shud have control over u ..
Rayyz: As i mentioned in my post .. it's to the extend of ur knowledge .. so if u know very well (i'm sure u nkow) that wine is Haram .. then u will be punished for that .. if someone really doesn't know that he won't be punished .. apply this to the rest ..
u said "If u were right" it's not me it's God's book
و الذين آمنوا وعملوا الصالحات سندخلهم جنات تجري من تحتها الأنهار خالدين فيها أبداً لهم فيها أزواج مطهرة وندخلهم ظلاً ظليلاً ) النساء/56-57 .
I'm not sure that u can read arabic .. I wish if someone could translate it (translation appreciated) ... but the explanation is just saying wut i told u .. that the Heaven will be for those who r believers/faithfulness and doing good things in their life ..
He didn't say those who r muslims .. or those who r believing in Islam .. Heaven is not Only for Muslims .. Or where would be Jesus and he is one of God's Messenger .. I don't think he will be in hell cuz he is not Muslim ..
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http://www.showcaseyourmusic.com/LittleGuitarist
"Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake."
Why only planet earth? Whats with empty spaces in rest of the universe?
I guess they'd be allocated as palaces for the "good" guys in the afterlife. Would be nice though, a planet for one person. Better you've been on earth... bigger the planet you get! :)
GOD could be a gr8 scientist who has a laboratory and is experimenting.
In one of his experiments he created few objects called planets. then he innovated and started putting cells which grew to become animals and all other specices and humans.
he wanted to control humans. so he created few special cells (hindu gods / muslim god / christian god etc.) and gave them their respective names. These fellas had a communication link with this scientist called GOD.
God then put these guys in different parts of the world to control one of his/her creations called humans. he knew how bad his human creation is and so wanted a control mechanism in place.
Now humans being humans.. we followed what these special cells told us to do.
Now GOD wanted some more fun. He did mess up with some of the genes of few people here and there, resulting in some people having one or the other problem. GOD being a scientist. He knew all the scientific terminology and wanted to chk how his creation is behaving with all sorts of mess he created among the genes (sub cells)......
its getting really long..
I will surely continue on this subject on a daily basis untill my theory is complete.
What I am trying to say is God does not have any specific religion.
Thanks for the effort and trying to answer my query Ram.
I wish it was like what you said. I have been asking this question to way too many people and still can't get a convincing answer to it.
Let's say what you said is correct, now if I still remain a good person, believe in one God and live my life with humility, but, I stop fasting, doing my prayers, start drinking alchohol, would I still be in heaven?
Do you think life is fair to me that I was aware of Islam and now bound to do prayers 5 times a day and restrict myself from so many things whereas someone who is totally unaware of it and yet gets to goto to heaven, like you just said. Whats your take on that?
Thanks for the clarification. :) Am glad its only a joke. On the judgement day, if God ended up favoring your religion then I'd be left high and dry. LOL
Well you see, that is exactly is my problem. I cannot get to terms with the explanations given for my question by learned muslims. I'd actually ask someone like PM, Amigo, Aak, Ram or any other learned muslim to tell me if God does not belong to any religion then why do we restrict ourselves from so many worldly pleasures, since religions are man made and they are self imposed anyway. So long as you have been kind and a good person (you know it when you are good or not) you should just goto heaven!
Kafir is the one who is not believing in any religion or in God existance. AND NOT the one who doesn't follow the islam ..
So for A christian he/she is not a kafir .. and Believe me he will be judged on his religion if his/her knowledge didn't reached to Islam ..
Cuz christianity is Also from the Same God, They r worshipping the Same god .. may be in different way but still the same god .. and a lot of wut they believe u will find it in Islam ..
What does Islam means ??? Islam is coming from salam which is peace ..
and all the religions were asking people to live in piece and to be kind to each other and not to hurt each other .. So we all have the same Princible .. so if a christian is living in piece and doing every thing in his life in the right way i don't think he deserve to go to hell cuz he didn't pray as we r doing .. and i would consider him muslim (which means Peaceful)
u said also "Also what you said is contradictory to the explanation "Aak" has provided on the previous page. He said that humans have been given brains and intellect to find the right religion and if they don't realize Islam is the right one then they will not goto heaven."
Go Back to Quraan and u will find a verse says that "god has prepared a heaven that no one will enter except the faithful people"
If it was for only for Muslims he would say "no one will enter except Muslims" which means that in heaven there will be different religions if they were faithful people and doesn't matter if they were muslims or not ...
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http://www.showcaseyourmusic.com/LittleGuitarist
"Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake."
please read my post where I said God doesn't belong to ANY religion.
Assuming there is a God it's generally believed He is supernatural. If 'we' believe in a God then that God is the religion WE follow - He doesn't follow our 'Man made' religions, because He made Man!
And for the record, Christians believe that their God is a forgiving God and as such we all get the chance to be forgiven our sins and go to Heaven - although I have heard jokes that we Catholics used to think we would be the only ones there :D
i do not have read ur earlier posts for correcting my earlier comment. The topic is completely different and nothing to do with a non muslim going to hell for what ever u think.
If u cannot discuss anything related to the subject why increase the length of this topic. Lets us stick to the subject. If u do not know which religion GOD belongs.. why comment with something datz irrelevent and not related to this topic.
I suppose you still haven't realised what I am trying to say here. I just want to know what happens to good people such as you, who do not believe follow Islam? Or someone who isn't even aware of Islam?
In other words, the question is very much in line with the topic of this thread. What religion does God belong to? Is it yours or mine!? :)
........., so now I want you to tell me that if he/she/it/what? does exist, what religion does ? belong to?
gypsy ji into my maths class i to be prove only hypothesis.FIRST STEP IS TO BELIEVE EQUATION EXIST. if you not to be believe into GOD exist than to be NOTHING to prove. thank you madam.
If it was, then I'd suggest you to read all my previous posts in this thread before jumping the gun. I have been asking a genuine question which is directly related to the title of the thread.
Even if it wasn't for me, I have no idea what made you think that someone else was sounding like a fanatic cos most of the explanations provided here are pretty much fair and reasonable.
The topic changed to 'what religion does God belong to'. Nothing to do with what a Muslim believes will happen to us "kafir's" after death if we don't follow Islam.
kafir? I guess that is someone who doesn't follow the teachings of Islam, right?
Am muslim too and from what I know is that kafir's will burn in hellfire forever and only the ones who believed in Tawhid will goto heaven one day, no matter how bad or sinful he was. Isn't that right?
Also what you said is contradictory to the explanation "Aak" has provided on the previous page. He said that humans have been given brains and intellect to find the right religion and if they don't realize Islam is the right one then they will not goto heaven.
You are welcome .. but i was not advocating .. I was just trying to guide u to the answer .. sometimes the answer is in front of our eyes and we can't see it and still seeking an answer ..
Contradicting Islamic !!
If u really understand Islam u wouldn't say so ..
cuz even in Islam it's mentioned that God will judge every one on his knowledge .. what does it mean?
It means if there is a christian or wutever religion he/she is and he doesn't know about Islam (has no knowledge) that doesn't mean that he will go to hell directly bcuz he/she is not a Muslim (as most of the muslims think) he/she will be judged on his religion and wut he reached with his knowledge ..
So i guess the answer is No, i'm not contradicting Islamic ..
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http://www.showcaseyourmusic.com/LittleGuitarist
"Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake."
Human Beings follow (belong to) many different religions as their "way of life".
Even an atheist, agnostic, scientologist or whatever can follow his beliefs 'religiously'. A religion doesn't have to be to do with belief in any God.
God doesn't 'belong' to any religion. We mere humans usually do.
God is believed by some/many/most(?) to be the Creator of the World (as we know it); the Maker of Mankind; a supernatural being; omnipresent and eternal.
The last paragraph, of course, depends on who's particular God(s) you are referring to at the time!
You have raised a very touchy subject.. i mean there are a lot of fanatics around and they wanna prove just one religion is pure and something of that sort...
Well, u want to know about GOD... I request you to go to (and I mean it) world renowned CANCER / NEUROLOGICAL hospitals and check with the misery and deseration aroound.
DO also check the look of the patients and their family members (both trying their best to recover and at the same time boking / buying 3 feet by 6 feet of earth for their final abode.
Just meet the doctor in any of the cancer hospital.. and you will forget GOD.. I believe in GOD and the power behind the whole of universe.. but he would most certainly be like a good doctor in a cancer hospital, prescribing medicines and looking at the way to save a life or two.. he does not ask for the religion of his / her patient AND neither will GOD differenciate between his poeple on earth.
Fanatics... PLEASE dont reply to this... All others are welcome for your comments
What is the need of a King? I don't believe that there is one. However if we want to talk about democracy, there is a need for that, that way the rules are decided by debate and discussion between many people with many different points of view, rather then by some overriding ruler.
"I fight with love and I laugh with rage, you have to live light enough to see the humor and long enough to see some change." Ani Difranco
Gypsy: I'm so glad that we ha d gain a point with u .. at least now u r thinking wut religion does he belong too instead of does he exist .. and that means that ur brain started to convince ...
Gypsy do u remember when u were at school .. i guess u didn't join the high school directly .. first u went to grade 1 then 2 then 3 and so on .. why?? so that ur mind can understand step by step .. thats bcuz u cannot understand it all together .. like in grade 1 u learned the numbers but u were not able to add or subtract ... in grade 2 u learned how to add and subtract ... then divide and multiply .. till u reach an advanced level of Mathematics .. u cannot jump from the first step to the last without passing through the others ..
Religions (all of them) was the school days for Islam (that wut i believe) u can consider them as stages .. our mind wouldn't understand the Islam without having this stages first .. just like the Math class .. and for that reason there was no messengers after Mohammed ..
cuz u were Graduated no more classes to be taken .. but still u can take some courses to understand wut u miss in the school days or in an advanced studies .. Does it make sense to u??
Alexa: God has said in his books (WE (God) raised the sky and if we want we could make it with the ground as one piece)
Forgive my poor english but i'm trying to translate it as much as i can .. i'm not that good in english but i hope u get the point ..
it's something much stronger than a human being's mind can understand
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http://www.showcaseyourmusic.com/LittleGuitarist
"Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake."
Have to agree with Rayyz Amigo, that's really not an answer and more of a....riddle, or a fable or something. Either way the question is no longer does God Exist, it's what religion does God belong to.
"I fight with love and I laugh with rage, you have to live light enough to see the humor and long enough to see some change." Ani Difranco
amigo you are absolutely right. however the aim of posting this (as claimed by the author herself) is to "sharpen intellect' and revive debates on "boring QL". so just take it that way.!
Fun apart....the qustion is being asked at the wrong forum (if seriously sought). For us who believe in Him its a feeling (just like pain). Sorry mate if u cant feel or see His presence. As they say different strokes for different folks.
I am personally neither qualified nor certified to debate.
I got this forward several times and its become a chain mail of sorts these days. I've read it just once and didn't make much sense to me. Have been deleting it eversince.
Btw, how does that answer either of the two questions? Whether God exists and to what religion does he belong?
have not gone to a religious scholar...lol....someone emailed me this today.
There was a young man who went overseas to study for quite a long time. When he returned, he asked his parents to find him a religious scholar or any expert who could answer his 3 Questions.
Finally, his parents were able to find a Muslim scholar.
YOung Man:
I have 3 questions:
1. Does God exist? If so, show me His shape.
2. What is fate?
3. If Devil was created from the fire, why at the end he will be thrown to hell that is also created from fire. It certainly will not hurt him at all, since Devil and the hell were created from fire.
Did God not think of it this far?
Suddenly, the SchoLar slapped the young man's face very
hard.
Young Man
(felt pain): Why do you get angry at me?
SchoLar:
I am not angry. The slap is my answer to your three questions.
YOung Man:
I really don't understand.
SchoLar:
How do you feel after I slapped you?
YOung Man:
Of course, I felt the pain.
SchOlar:
So do you believe that pain exists?
YOung Man:
Yes.
SchoLar:
Show me the shape of the pain!
YOung Man:
I cannot.
SchoLar:
That is my first answer. All of us feel God's existence
without being able to see His shape... Last night, did you dream that
you will be slapped by me?
YOung Man:
No.
SchoLar:
Did you ever think that you will get a slap from me,
today?
YOung Man:
No.
SchoLar:
That is fate my second answer........ My hand
that I used to slap you, what is it created from?
YOung Man:
It is created from flesh.
SchoLar:
How about your face, what is it created from?
YOung Man:
Flesh.
SchoLar:
How do you feel after I slapped you?
YOung Man:
In pain.
SchoLar:
That's it. This is my third answer, Even though Devil and also the hell were created from the fire, if Allah wants, insha-Allah (God willing), the hell will become a very painful place for him.
you mentioned about a "divine force" and said," For me personally I "feel" the work of a divine plan or creator"... these alone answers your very own question about the existence of God... the very existence of evil concludes the existence of God himself... where there is evil, there is God... where the first trying to surpass God's ever presence and power...
When I was in my teens we used to spend school dinner time in my house bacause my Mum was out at work.
I won't bore you with the thinks that happend while we were doing it.
But, my Mum pulled me up with a VERY concerned and serious look on her face and said "whatever it is you have been doing in the house when I am out, can you please stop it, because it is starting to affect me."
It frightened the life out of me.
Whoever I have been with while doing it we have always got the same caracters coming through. I don't reccomend it.
My question was very specific to people living in certain parts of the world where they have not moved out of their village, let alone hear of Islam.
There so many places still existing in this world where members of that community have no knowledge of anything beyond their village.
How do you expect them to 'discover' Islam by using their brain when they haven't even heard of it? All they have been doing is following the religion they've learnt from their parents/ancestors. Even if by chance, if they did hear of Islam from somewhere, lets say television or radio. They'd probably discount it as the wrong religion. Can you imagine someone walking upto you and saying Islam is not the right religion but some other religion is. How would you take that? You'd probably say he's gone nuts!
Also my question regarding people who died unaware of Islam wasn't about the people in the past, I was asking about the ones in today's times. What happens to them? Do the burn in fire because they died as Kaafir's or goto heaven cos they were simply the deprieved ones and no one reached them to teach about Islam?
If they do goto heaven, then why wasn't I lucky enough to be in that guy's place? Atleast he had his fair share of fun growing up doing whatever he liked to do and ended up going to heaven eventually. Was life fair to me?
Ram : I sort of agree with Gypsy. How could one know which religion is correct? Isn't it amazing to think that despite all these religions existing for so many years, there are so many millions of people around the world who are deprieved of knowing which exactly is the true religion? Whether it is Christianity, Islam, Judaism, Hinduism. All but one of them is wrong for sure! Is it right on God's part not to have let his beings know about his true religion?
Gypsy : You could perhaps spice this thread by changing the title to, "Which religion God belongs to?" LOL. Btw, speaking of some divine power that is behind creation of earth and humans. Then tell me whats with creation of rest of the universe and other planets? Why can't we find any other creatures besides earth? Could it be possible that humans were created or formed as a matter of chance? Like the way bacteria is formed from nothing.
Check out this answer I found on Yahoo answers for Ouija Board.
"I've responded to similar questions on Yahoo! Answers before, and I've replied in so many ways that I don't think Ouija boards are evil. I own a glow-in-the-dark model and I've never been visited by spirits when using it. Superstitious people often attribute ominous characteristics to the most innocuous of items. If you're prone to believe there are evil spirits among us then you're probably apt to believe that Ouija boards are evil or dangerous. I don't. I enjoy scary movies and tales about supernatural or ghostly things, but I've outgrown most of the fears that I developed as a child. I'd encourage you to try out an on-line Ouija board--by yourself."
Ram, what you are describing is more of a divine force. The same thing many people describe when they say you can just "feel" the existence of God. The beauty of nature, evolution, etc.
For me personally I "feel" the work of a divine plan or creator, HOWEVER I do not at any point believe that that divine force spoke to Moses, Jesus, Mohammed or Binky the Clown. To me religion makes about as much sense as tits on a bull. Why would a divine creator push all this into motion just to turn around and condemn it? Why would he give us brains if he didn't want us to make decisions? Religion is what I believe doesn't exist.
"I fight with love and I laugh with rage, you have to live light enough to see the humor and long enough to see some change." Ani Difranco
Gypsy, human mind cannot comprehend god's existence. It is not capable. Brain believes in logic. However, when you are spirtually enlightened you may feel ashamed of this very question you have asked.
further..Cain and his followers.....had the "Tree of Knowledge" with them. And they branched out.
The 7 Continents can be linked to the Destruction of the tower of Babel (mostly by earthquake caused by shifting of plates.)
The 7 continents were previously one (scientist believe that) and then shifted apart.
The birth of different languages started from there. And also this goes to prove that the World was one place and not the "world that they knew at those times".
Also Due to the period floods (since world was one place) the sinking of the landmass was possible. Also Noha's flood was the last BIG-Flood. Thus any proof man's birth during those times can only be found if "those sites" are excavated may be to more than 100metres, as periodic flooding can cover previously exposed landmass with silt.
God does exist and he has proved himself in various ways.If you are not convinced with all that he has already done,then the only way for you is to wait till he returns to prove it again but then you won't get a chance to believe.
Now about whether he cares if you are a Gay or not-Yes he does cares and if you want to be sure read ROMANS 1:25,26,27.To understand this or to be convinced you got to believe that Bible is the word of God otherwise nothing can convince you.
We human beings are created by GOD and we are asking our creater to prove that he exist.I am sure he must be laughing up there.
Lots of things around us can be explained and catagorized by us but many things can't, so where do we catagorize them?
For instance, I think we all agree that atoms exist, but why do they pull themselves into a suitable composite form to make a human being [for instance] and constantly re-form into replacement bits and bobs to keep the form working?
Only to shut the form down and all break up then go and form other things, for no particular reason?
We don't know why so we say it is the working of some higher bieng.
If you believe in natural selection and the evolution of species or not there is a strong case for it, but how does some thing evolve an eye from where there was no eye before?
It is beyond our understanding, so it must be the work of a higher bieng,.
Shouldn't it?
As for the rules, I believe they are the work of high ranking individuals in past civilisations who want to offer guidence and order to otherwise chaotic settlements of people.
Of they tried to impose the rules as their own there would be difficulties in enforcement.
But if the rules are from the higher being then who could argue with them?
It's a bit like my Mrs telling the kids they had better do as they are told or Dad will be annoyed when he gets home.
I'm sure those ancient authors of the various beeks genuinly believed in what they were doing and I admire them for it, but who can say it was the word of God?
They will recount instances of God talking to people and asking for his word to be passed on.
My nephew is a paranoid schizophrenic and hears voices in his head all the time, could this be the same thing?
Gypsy I can accept your Question but at the same time I wonder if you believe the Darwin Theory?
Its possible to work backwards to Adam & Eve but its impossible to suddenly crossbreed & create the "Homo Sapian" that too as a couple. Not only that they had to keep doing that until the "Homo-Sapian" species were quite in number so as to survive in the wild (cause they were not developed to the level of Man).
The Darwin Theory is full of Holes if you take into Account the Blood groups & Eye colour.
One can divide mankind upon Skin colour (environment & climate affects the pigmentation) but you have only 5 blood groups.
Also one cannot use a monkeys blood on human!!!
The common Blood groups being A, B, & O.
Now if you bring in the Lucefarin suduction of Eve this makes sense.
as there were 3 people (Adam, Lucifer & Eve) involved in creating Able & Cain.
Our body is made up of Atoms. When we die whether we are burried or burnt the result is the same...we go back to the soil...attach to some seed, become some plant, or some bird eat that seed and become part of that bird ...etc.
Matter is what matter was....or something like that.
Technically the Line in Thora-Koran-Bible "Wake up the dead" is not possbible.
This shows that the words & the lines in scriptures are not to be taken as it is but in the context of what is being said.
ur existence is a proof itself ... can u tell me from where did u come??
Ohh i know that very well u came from ur mum's tummy
ok and what about u mum and dad?? the same thing .. keep going on and on till u reach Adam and Eve ... from where they came ?? NO ONE .. God has created Them ..
same goes to the first bird, animal or insect ...
Havn't u ever looked to an ant .. how it dig her way through the ground without tools ??? i bet u can't do this without a tool even if u tried that for 100 years?? is the ant much stronger than u while u can kill it with just a finger press .. who gave it the ability to do this??
the creator .. and who is the creator ?? if u can create an ant i would worship u and call u a god and i bet u can't do it ..
SO simply it's God ..
you don't need a big obvious proof to believe .. if u just watched the details of life u will know that GOD do really exist ..
hope that answer ur question ...
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http://www.showcaseyourmusic.com/LittleGuitarist
"Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake."
Hmmm. Thatz a question I would like to speak in length.. but due to ramadan timings.. u know have to leave today .. but will surely have my theory put across here.
THat stuff about there being facts in the Quran that couldn't have been known is total and utter bollox. I have done the research on this. THe verses in the quran are classically vague and have just been interpreted.
Such a sh1t reason to devote your whole life to not having fun
Rayyz, You have put me in a difficult situation by asking me to explain quite difficult questions, but still I would try to, as this is the only way we can deal with them... I remember a lecture by Bilal Philip where he argues the same question, he said "I say I got this knowledge from my parents who got it from theirs"...But there is no guarantee that my fathers father knowledge was right, unless he got his knowledge from Allah and his rasool...
Therefore, being born in any religion is not anybody's fault...the fault is although God sent him with a superior brain, he did not use it to get to the correct path. The onus to find the right path lies on you and nobody else. You dont wait for ppl to travel to u and convince you that Allah is one... You have to find out...
Regarding your questions on ppl who died before Islam or christaianity.. it s very clear in islam, those who agreed with the Prophets of their time and did not reject any other prophet were all muslims.... therefore, a person beliveing in Moses died before Jesus was a Muslim, A person who believed in Jesus before Mohammad was Muslim. Its only after the first person failed to believe in Jesus and only believed in Moses that he unbelieved and similarly afterwards
.....You can't mean what you say unless you can say what you mean...
God's non-existence is accepted and trivial, if only in the sense that we can never absolutely prove the non-existence of anything. What matters is not whether God is disprovable, but whether his existence is probable. Look up Bertrand Russell's parable of the celestial teapot.
***********
"There's this thing called being so open-minded your brains drop out". - Richard Dawkins
Great, I am a Muslim too, Alhamdulillah. But few things have been bugging me a lot lately. Let's not put it on Satan for putting thoughts in my mind.
Can you explain this for me please?
What happens to people after their deaths from other religions? What is their fault that they were born into another religion and have been praying someother God. They were just following what were taught to do so eversince their birth? For instance in smaller towns of China, there are millions of people who have idea of existence of any other religion other their own and die even before hearing of Islam or Christianity! This is only an example, there are millions of similar smaller towns or villages that exist in this world. Are those people just plain unlucky or doomed in the afterlife?
What is their fault in it, that Allah or Jesus or Krishna decided to put them on earth in such a remote place and they ended up worshipping someone else?
If you are saying that it is a duty of a Muslim to reach different parts of the world and make them aware of Islam then still it doesn't really justify. What happens if no one reaches that part of the world before some of them die?
Rayyz, Alhumdulillah I am A Muslim...and as far as the questions are concerned, I can also ask these kind of questions.... We need to reply in the best possible and not confusing manner, which I find myself to be incapable of....I would only quote Einstein ""Coincidence is God's way of remaining anonymous."
...You can't mean what you say unless you can say what you mean...
Well, I doubt that we'll ever find out if God exists or not. What we should be worried about at the moment is HOW we live our lives. Religions might've/could've/should've been created to give us a guide to being good human beings. Some people misuse religion as an excuse for terrorism or wars............
For example, the Qu'ran doesn't tell ANYONE to strap a C4 to their body and go running around a public place in the name of God. Since, the guilty people will be punished later anyways... I guess. We should be using the religious books and stuff to GUIDE our lives and not FOLLOW the books word by word. If it helps you to pray to someone as it gives you the feeling that all will be well, then go ahead. Whether this has any affect on your afterlife is questionable as we can't be sure that there is an afterlife. Who knows? It all depends on how you interpret the words of holy books and how they've changed over 2000 years, even though many say that they haven't...
Anyways, the religions are all mostly the same and try to bring out the good human qualities in everyone, however, some people take it toooooooooooooo seriously. I guess you should just live your life the way you want as long as you don't cause anyone else grief and suffering. I is not making sense, eh? Oh well...
Azee the main causes of theft are poverty, are you saying that Islam has figured out a way to end poverty? No. As long as there is poverty there will be theft, and I refuse to cut the hand off someone who stole food because they were hungry.
Also rape rates are just as high here and in the US, the difference is rape cases are reported more frequently in the US! Here they are rarely reported.
Why not read some of the news that comes out of Saudi if you believe so much in Sharia law.
"I fight with love and I laugh with rage, you have to live light enough to see the humor and long enough to see some change." Ani Difranco
Jack : I don't believe ghosts exist either! I'm serious. Now what?
Kitkat : Previous life? Please don't pile my soul with sins from my previous life! As it is, I am S*hit scared of sins that I've done in this life. How do I know that I ever had a previous life anyway?
Gypsy ...Is there butter in Milk? How do to find out?
Its for you to find it, ie...go through the task.
Long ago I too thought so.....But kept on researching. Then suddenly it all fits like a puzzle.
I might/might not be able to prove to you or my own friends or my offspring that there is God. Its for him/her to find out.
How hard have you tried?
How many religious scripts/scriptures have you read?
Read as much as you can on every religion you can find.
Dont try to negate/compare one religion with the other. Try to fit one with the other .....they all fit.
The Journey might take days.....years...sometimes a life time.
The easiest way is to check out Witchcraft, Blackmagic, Exocisim...etc (which exist accross all seas, oceans, continents almost universally....the Dark/black side of Spirituality. That is proveable.
If anybody watches real life-Exocism for the first time it would put the fright of God in him for good.
If the Devil is proveable then the oppsite does exist by default!!!
Aak : Do you mind me asking what religion do you belong to? Do you want me to repeat my questions written above?
Azee : Please do not cut and paste lines from a website. I know I can goto www.islamqa.com and read it there. If you have something to say on your own then please do so.
As I mentioned, to make your prayer work, you need to practice a lot. When you reach a certain level then only your prayers are answered, there is no one to guide them the right way of reaching GOD. Some people are suffering in this world because of their sins in their previous life.
All religions basically teach followers to do good deeds. Why should a person only follow Islam? Can he not follow any of the religions?
Answer
1. Major difference between Islam and most other religions
All religions basically exhort mankind to be righteous and eschew evil. But Islam goes beyond that. It guides us towards practical ways of achieving righteousness and eliminating evil from our individual and collective lives. Islam takes into account human nature and the complexities of human society. Islam is guidance from the Creator Himself. Therefore, Islam is also called the Deen-ul-Fitrah (the natural religion of Man).
2. Example - Islam commands us to shun robbery and also prescribes method of eleminating robbery
1.
Islam prescribes method of eliminating robbery
All major religions teach that theft is an evil act. Islam teaches the same. So what is the difference between Islam and the other religions? The difference lies in the fact that Islam, besides teaching that robbing is evil, shows a practical way of creating a social structure in which people will not rob.
2.
Islam prescribes Zakaat
Islam prescribes a system of Zakaat (obligatory annual charity). Islamic law prescribes that every person who has a saving that exceeds the nisaab level i.e. more than 85 grams of gold, should give 2.5% of that saving every lunar year in charity. If every rich person in the world gave Zakaat sincerely, poverty will be eradicated from this world. Not a single human being would die of hunger.
3.
Chopping off the hands as punishment for robbery
Islam prescribes chopping off the hands of the convicted robber. The Glorious Qur’an says in Surah Maidah:
"As to the thief, male or female, cut off his or her hands:a punishment by way
of example, from Allah, for their crime: and Allah is Exalted in power, full of wisdom."
[ Al-Qur’an 5:38]
The non-Muslim may say, "Chopping off the hands in this 20th century. Islam is a barbaric and ruthless religion!"
4.
Results achieved when Islamic Shariah Implemented
America is supposed to be one of the most advanced countries in the world. Unfortunately it also has one of the highest rates of crime, theft, and robbery. Suppose the Islamic shariah is implemented in America i.e. every rich person gives Zakaat ( 2.5% of his savings in charity above 85 grams of gold every lunar year), and every convicted robber has his or her hands chopped off as a punishment. Will the rate of theft and robbery in America increase, remain same or decrease? Naturally it will decrease. Moreover the existence of such a stringent law would discourage many a potential robber.
I agree that the amount of theft that takes place in the world today is so tremendous that if you chop off the hands of all the thieves, there will be tens of thousands of people whose hands will be chopped off. The point here is that the moment you implement this law the rate of theft will decline immediately. The potential robber would give it a serious thought before jeopardizing his limbs. The mere thought of the punishment itself will discourage majority of the robbers. There will barely be a few who would rob. Hence only a few person’s hands would be chopped off but millions would live peacefully without fear of being robbed.
Islamic Shariah is therefore practical, and achieves results.
3. Example: Islam prohibits the molestation and rape of women. It enjoins hijaab and prescribes capital punishment for a convicted rapist.
1. Islam prescribes method of eliminating molestation and rape
All the major religions declare the molestation and rape of women as grave sins. Islam teaches the same. What then is the difference between Islam and the other religions? The difference lies in the fact that Islam does not merely preach respect for women, or abhor molestation and rape as serious crimes, but also gives clear guidance as to how society can eliminate such crimes.
2. Hijaab for men
Islam has a system of hijaab. The Glorious Qur’an first mentions hijaab for the men and then for the women. Hijaab for the men is mentioned in the following verse:
"Say to the believing men that they should lower their gaze and guard their modesty: that will make for greater purity for them: and Allah is well acquainted with all that they do."
[Al-Qur’an 24:30]
The moment a man looks at a woman and if any brazen or unashamed thought comes to his mind, he should lower his gaze.
3. Hijaab for women
Hijaab for women is mentioned in the following verse:
"And say to the believing women that they should lower their gaze and guard their modesty; that they should not display their beauty and ornaments except what (must ordinarily) appear thereof; that they should draw their veils over their bosoms and not display their beauty except to their husbands, their fathers, their husbands’ fathers, their sons...."
[Al-Qur’an 24:31]
The extent of hijaab for a woman is that her complete body should be covered. The only part that can be seen, are the face and the hands up to the wrists. If they wish to cover, they can even cover these parts of the body. However some Islamic scholars insist that even the face should be covered.
4. Hijaab prevents molestation
The reason why Allah has prescribed Hijaab for the women is given in the Qur’an in the folowing verse of Surah Al-Ahzab:
"O Prophet! Tell thy wives and daughters, and the believing women,that they should cast their outer garments over their persons (when abroad): that is most convenient, that they should be known (as such) and not molested. And Allah is Oft-Forgiving, most Merciful."
[Al-Qur’an 33:59]
The Qur’an says that Hijaab has been prescribed for the women so that they are recognized as modest women this would prevent them from being molested.
5. Example of twin sisters
Suppose two sisters who are twins and who are equally beautiful, walk down a street. One of them is wearing the Islamic Hijaab i.e. the complete body is covered except for the face and the hands up to the wrists, and the other twin is wearing a mini skirt or shorts. Around the corner there is a hooligan who is waiting for an opportunity to tease a girl. Who will he tease? The girl wearing the Islamic Hijaab or the girl wearing the mini skirt or shorts? Dresses that expose more than they conceal, are an indirect temptation to the opposite sex for teasing, molestation and rape. The Qur’an rightly says that the hijaab prevents women from being molested.
6. Capital punishment for rapist
The Islamic shariah prescribes capital punishment for a convicted rapist. The non-Muslim may be horrified at such a stringent punishment in this age. Many accuse Islam of being ruthless and barbaric. I have asked a common question to hundreds of non-Muslim men. Suppose God-forbid, some one rapes your wife, your mother or your sister and you are made the judge. The rapist is brought in front of you. What punishment would you give him? All of them said, "we would put him to death." Some went to the extent of saying, "we would torture him to death", If your wife or your mother is raped you want the rapist to be put to death. But if someone else’s wife or mother is raped, capital punishment is a barbaric law. Why the double standards?
7. U.S.A. has one of the highest rate of Rape
The United States of America is supposed to be one of the most advanced countries of the world. An F.B.I report in the year 1990 says that 1,02,555 cases of rape were reported. It further says that only 16% of the cases of rapes are reported. Thus, in order to know the actual number of rapes that took place in 1990, the reported figure should be multiplied by 6.25. We get a total of 6,40,968 rape cases that took place in the year 1990. If the total is divided by 365 the number of days in a year, we get an average of 1,756 rape incidents everyday.
Later another report said that an average of 1900 cases of rape are committed in U.S.A every day. According to National Crime Victimization Survey Bureau of Justice Statistics (U. S. Dept. of Justice) in 1996 alone 3,07,000 cases of rape were reported. Only 31% of the actual cases of rape were reported. Thus, 3,07,000 X 3.226 = 9,90,322 rapes took place in 1996. That is, an average of 2,713 cases of rape took place everyday in America in 1996. Every 32 seconds one rape is taking place in America. Maybe American rapists got bolder. The FBI report of 1990 continues and says that out of the rape cases that were reported only 10% of the rapist were arrested, that is only 1.6% of the actual rapes committed. Out of those arrested, 50% were let free before the trial. This would mean that only 0.8% of the rapists faced a trial. In other words if a person commits 125 rapes the chances that he will get a punishment for rape is only once. Many would consider this a good gamble. And the report says that of those people who faced trial 50% received sentences of less than a year’s imprisonment though the American law says rape carries a seven year sentence of imprisonment. For a rapist, the judge is lenient to first time offenders. Imagine a person commits 125 rapes and the chances of being convicted is only once, and 50% of the time the judge will grant leniency and give a sentence of less than a year!
8. Results achieved when Islamic Shariah Implemented
Suppose the Islamic shariah is implemented in America. Whenever a man looks at a woman and if any brazen or unashamed thought comes to his mind, he lowers his gaze. Every woman wears the Islamic Hijaab, that is the complete body is covered except the face and the hands upto the wrists. After this if any man commits rape, he gets capital punishment. The question is, will the rate of rape in America increase, will it remain the same or will it decrease? Naturally it will decrease. Islamic Shariah gets results.
4. Islam has Practical Solutions for the Problems of Mankind
Islam is the best way of life because its teachings are not doctrinaire rhetoric but practical solutions for the problems of mankind. Islam achieves results both at the individual and collective levels. Islam is the best way of life because it is a practical, universal religion not confined to any ethnic group or nationality.
Thanks for the lines. I'd rather love to listen from you rather than you cutting and pasting lines from a website. You could have pasted the link to the page instead.
Aak : Well I have posed a few question, can you answer those for me please?
1. Belief in the hereafter is not based on blind faith?
Many people wonder as to how a person with a scientific and logical temperament, can lend any credence to the belief of life after death. People assume that anyone believing in the hereafter is doing so on the basis of blind belief.
My belief in the hereafter is based on a logical argument.
2. Hereafter a logical belief
There are more than a thousand verses in the Glorious Qur’an, containing scientific facts (refer my book "Qur’an and Modern Science-Compatible or Incompatible?"). Many facts mentioned in the Qur’an have been discovered in the last few centuries. But science has not advanced to a level where it can confirm every statement of the Qur’an.
Suppose 80% of all that is mentioned in the Qur’an has been proved 100% correct. About the remaining 20%, science makes no categorical statement, since it has not advanced to a level, where it can either prove or disprove these statements. With the limited knowledge that we have, we cannot say for sure whether even a single percentage or a single verse of the Qur’an from this 20% portion is wrong. Thus when 80% of the Qur’an is 100% correct and the remaining 20% is not disproved, logic says that even the 20% portion is correct. The existence of the hereafter, which is mentioned in the Qur’an, falls in the 20% ambiguous portion which my logic says is correct.
3. Concept of peace and human values is useless without the concept of hereafter
Is robbing a good or an evil act? A normal balanced person would say it is evil. How would a person who does not believe in the hereafter convince a powerful and influential criminal that robbing is evil?
Suppose I am the most powerful and influential criminal in the world. At the same time I am an Intelligent and a logical person. I say that robbing is good because it helps me lead a luxurious life. Thus robbing is good for me.
If anybody can put forward a single logical argument as to why it is evil for me, I will stop immediately. People usually put forward the following arguments:
a. The person who is robbed will face difficulties
Some may say that the person who is robbed will face difficulties. I certainly agree that it is bad for the person who is robbed. But it is good for me. If I rob a thousand dollars, I can enjoy a good meal at a 5 star restaurant.
b. Someone may rob you
Some people argue that someday I may be robbed. No one can rob me because I am a very powerful criminal and I have hundreds of bodyguards. I can rob anybody but nobody can rob me. Robbing may be a risky profession for a common man but not for an influential person like me.
c. The police may arrest you
Some may say, if you rob, you can be arrested by the police. The police cannot arrest me because I have the police on my payroll. I have the ministers on my payroll. I agree that if a common man robs, he will be arrested and it will be bad for him, but I am an extraordinarily influential and powerful criminal.
Give me one logical reason why it is bad for me and I will stop robbing.
d. Its easy money
Some may say its easy money and not hard-earned money. I agree completely that it is easy money, and that is one of the main reasons why I rob. If a person has the option of earning money the easy as well as the hard way, any logical person would choose the easy way.
e. It is against humanity
Some may say it is against humanity and that a person should care for other human beings. I counter argue by asking as to who wrote this law called ‘humanity’ and why should I follow it?
This law may be good for the emotional and sentimental people but I am a logical person and I see no benefit in caring for other human beings.
f. It is a selfish act
Some may say that robbing is being selfish. It is true that robbing is a selfish act; but then why should I not be selfish? It helps me enjoy life.
1. No logical reason for robbing being an evil act
Hence all arguments that attempt to prove that robbing is an evil act are futile. These arguments may satisfy a common man but not a powerful and influential criminal like me. None of the arguments can be defended on the strength of reason and logic. It is no surprise that there are so many criminals in this world.
Similarly raping, cheating etc. can be justified as good for a person like me and there is no logical argument that can convince me that these things are bad.
2. A Muslim can convince a powerful and influential criminal
Now let us switch sides. Suppose you are the most powerful and influential criminal in the world, who has the police and the ministers on his payroll. You have army of thugs to protect you. I am a Muslim who will convince you that robbing, raping, cheating, etc. are evil acts.
Even if I put forth the same arguments to prove that robbing is evil the criminal will respond the same way as he did earlier.
I agree that the criminal is being logical and all his arguments are true only when he is the most powerful and influential criminal.
3. Every human being wants justice
Each and every human being desires justice. Even if he does not want justice for others he wants justice for himself. Some people are intoxicated by power and influence and inflict pain and suffering on others. The same people, however, would surely object if some injustice was done to them. The reason such people become insensitive to the suffering of others is that they worship power and influence. Power and influence, they feel, not only allows them to inflict injustice on others but also prevents others from doing likewise to them.
4. God is Most Powerful and Just
As a Muslim I would convince the criminal about the existence of Almighty God (refer to answer proving the existence of God). This God is more powerful than you and at the same time is also just. The Glorious Qur’an says:
"Allah is never unjust
In the least degree"
[Al-Qur’an 4:40]
5. Why does God not punish me?
The criminal, being a logical and scientific person, agrees that God exists, after being presented with scientific facts from the Qur’an. He may argue as to why God, if He is Powerful and Just, does not punish him.
6. The people who do injustice should be punished
Every person who has suffered injustice, irrespective of financial or social status, almost certainly wants the perpetrator of injustice to be punished. Every normal person would like the robber or the rapist to be taught a lesson. Though a large number of criminals are punished, many even go scot-free. They lead a pleasant, luxurious life, and even enjoy a peaceful existence. If injustice is done to a powerful and influential person, by someone more powerful and more influential than he, even such a person would want that person perpetrators of injustice to be punished.
7. This life is a test for the hereafter
This life is a test for the hereafter. The Glorious Qur’an says:
"He who created Death
And life that He
May try which of you
Is best in deed;
And He is the Exalted
In Might, Oft-Forgiving"
[Al-Qur’an 67:2]
8. Final justice on day of judgement
The Glorious Qur’an says:
"Every soul shall have
A taste of death:
And only on the Day
Of Judgement shall you
Be paid your full recompense.
Only he who is saved
Far from the Fire
And admitted to the Garden
Will have attained
The object (of life):
For the life of this world
Is but goods and chattels
Of deception."
[Al-Qur’an 3:185]
Final justice will be meted out on the Day of Judgement. After a person dies, he will be resurrected on the Day of Judgement along with the rest of mankind. It is possible that a person receives part of his punishment in this world. The final reward and punishment will only be in the hereafter. God Almighty may not punish a robber or a rapist in this world but he will surely be held accountable on the Day of Judgement and will be punished in the hereafter i.e. life after death.
9. What punishment can the human law give Hitler?
Hitler incinerated six million Jews during his reign of terror. Even if the police had arrested him, what punishment can the human law give Hitler for justice to prevail? The most they can do is to send Hitler to the gas chamber. But that will only be punishment for the killing of one Jew. What about the remaining five million, nine hundred and ninety nine thousand, nine hundred and ninety-nine Jews?
10. Allah can burn Hitler more than six million times in hellfire
Allah say in the Glorious Qur’an:
"Those who reject
Our signs, We shall soon
Cast into the Fire;
As often as their skins
Are roasted through,
We shall change them
For fresh skins,
That they may taste
The penalty: for Allah
Is Exalted in Power, Wise"
[Al-Qur’an 4:56]
If Allah wishes he can incinerate Hitler six million times in the hereafter in the hellfire.
11. No concept of human values or good and bad without concept of hereafter
It is clear that without convincing a person about the hereafter, i.e. life after death, the concept of human values and the good or evil nature of acts is impossible to prove to any person who is doing injustice especially when he is influential and powerful.
Does God exist? I find it interesting that so much attention is given to this debate. The latest surveys tell us that over 90% of people in the world today believe in the existence of God or some higher power. Yet, somehow the responsibility is placed on those who believe God does exist to somehow prove that He really does exist. To me, I think it should be the other way around
...You can't mean what you say unless you can say what you mean...
Just when an interesting topic like this comes along I gotta run....i'll check back in tomorrow....always interesting to read all the other QLers opinions....just remember to play nice all.
My hat's off to you Gypsy...you're on fire today with the inetersting topics!
Stay safe all.
Perfection does not exist. The question therefore, is: what level of imperfection are we willing to settle for?
I'd still call it as coincidence. Tell me why there is so much poverty and suffering even to people who pray the most?
Infact the rich guys pray the least and poor ones pray the maximum, yet they're the deprieved ones and always promised of a great life in the hereafter.
I am talking about rich not just financially, but mental state of happiness as well. Even otherwise, let's admit is money is indeed a major cause of mental state of unhappiness in countries below the poverty line.
KitKat, lots of psychiatrists and psychologist today believe in the power of positive thinking, that if you think positively and act positively, postive things will happen. This is what occurs when people pray. Also look at things like "faith Healing" the human mind is a complex thing, it can trick itself into believing almost anything.
"I fight with love and I laugh with rage, you have to live light enough to see the humor and long enough to see some change." Ani Difranco
If god is responsible for determining right from wrong....then why are all the major religions based on the ten commandments....which are themselves taken from Hamurabi's code that predates religion by thousands of years....God wouldn't need to plagiarize?
Stay safe all.
Perfection does not exist. The question therefore, is: what level of imperfection are we willing to settle for?
I'd buy that explanation, "Whatever be the religion, there is only one God, its the supreme power God treats all religion equally. If you worship Allah or Jesus or Buddha or Krishna its all the same! it makes no difference to GOD. Religion is man created, but GOD is the universal power."
But that may not be the case with all the religions you know. You have to worship the right God to get thru to heaven.
Also, why do we have to keep praying Him to please him? Isn't the belief and knowledge with acceptance that someone superior has created us isn't enough to take us thru?
I never asked God to create me, I'd rather be happy as to have been never existed rather than find myself in hell after 60 odd years of a testing life on planet earth.
Coincidence wont happen many times, I can make things happen with my prayers...it may sound stupid.. but with meditation and prayers its possible. If you read more about it, you can try it yourself...IT WORKS. Not like winning a lottery or something. I can change a difficult situation to my favour, or change a person’s attitude towards me.
TCM, all of that isn't actually proof. It could just as easily be explained by coincidence. There is more scientific proof today that Jesus wasn't the son of God and that was actually made up later to make more people follow the religion.
"I fight with love and I laugh with rage, you have to live light enough to see the humor and long enough to see some change." Ani Difranco
GOD exist, you can prove it within oneself, HE is around...HE exist, from the moment you sleep and the mystery of waking up..HE is responsible for everything you see, feel...
GOD is responsible to determine what is right and wrong...to feel guilt and compassion...
well, the list is endless that GOD do exist..:)
[img_assist|nid=12867|title=Nothing in life is to be feared. It is only to be understood.|desc= |link=none|align=left|width=44|height=180]
Whatever be the religion, there is only one God, its the supreme power God treats all religion equally. If you worship Allah or Jesus or Buddha or Krishna its all the same! it makes no difference to GOD. Religion is man created, but GOD is the universal power. Believing in God is not called religious, people who practice too much religion is called religious... I know, I dont make much sense ..LOL
"When you near miss an accident, you recover from a fatal illness. When your prayers are heard, When you get want to wish for which may be near impossible."
I could also be a good mixture of coincidence and superstition.
why to border yourself with those questions?you get the answer after you closed your eyes forever.not before.nobody can tell it truely and nobody on this earth can give you the only right and true answer.
*Create your own destiny,fighting against your dark sides,raise your
We feel the existence of GOD in some curtail times in our life. When you near miss an accident, you recover from a fatal illness. When your prayers are heard, When you get want to wish for which may be near impossible. Getting married got nothing to do with Gods existence, but I believe in life after death, you are accountable for your sins on earth..LOL
Alrite, let me get a little serious here and post the question that I did in the other thread.
What happens to people after their deaths from other religions? What is their fault that they were born into another religion and have been praying someother God. They were just following what were taught to do so eversince their birth? For instance in smaller towns of China, there are millions of people who have idea of existence of any other religion other their own and die even before hearing of Islam or Christianity! This is only an example, there are millions of similar smaller towns or villages that exist in this world. Are those people just plain unlucky or doomed in the afterlife?
What is their fault in it, that Allah or Jesus or Krishna decided to put them on earth in such a remote place and they ended up worshipping someone else?
Yes God Exists ...It Depends on a beleiver ...Yup he doent care if people R gay R les ...People who R gay r Les the develop this disease by themself its not given by god ...........
A god or multiple gods....all man made....but it helps some to believe in higher powers...whatever floats your boat as long as you are not hurting others.....since Religion (Almost ALL Religions) have been used as a rallying cry for war...they should all be banned! But that's just my opinion.
Stay safe all.
Perfection does not exist. The question therefore, is: what level of imperfection are we willing to settle for?
To accept he doesn't exist means you have to accept he does exist in order to have something not to believe exists .......................argh.............my head !!!!!!!!!
Does God Exist, yes I think so, but there's no proof of it, and I don't think he gives a rats arse if people are married or not, but that's just me. :P
Qatar's winter months are brimming with unmissable experiences, from the AFC Asian Cup 2023 to the World Aquatics Championships Doha 2024 and a variety of outdoor adventures and cultural delights.
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Celebrate World Vegan Day with our list of vegan food outlets offering an array of delectable options, spanning from colorful salads to savory shawarma and indulgent desserts.
1. Countries in Africa:
Algeria, Angola, Bennin, Botswana, Burkina Faso, Burundi, Cameroon, Canary Islands (Gran Cnaria & Tenerife), Cape Verde, Central African Republic, Chad, Comoros & Mayottee, Cote dIvoire, Democratic Republic of Congo, Djibouti, Egypt, Equatorial Guinea, Eritrea, Ethiopia, Gabon, Gambia (Fajara), Ghana, Guinea, Guinea-Bissau, Kenya (Nairobi), Lesotho, Liberia, Libya, Madagascar, Malawi, Mali (Bamako, Djenne', Mopti, Se'gou, Timbuktu), Mauritania, Mauritius, Morocco, Mozambique, Namibia, Niger, Nigeria, Republic of Congo, Reunion, Rawanda, Sao Tome & Principe, Senegal (Dakar, St-Lois), Seychelles, Sierra Leone, Somalia, South Africa (Cape Town, Jeffreys Bay, Johannesburg), Sudan, Swaziland, Tanzania (Zanzibar), Togo, Tunisia, Uganda, Zambia (Victoria Falls) and Zimbabwe
2. Searh the whole Antarctican region...
3. Countries of Asia:
Afghanistan, Bangladesh, Bhutan, Brunei, Cambodia, (Phnom Penh, Siem Reap), China (Beijing, Hainan Dao, Hong Kong, Kunming, Macau, Shanghai, Tibet), East Timor, India (Benglore, Delhi, Goa, Hyderabad, Jaisalmer, Kolkata, Mumbai, Udaipur), Indonesia (Bali, Jakarta, Java, Lombok, Sumatra), Japan (Fukuoka, Kyoto, Nagoya, Osaka, Sapporo, Tokyo...), Kazakhstan, Kyrgyzstan, Laos (Luang Prabang, Vientiane), Malaysia, Maldives, Mongolia, Myanmar, Nepal (Kathmandu Pokhara), North Korea, South Korea, Pakistan (Karachi, Lahore, Islamabad...), Philippines (Manila..), Singapore, Sri Lanka (Colombo), Taiwan (Taipei), Tajikostan, Thailand (Bangkok, Chiang Mai, Ko Chang, Phuket...) Turkmenistan/Turkey,Uzbekistan, and Vietnam (Hanoi, Ho Chi Minh..)
4. Middle East:
Bahrain, Iran, Iraq, Israel, Jordan, Kuwait, Lebanon, Oman, Of Course Qatar, Saudi Arabia, Syria, The Palestinian Territories, United Arab Emirates and Yemen...
5. Caribbean:
Anguilla, Antigua & Barbuda, Aruba, Bahamas (Nassau), Bardados, Bonaire, British Virgin islands, Cayman Islands, Cuba (Havana), Curacao, Dominica, Dominican Republic, Grenda, Guadeloupe, Haiti, jamaica, Martinque, Monserrat, Puerto Rico, saba, Saint Kitts & Nevis, Saint Lucia, Saint martin, Saint Vincent & the Grenadiness, Sint Eustatius, Sint Maarten, Trinidad and Tobago,Turks & Caicos, US virgin Islans
6. Central American COuntries;
Belize, Costa Rica, El Salvador, Guatemala, Honduras, Nicaragua, and Panama
7. North American Teritories;
Bermuda, Canada, Mexico and United States of America
8. South American Countries are;
Argentina, Bolivia, Brazil, Chile & Easter Island Colombia, Ecuador & the Galapagos Islands, Falkland Islands, French Guiana, Guyana, Paraguay, Peru, Suriname, Uruguay and Venezuela
9. Eurooean Countries are;
Albania, Andorra, Armenia, Austria, Azerbaijan, Belarus, Belgium, Bosnia-Hercegovinia, Bulgharia, Coatia, Cyprus, Czech Republic, Denmark, England, Estonia, Faroe Islands, Finland, France, Georgia, Germany, Greece, Greenland, Holy See, Hungary, iceland, ireland, Italy, Latvia, Liechtenstein, Lithuania, Luxembourg, Macedonia, Malta, Maldova,
Monaco, Montenegro, Netherlands, Norway, Poland, portugal, Romania, Russia, San Marino, Scotland, Serbia, Slovakia. Slovania, Spain, Seden, Switzerland, Turkey, Ukraine and Wales
10. Finally, the Pacific Regional Countries are;
American Soma, Australia, Cook Islands, Federated Sates of Micronesia, Fiji, Guam, Kiribati, Marshall Islands, Nauru, new Caledonia, new Zealand, Niue, Northern Mariana Islands, Palau, Paua New Guinea, Pitciam Islands, Soma, Solomon Islands, Tahiti & French, Polynesia, Tokelau, Tonga, Tuvalu, Vanuatu, Wallis & Futuna
Peace on U and everyone else associated with you!
I'm thankful to your kind words, I really need such great words/prayers like these... Kindly remember me in your good words. Thanks again... Stay safe and Peaceful...
In reading your replies, It seems you are undoubtedly a good philosopher on your own terms. You have definetly the answer to your question, there is no need to fast forward my statement.
I wish I could take language And fold it like cool, moist rags.
I would lay words on your forehead. I would wrap words on your wrists.
"There, there," my words would say Or something better.
I would ask them to murmur, "Hush" and "Shh, shh, it's
What a Co-incidence... someone just msg me that he/they want to runaway from these "Mythical, real, religious, Believers/non believer's satirical debates" My answer to you that we can Run where ever we like, but we can not run out of this Universe... Even After Death... so tell me if you can not runaway from this Universe then where where u when u was not born... If All the Pillars of Society gets together under one Umbrella and start thinking .. they can not bring even one close answer to the nature's truth... Unless they seek the help from religious Entities (here Messengers of the Protectors are the only Entities)
i do appreciate ur private messages, and welcome all of U and your Comments/believes, but I would like to request you to pls Post something here as well coz your donation in this coz will be rewarded and benefited to the mankind in the shape of Peace....
How many things do we need/posses and believe are the necessaty of our daily life as a Human Being; lnecessityit this way... this is a major Fact of our Life that; 1. (Now a Days)We Earn to Eat and maintain our Living Standard on daily basis; 2. We Seek Help from each others to build better society and protect it's future; We need to reveal/discover the hidden secrets of our life and this Universe as well...and lots of similar things that we all need on our daily basis to be upgrade daily; infact in all of the above; the most common and important thing is "WE"; and all what we are erning and doing in our life needs a deep knowledge and understanding; therefore; we (Human Being) decided to divide the responsibilities among each other to the best of our knowledge and understanding with the Subject; We have Created the following subjects; and still Creating More to Facilitate everyone around us... A Scientist, A Gardner, A Mechanic, A Tailor, A Contractor, A Merchant, A Historian, A Philosopher, A Cleaner, A Leader are the few examples of the Society Pillars; infact where ever we look around us we see tons of different subjects who are holding our society on their shoulders; whereas the common objective of all these subjects are One and Only ONE and that is to provide better living and Prosperity for the living Creatures on the Face of this Universe...
... any Disruption/alteration or deviation of any of the above subject/pillar by any one individual or group is dealt with according to the full extent of the law (established and enforced by their founders/leaders in order to protect these mini societies Pillars and subjects...) These Pillars of our Society are still intact because there is a Leader and his sub ordinates for each and every Pillar who ensures the protection of it's boundaries and it's rules and regulations; as well as the society's... We have not Noticed even One single thing/example In our Daily life's routine, which is baseless, lawless (without any rules and regulations) and has under no leadership. IS there anyone Can present one Example of any holding Pillars of the society without leadership and which is not protected by it's own Rules and Regulations. One pillar cannot differ with other's rules and regulations such as mathematics rules can not conflict with Physic's formulas, nor all these different rules and regulations of thousand's of Pillars conflicts with our (human being's) general interests and ByLaws;
The Conclusion of this debate is that "We have noticed and Proved that their is no society/group/Culture/Religion/company/believer/non-believer and even a country without it's leadership and bylaws, even an Animal does have their leaders and strictly follow Nature's By laws with in their clan to whom they follow; only one example to refresh your memories; have u ever seen a Duck leading his clan/society... Therefore When we Look around this Universe we see very systematic and organized very well balanced rotation of the Universal System; so far we have not noticed any deviation/alteration and Disruptions in this Universe; which tells us that these mechanism is running and protected by some rules and regulations, and we have discussed and proved above that where ever we find rules and regulations; their must be a protector/leader who ensures the protection of it's by laws and boundaries... therefore WE THE HUMAN BEING CAN SAY THAT IT IS PROVEN THAT THEIR MUST BE SOME POWER HOLDING LEADER DOES EXISTS ANYWHERE, WHO ENSURES THE PROTECTION OF THE UNIVERSAL SYSTEM; NOW TELL ME WHO ELSE THAT COULD BE?... WE CAN CALL HIM PROTECTOR OF THE UNIVERSE/ GUARDIAN / HEALER / LORD / GOD / ALLAH / BHAGAWAN ... CALL HIM WHATEVER YOU FEEL IS RIGHT IT DOSEN'T MATTER TO HIM COZ HE DOES EXISTS AND HAS HIS OWN IDENTITY; AND THAT IDENTITY WE CAN REVEAL IF WE STAY INTACT AND PEACEFUL... Chao... Chill again... coz it's my resting period, I'm going to hibernation after this... Take Care Guys... Keep Posting peace message coz there is no harm in it... Peace for those too who don't believe in peace...
Yes We r still here... And will be here until someone gets frustrated, bored from these readings; Chil again with Peace...
P E A C E 4 A L L...
JUST CURIOSITY...Animals and other Creatures are Much Higher Than Human Beings in Numbers and Percentages; if we still need to follow the highest numbers, Why we don't start following them, though few among US Praise and worship them; why we all should not join them...do u still think or believe that we need to follow the highest no's/percentage?
My Dear Adey; for your kind references and help in future, I'm giving you the names of Almost all countries and their populated Cities (best Known to me), I'm only seeking your help in finding the name of the Countries where these Moari & Aboriginoal, Atheists, Agnostics and Deists and similar other non belivers of God can be Found...
Though the List is too Big, therefore; For Your Convenience I'm Copying only Countries Of Africa and Asia Here;
all Other Countries From Caribbean, Central, North and South America, Europe, Middle East, Pacific and Antarctica will be posted later as I finish typing them (SKDKAK... sorry Dear, Can't Copy and Past them here, Coz U can't find them all together... he eheheh)
R U READY MR.. ADEY.?... just update me with their presence in any of the following countries, with their percentage... No rush just take your time;
1. Countries found in Africa are as follows:
Algeria, Angola, Bennin, Botswana, Burkina Faso, Burundi, Cameroon, Canary Islands (Gran Cnaria & Tenerife), Cape Verde, Central African Republic, Chad, Comoros & Mayottee, Cote dIvoire, Democratic Republic of Congo, Djibouti, Egypt, Equatorial Guinea, Eritrea, Ethiopia, Gabon, Gambia (Fajara), Ghana, Guinea, Guinea-Bissau, Kenya (Nairobi), Lesotho, Liberia, Libya, Madagascar, Malawi, Mali (Bamako, Djenne', Mopti, Se'gou, Timbuktu), Mauritania, Mauritius, Morocco, Mozambique, Namibia, Niger, Nigeria, Republic of Congo, Reunion, Rawanda, Sao Tome & Principe, Senegal (Dakar, St-Lois), Seychelles, Sierra Leone, Somalia, South Africa (Cape Town, Jeffreys Bay, Johannesburg), Sudan, Swaziland, Tanzania (Zanzibar), Togo, Tunisia, Uganda, Zambia (Victoria Falls) and Zimbabwe
2. Countries and their (major populated cities) within Asia:
Afghanistan, Bangladesh, Bhutan, Brunei, Cambodia, (Phnom Penh, Siem Reap), China (Beijing, Hainan Dao, Hong Kong, Kunming, Macau, Shanghai, Tibet), East Timor, India (Benglore, Delhi, Goa, Hyderabad, Jaisalmer, Kolkata, Mumbai, Udaipur), Indonesia (Bali, Jakarta, Java, Lombok, Sumatra), Japan (Fukuoka, Kyoto, Nagoya, Osaka, Sapporo, Tokyo...), Kazakhstan, Kyrgyzstan, Laos (Luang Prabang, Vientiane), Malaysia, Maldives, Mongolia, Myanmar, Nepal (Kathmandu Pokhara), North Korea, South Korea, Pakistan (Karachi, Lahore, Islamabad...), Philippines (Manila..), Singapore, Sri Lanka (Colombo), Taiwan (Taipei), Tajikostan, Thailand (Bangkok, Chiang Mai, Ko Chang, Phuket...) Turkmenistan/Turkey,Uzbekistan, and Vietnam (Hanoi, Ho Chi Minh..)
let me Add Middle East without their major cities coz of space and time...too; Alphabetically starts from Bahrain, Iran, Iraq, Israel, Jordan, Kuwait, Lebanon, Oman, Of Course Qatar, Saudi Arabia, Syria, The Palestinian Territories, United Arab Emirates and Yemen...
... You work on these countries in the meantime I'll gather other names of the Countries for your research.... Thanks for your help Adey... Chill man, this is the Cost we all must pay if we need to find the truth; Hopefully you must be enjoying this too... Chill and Peace again and Again...
Eid Mubarak to all.
Hey you guys are still at it. You have some stamina
thanks for your participation and comments here, all comments and belivers and non belivers can come and debate here... This may lead us towards the prosperity and the Peace among mankind, Despite of our Believes and Practices; if we all come and unite to some common conclusive points...Keep Peace, and Help Maintaining it all the times... Peace on you and the People around U... just Convey the Peace Message to Everyone...
stay focused..the truth will make you a better person..
One common trait of the one who senses that he/she is about to lose the arguement is to divert the subject matter; get personal etc...seems we have this theme recurring in the atheists posts
ah..........one of our god fearing friends from across the pond.....So God exists.........yes in peoples minds and hearts.........and thats it. "Certain people have a problem with using their minds" yes are you are a prime example my friend. If you want to beleive in God, than thats good for you but don't belittle people who dont or have other views, its their right, as it is your right to beleive in God.
Does God exist? Absolutely.
The bedouin was asked how he concluded that a man and his camel had been in this place. He pointed to the footprints in the sand and the camel droppings. This is enlightened thought. He didn't see the camel or the man but through the rationale thought he came to the truth i.e the footprints were not made my themselves and neither was the camel droppings; they didn't just appear!
Yet when it comes to the creation of the universe, certain people have a problem with using their minds and resort to 'science'. As if science has an answer for everything. Science has been abused by the west and the atheists to try and make a theory called evolution into some sort of fact when it couldn't be further from the truth.The same scientists are now amending their 'facts' to take into account new discoveries..so much for their theories being fact! In fact scientific thought must be limited to a particular methodology of study of the characterisitics of the material objects subject to various conditions. Science cannot be used to make deductions about matter things which cannot be put under such conditions such as the origin of the universe.
If the magnificient complex time peice such as the watch is crafted by an expert then what about the universe? Is it not inevitable that this most complex of creation, which runs perfectly to a predefined system is dependant on the one who created it?
It is only the whim and desire of the few which blind them to the obvious.
Only 3 religions have Adam in their creation 'story'.
Some other religions have a 'first human' story that has similarities to the Abrahamic faiths, others like Maori and Aboriginal, to name but two, have vastly different and much more inventive creation stories.
As over half the world's population are not allied to the three Abrahamic faiths then these do not believe the Adam myth.
To count the number of people who actually dis-believe this myth we can categorize them as follows:
Those of other non Abrahamic faiths, atheists, agnostics and deists = 3.5 billion(approx)
Christians and other members of the Abrahamic faiths who see the creation story as an analogy = 1 billion (at the very least)
So the very maximum percentage of the world's population that believe this MYTH is about 30% and probably less (20-25%).
I'm afraid you are in a small minority of earth dwellers who believe this MYTH.
Peace
I don't go to mythical places with strange men.
-- Douglas Adams, The Long Dark Tea-Time of the Soul.
Peace for everyone... Would u pls mind explaining me your version of "Just convert by faith and true heart not by force or tradition. Follow your heart and not the others."
before U post your version; I would like to post mine first, correct me where I am wrong or mis understood and Why? Thanks in Advance...
I rather say this way .. .. actually I believe in "Supremacy of Heart over the Brain and the Body" "Only in few cases I allow My Brain to take Control Of the Body but still My brain functions/Act under the Supreme Command of my Heart" therefore all the evidences must go through my heart before analyzing by my brain, after analyzing the details brain sent his conclusion to the heart for the final review, where after analyzing the conclusions received from brain, heart gives the command to the brain to order the body parts to act accordingly...
Therefore, I strongly believe if anything does goes through someone's heart to his brain, it's actually tells him that the thing is Pure in it's Nature, otherwise it would have not gone through the heart... Peace
Un intentially we all use heart to function before Mind, let me give u an example; When ever U R Excited about anything or want to laugh,,, notice your heart palpitation, whenever U are sad or pressurized check your pulse again, Similarly, when U wrongfully shows your anger, your brain functions only, because heart goes into Hibernation, This act know as INSANITY among Human Being.. and do not come under any jurisdiction of any law Religion or Land... whereas the law applies on those wrongful acts committed under the Supremacy of Heart through Brain vice versa U'll be awarded if you act benefited other mankind or any other creatures existed on this planet... (Those Known as Noble People)
wise men needs just a hint, but i'm explaining lot here... Do U know Why?///?? .. For P E A C E .... Peace man...
Sorry Adey... I'm editing here again, coz i missed one point that u have said about 100% non belivers Do Not believe in Adam, Can U Just name me which Groups of non belivers of religions U R reffeing to; Please... Thanks... Peace again...
Peace on you Mr. Adey...how r u doing today? if I may, than let me say something in the begining that whatever I'm posting here is my personal point of view, and has nothing to do with any religion or group, i also appreciate very much if someone differs with my point of view, because his difference of opinion raises questions and i need those questions for my research which helps me raching my goals/destination. i always accept solid evidences only based on Nature's truth / history and the most important thing is Human's nature/interactions ...i do have a difference of opinon with others but i don't dis-respect anyone's personality/believes and i don't like to be disrespected by anyone... BECAUSE I DO EXIST
My way of thinking and believing things is different from the others, it's only because I accept and believe all the theories that comes to me until it's proven FALSE/WRONG, vice versa, IF SOMEONE TELLS ME THEIR IS NO GOD, I ACCEPT HIS THEORY UNTILL IT'S PROVEN DIFFERENTLY IN THE OTHER HAND IF HIS OPONENTS TELLS ME NO... THERE IS A GOD AND HE DOES EXISTS THEN I ALSO BELIEVE HIS THEORY UNTILL IT'S PROVEN FALSE/WRONG.
threfore, I request U to tell me who was the first man came into existence and how? What was his name, and Where U can Find His Family memebers. Do U have any details of any Ancectors of any family, who claims that their Ancestors were present 1000's of years ago or in such period of time when this universe came into existence?(I want U to know that i know them by their names each and their every Living
family members, I do have all the names with their places of birth, their no's of family members, and their childrens, children's family members... I would like to know your vesion,
by the way Malaysia is a Muslim Country 68% muslims, 20% buddhists, 9% Christianity, rest 3% are othr minorites... they all Believe in Adam and his First existenc as a Human Being/messanger on this plant. prove me If i'm wrong... till 15th century hinduism was the most recognised religion, Later 98% of hier population Converted to Islam, whereas all these currently 20% Folowers of Hindiuism Came From India's Tamil area to practice their religions...
I gave U my brief introduction, I'm not stranger to u anymore, U can come with me anywhere you want. Chao ... n Take Care.. Peace ...
"Only in few cases I allow My Brain to take Control......." :D :D :D :D
I think this encapsulates the whole debate :P
Peace
I don't go to mythical places with strange men.
-- Douglas Adams, The Long Dark Tea-Time of the Soul.
Peace for everyone... Would u pls mind explaining me your version of "Just convert by faith and true heart not by force or tradition. Follow your heart and not the others."
before U post your version; I would like to post mine first, correct me where I am wrong or mis understood and Why? Thanks in Advance...
I rather say this way .. .. actually I believe in "Supremacy of Heart over the Brain and the Body" "Only in few cases I allow My Brain to take Control Of the Body but still My brain functions/Act under the Supreme Command of my Heart" therefore all the evidences must go through my heart before analyzing by my brain, after analyzing the details brain sent his conclusion to the heart for the final review, where after analyzing the conclusions received from brain, heart gives the command to the brain to order the body parts to act accordingly...
Therefore, I strongly believe if anything does goes through someone's heart to his brain, it's actually tells him that the thing is Pure in it's Nature, otherwise it would have not gone through the heart... Peace
Just convert by faith and true heart not by force or tradition. Follow your heart and not the others.
Cardinal OF Qatar Living
that was confusing.
Sorry mate, I'll think you will find that 100% of non believers do not recognise the existence of Adam. I don't even think the Malaysian Astronaut believes in Adam, even if he does believe god created the Universe.
And I say this with respect to you but it beggars belief that anyone, in this day and age, with all our knowledge about biology ,chemistry, physics and earth science can still believe in Adam & Eve and the Abrahamic creation myth as a literal truth.
I don't go to mythical places with strange men.
-- Douglas Adams, The Long Dark Tea-Time of the Soul.
Peace man... and Good Morning as Well... Pls Enjoy the research work, presented by anyone, don't get personal, keep peace all the time... because only peace is key to our existence in this world... Peace again... .
I'm not a god/God (neither with Capital "G" nor Small "g") because people think that they can discuss/blame/deny/insult/question bla bla bla... HIM... Only Because HE never Answered us(people) Directly (SO FAR we know of), neither HE showed HIS interests who is saying WHAT? and whatever people's believes are? So I'll not talk or represent God here, Because if there is a God and Who ever He is; then I assure you He don't acknowledge our representation to HIM. Now You beleieve in me or not but I do represent myself and I don't allow anyone to represent me, therefore I represent Myself to you by answering your queries as Follows:...
My Dear SKDKAK.... We human Being (Specially, I) are Not HIM (god)... We do Response to the Queries; accordingly ,and if any query doesn't fits the Nature's Law... than Nature's law will prosecute those who doesn't comply... Therefore, i take the Liberty to Answer you Now as you Wished. No Heart Feelings Please...
Now back to your (hypothetically Series Of Un-Just Questions) Despite Whatever U and Others Believe in, just simply Can you please Give me the name of a person whom you know/believe or forced to believe in (because U don't have any alternative Name besides their's) came to existence in this world; WHAT WAS HIS NAME?;
Pls Do not think Too Much We all Know he was Adam... and he was also a Messanger, First messanger for all the exsisting religions on this planet; every-other non-belivers/non-followers of religions also do beleive on his (Adam's) existence as well....
by the Way For your knowledge and Information, Animals, Plants, Wind, Solar Systems, Sky ... infact This Whole Universe and it's Contents were pre-existed way before Human Came into Existence, I told u earlier in different forum (where No one Dare to Comments on the subject, I created that Forum only to get the true results based on my theory about All of US that; What We as a Human Being Want to Know and want to Discuss and What we are afraid to know and discuss and Why?)that Animals are THE MOST KNOWLEDGEABLE Creatures on the face of this Universe, they born knowledgeable and powerful, whereas a Human Being gain his knowledge based on his surroundings. Pls check your Surroundings, i not compatible with the society then still u have the chance to upgrade, that's why we are Human Being because we can Alter/Upgrade our knowledge to the Findings/results which are benefited to all of us and other creatures as well... if anyone Among Human Being doesn't Upgrade his Vision and Practices based on the true findings/results than he must be PREJUDICE OR INSANE, he should not consider his self as a Human Being...
Regarding your another hypothetical Question about Messengers, Do you think that someone care what do you believe in or not, but I do care what all the existing religions and their followers, science and other school of thoughts strongly believe that the one who came/born/sent first was "Adam" and he was the First Human Being and The Messenger of God...
So My dear SKDKAK... Think Positively, because Adam was the first human being and messenger of God (I didn't said messenger of Allah/Bhagwa/Lord...any other name of gods) was the same person The value of your questions DIES here.. THE END...Finito, Khalas, Finish,Tamam Shud... Since u don't take advices but this is Free ... Pls Think .... and think many times before U post anything; anywhere;
About your Fingers Pointing towards my research work,(U said was Copied-Pasted from Googleeeee) My Dear SKDKAK, I don't mind at all whatever your believes are; I totally support u by all means because your Comments shows that you need help, Serious Help... Do U know Why? because Neither U can Find/Prove that My Research work is Copied and Pasted from any book/net nor You can Prove about my writings that were someone talked/said earlier; it is better for you to prove yourself that you are knowledgeable than an Animal and your existence has benefited to the mankind/Creatures, than discuss something else
Finally your last Query about Eid; it's mean A thing which Comes back to it's order again, (muslims when they fast during the Month of Ramadan, they actually disrupt their daily routines, and Eid means they should come back to Their Daily Routine with the knowledge and results they gain during the period of Ramadan... but for you my Brother, EID will be the Day when you able to Distinguish Human Being from Animals. CAN U? I DARE U to prove that U have one Quality, which is u believe is better than an Animal... No Heart Feelings again, Coz I'm giving you an opportunity to think and research about something, which you have never thought about in your life ever... once again Peace Man... and Maintain It peacefully.... take Care... I'm Waiting... he hhe eheeeee...Chill man, No heart Feelings again...
Are you asking me that question? cant answer coz I dont really understand what you're asking.
Or the answer might be: Nothing, there are no such things as gods.
Peace
I don't go to mythical places with strange men.
-- Douglas Adams, The Long Dark Tea-Time of the Soul.
Good morning to all
Adey: ur """Creationism" or "Intelligent Design"" is superb. Just wanna ask these so called scientists.. What was Allah doing before he sent his messenger on earth. We (Humans) were here before his messengers came here... SO, what say.. Just a simple question for them
SZafar: U have been doing a vanishing act too often. Why do u have to just do copy paste from goooooooole. Use ur grey cells and also ur hands and lets know the real you not the goolge copy-pase Zafar.
What is the plan of Eid celebration. Anything special ??
Peace man... I'm working on my new research, these days; as soon I have some results; I'll update u guys as well.. till than PEACE...
An interesting couple of videos for your perusal.
&mode=related&search=Origin%20of%20Life%20Panspermia%20Abiogenesis%20Autocatalysis%20Clay%20Hypothesis%20RNA%20World%20Atheist%20Atheism%20Creation%20Creationist
&NR=1
I don't go to mythical places with strange men.
-- Douglas Adams, The Long Dark Tea-Time of the Soul.
haven't been here at Christmas time yet, skd, but I imagine it won't be too different. Will soon find out! :D
December is approaching and I used to enjoy this month in India due to Chrismas. Chrismas carrols and parties etc. etc..
How is it in Doha ??
reading anywhere that God joined/signed up anywhere to any particular relgion / denomination...
think I understand now.
Have a super hol - I'm off to munch my birthday take-away now.
Enjoy yourself on QL - I shall look forward to reading all when I have finished my 'tea' :D
No, just cant wait to be back in beautiful Jordan again on Friday for a WHOLE week!
I don't go to mythical places with strange men.
-- Douglas Adams, The Long Dark Tea-Time of the Soul.
Is Christmas coming earlier than usual this year?
but I found this wonderfully funny little story, well it made me laugh:
"Do people say they have evidence of God? I thought the whole point is that for faith to exist it has to be something you can't prove but believe to be true anyway? No one "believes in" gravity. All you have to do to prove it exists is to stand over a baby with a sharp knife and drop it. To prove that a benevolent deity exists the knife would probably have to stop falling and swerve into you while a burning bush across the road shouts out "die!"
:P
I don't go to mythical places with strange men.
-- Douglas Adams, The Long Dark Tea-Time of the Soul.
Do you understand the meaning of a common discussion forum. It means where all are welcome and share thoughts and understand the viewpoint of others. If there is a problem for you not able to understand few people here then u need to ask for it and you will be enlightened to the extent possible.
""I have noticed here that many of them even doesn't know what they are talking about? what is their beleive, what is their religion? Are they on the right path?""
Since when did you think we are here to disclose all our beliefs and religion. Or are you one among those that belong to the thought of ONE and only one religion is a fact and rest all are junk amd garbage.. Mind you there are a lot of them around. In any case, it realy doesn't matter whether you are one among the many or a person who really believes in all religions and faiths.
"Some trends developing in the USA such as "Creationism" or "Intelligent Design" prove by scientific evidence that all living things were created by Allah."
You will not find one scientist who says this is science, this is psydo-science with no evidence to back it up. You should read what some of these 'Intelligent Designers' believe(and CAN NOT prove),it's hilarious!
Please check them out, it's anti-science and in a lot of cases damn right lies.
PEACE
I don't go to mythical places with strange men.
-- Douglas Adams, The Long Dark Tea-Time of the Soul.
What about when that "perfect and complex organism" goes wrong and the "development of the glorious human" is perverted by such conditions as pre-eclampsia? This is the commonest and most dangerous complication of pregnancy, and women and many babies still die because of it. Where does this fit into the miracle?
***********
"There's this thing called being so open-minded your brains drop out". - Richard Dawkins
A proper survey conducted by a reputable publication actually asking foremost scientists what they believe and with percentages.
"How do you explain the fact that intelligent people believe in gods?
This is absolutely untrue especially among scientists.
Recent demographic surveys of the United States of America indicate that as of the year 2000, 14% of Americans did not consider religion to be an important part of their lives. This figure is up from 10% in 1990. Only 0.5% of the population at large responded that they were atheist. However, this number skyrockets when you switch the focus to scientist and rises even higher when one considers “greater” scientists.
In 1914, psychologist James H. Leuba conducted a landmark survey of belief among scientist. Leuba found that the majority of a randomly selected scientist doubted the existence of god. When he narrowed his sample to the “greater” scientists, doubt rose further. He repeated the survey 20 years later and found that the percentages of those doubting the existence of god had risen further.
In 1998, the publication Nature repeated Leuba’s survey. The results are summarized in the table below. For purposes of the modern survey, “greater” scientists were defined as members of the National Academy of Science.
Year
1914 1933 1998
Atheist 52 % 68 % 72 %
Agnostic 21 % 17 % 21 %
Believer 27 % 15 % 7 %
Doubt is highest among NAS biologist at 95%. Physicists come in a close second at 93% while mathematicians are at the low end with 86% either atheists or agnostics.
In addition, most well known and widely published scientists have stated publicly that they are either atheists or agnostics including Noam Chomsky, Steven Hawking, Richard Dawkins, E.O. Wilson and the late scientists Carl Sagan, Stephen Jay Gould, and Richard Feynman. Surveying the history of physics, I can only find one notable name of an individual who believed in the existence of god and was a regular attendee of a religion, namely James Clerk Maxwell who born, lived and died a Scottish Presbyterian."
See Leading Scientists still reject God. Nature, Vol 394, July 23 1998, www.nature.com/nature.
I don't go to mythical places with strange men.
-- Douglas Adams, The Long Dark Tea-Time of the Soul.
"The great majority of modern physicists accept the fact of creation as we set foot in the 21st century.
HA HA , If you mean 'Creation' by a 'god' you should write comedy - where did you get that dis-information from?
I don't go to mythical places with strange men.
-- Douglas Adams, The Long Dark Tea-Time of the Soul.
And among His Signs, He shows you the lightning, by way both of fear and of hope, and He sends down rain from the sky and with it gives life to the earth after it is dead: verily in that are Signs for those who are wise. (Surat ar-Rum: 24)
Science leads us to the conclusion that the universe has a Creator and this Creator is perfect in might, wisdom and knowledge. It is religion that shows us the way in knowing Allah. It is therefore possible to say that science is a method we use to better see and investigate the realities addressed by religion. Nevertheless, today, some of the scientists who step forth in the name of science take an entirely different stand. In their view, scientific discoveries do not imply the creation of Allah. They have, on the contrary, projected an atheistic understanding of science by saying that it is not possible to reach Allah through scientific data: they claim that science and religion are two clashing notions.
As a matter of fact, this atheistic understanding of science is quite recent. Until a few centuries ago, science and religion were never thought to clash with each other, and science was accepted as a method of proving the existence of Allah. The so-called atheistic understanding of science flourished only after the materialist and positivist philosophies swept through the world of science in the 18th and 19th centuries.
Particularly after Charles Darwin postulated the theory of evolution in 1859, circles holding a materialistic world view started to ideologically defend this theory, which they looked upon as an alternative to religion. The theory of evolution argued that the universe was not created by a creator but came into being by chance. As a result, it was asserted that religion was in conflict with science. The British researchers Michael Baigent, Richard Leigh and Henry Lincoln said on this issue:
For Isaac Newton, a century and a half before Darwin, science was not separate from religion but, on the contrary, an aspect of religion, and ultimately subservient to it. ...But the science of Darwin's time became precisely that, divorcing itself from the context in which it had previously existed and establishing itself as a rival absolute, an alternative repository of meaning. As a result, religion and science were no longer working in concert, but rather stood opposed to each other, and humanity was increasingly forced to choose between them...23
As we stated before, the so-called split between science and religion was totally ideological. Some scientists, who earnestly believed in materialism, conditioned themselves to prove that the universe had no creator and they devised various theories in this context. The theory of evolution was the most famous and the most important of them. In the field of astronomy as well certain theories were developed such as the "steady-state theory" or the "chaos theory". However, all of these theories that denied creation were demolished by science itself, as we have clearly shown in the previous chapters.
Today, scientists who still keep to these theories and insist on denying all things religious, are dogmatic and bigoted people, who have conditioned themselves not to believe in Allah. The famous English zoologist and evolutionist D.M.S. Watson confesses to this dogmatism as he explains why he and his colleagues accept the theory of evolution:
If so, it will present a parallel to the theory of evolution itself, a theory universally accepted, not because it can be proved by logically coherent evidence to be true, but because the only alternative, special creation, is clearly incredible.24
What Watson means by "special creation" is Allah's creation. As acknowledged, this scientist finds this "unacceptable". But why? Is it because science says so? Actually it does not. On the contrary, science proves the truth of creation. The only reason why Watson looks upon this fact as unacceptable is because he has conditioned himself to deny the existence of Allah. All other evolutionists take the same stand.
Evolutionists rely not on science but on materialist philosophy and they distort science to make it agree with this philosophy. A geneticist and an outspoken evolutionist from Harvard University, Richard Lewontin, confesses to this truth:
It is not that the methods and institutions of science somehow compel us to accept a material explanation of the phenomenal world, but, on the contrary, that we are forced by our a priori adherence to material causes to create an apparatus of investigation and a set of concepts that produce material explanations, no matter how counter-intuitive, no matter how mystifying to the uninitiated. Moreover, that materialism is absolute, so we cannot allow a Divine Foot in the door.25
On the other hand, today, just as in history, there are, as opposed to this dogmatic materialist group, scientists who confirm Allah's existence, and regard science as a way of knowing Him. Some trends developing in the USA such as "Creationism" or "Intelligent Design" prove by scientific evidence that all living things were created by Allah.
This shows us that science and religion are not conflicting sources of information, but that, on the contrary, science is a method that verifies the absolute truths provided by religion. The clash between religion and science can only hold true for certain religions that incorporate some superstitious elements as well as divine sources. However, this is certainly out of the question for Islam, which relies only on the pure revelation of Allah. Moreover, Islam particularly advocates scientific enquiry, and announces that probing the universe is a method to explore the creation of Allah. The following verse of the Qur'an addresses this issue;
Do they not look at the sky above them? How We have built it and adorned it, and there are no rifts therein? And the earth - We have spread it out, and set thereon mountains standing firm, and caused it to bring forth plants of beauteous kinds (in pairs). And We send down from the sky blessed water whereby We give growth unto gardens and the grain of crops. And tall palm-trees, with shoots of fruit-stalks, piled one over another. (Surah Qaf, 6-7, 9-10)
As the above verses imply, the Qur'an always urges people to think, to reason and to explore everything in the world in which they live. This is because science supports religion, saves the individual from ignorance, and causes him to think more consciously; it opens wide one's world of thought and helps one grasp the signs of Allah self-evident in the universe. Prominent German physicist Max Planck said that "everyone who, regardless of his field, studies science seriously is to read the following phrase on the door of the temple of science: 'Have faith'". According to him, faith is an essential attribute of a scientist.26
All the issues we have treated so far simply put it that the existence of the universe and all living things cannot be explained by coincidences. Many scientists who have left their mark on the world of science have confirmed, and still confirm this great reality. The more people learn about the universe, the higher does their admiration for its flawless order becomes. Every newly-discovered detail supports creation in an unquestionable way.
The great majority of modern physicists accept the fact of creation as we set foot in the 21st century. David Darling also maintains that neither time, nor space, nor matter, nor energy, nor even a tiny spot or a cavity existed at the beginning. A slight quick movement and a modest quiver and fluctuation occurred. Darling ends by saying that when the cover of this cosmic box was opened, the tendrils of the miracle of creation appeared from beneath it.27
Besides, it is already known that almost all the founders of diverse scientific branches believed in Allah and His divine books. The greatest physicists in history, Newton, Faraday, Kelvin and Maxwell are a few examples of such scientists.
Max Planck
Max Planck Isaac Newton
Sir Isaac Newton
In the time of Isaac Newton, the great physicist, scientists believed that the movements of the heavenly bodies and planets could be explained by different laws. Nevertheless, Newton believed that the creator of earth and space was the same, and therefore they had to be explained by the same laws.He expanded this view in his book stating that the perfect system of the sun and planets could only survive under the control and dominance of a mighty and wise being.28
As is evident, thousands of scientists who have been doing research in the fields of physics, mathematics, and astronomy since the Middle Ages all agree on the idea that the universe is created by a single Creator and always focus on the same point. The founder of physical astronomy, Johannes Kepler, stated his strong belief in God in one of his books in which he declared that we, as poor, inadequate servants of God, have to see the greatness of God’s wisdom and might and sumbit ourselves to Him. 29
The great physicist, William Thompson (Lord Kelvin), who established thermodynamics on a formal scientific basis, was also a Christian who believed in God. He had strongly opposed Darwin's theory of evolution and totally rejected it. He explained shortly before his death that when it looks at the origins of life, science certainly confirms the existance of that Great Power.30
One of the professors of physics at Oxford University, Robert Mattheus states the same fact in his book published in 1992 where he explains that DNA molecules were created by God. Mattheus says that all these stages proceed in a perfect harmony from a single cell to a living baby, then to a little child, and finally to an adolescent. All these events can be explained only by a miracle, just as in all the other stages of biology. Mattheus asks how such a perfect and complex organism can emerge from such a simple and tiny cell and how a glorious HUMAN is created from a cell even smaller than the dot on the letter. He finally concludes that this is nothing short of a miracle.31
Some other scientists who admit that the universe is created by a Creator and who are known by their cited attributes are:
Robert Boyle (the father of modern chemistry)
Iona William Petty (known for his studies on statistics and modern economy)
Michael Faraday (one of the greatest physicists of all times)
Gregory Mendel (the father of genetics; he invalidated Darwinism with his discoveries in the science of genetics)
Louis Pasteur (the greatest name in bacteriology; he declared war on Darwinism)
John Dalton (the father of atomic theory)
Blaise Pascal (one of the most important mathematicians)
John Ray (the most important name in British natural history)
Nicolaus Steno (a famous stratiographer who investigated earth layers)
Carolus Linnaeus (the father of biological classification)
Georges Cuvier (the founder of comparative anatomy)
Matthew Maury (the founder of oceanography)
Thomas Anderson (one the pioneers in the field of organic chemistry)
I'll write in my spare time another perspective; Proving the Existanse of GOD and His Religion by using basic rules and Regulations; set by Intelectuals and Scholars, One can not research if he didn't oblige the Laws/Rules... I'm sorry Dear, that's all for the day, I'm so tired need s a complete rest, Hope to C y again, Bye...
if as you say:
"without seeking any help/reference from any existing religion these days, word of mouth or book references..." we have to find our own path.
You're quite right of course in this respect, so I'll share this point of view: People that do not believe in a god are more moral than those that have a default, not my responsibility, god back-up. The quote is from the film maker David Cronenberg:
"It was apparent to me that religion was an invented thing, a wish-fulfillment thing, a fantasy thing. It was much more real, dangerous, to accept that mortality was the end for you as an individual. Murder...(is a) physical act of absolute destruction because you're ending something, a body, that is unique. That person never existed before, will never exist again, will not be karmically recycled, will not go to heaven; therefore I take it seriously."
Those of us that rationally don't believe tend to treat life as a very serious and unique time which impacts on our morality to a great degree; we don't need a hereditary acquired mental disorder to find our way in, and make sense of, life. Sorry if that sounds harsh, and its not pointed at anyone personally as I understand its the greatest benignly(in most circumstances) intended hoodwink in the history of our species, but i call it as I see it.
I don't go to mythical places with strange men.
-- Douglas Adams, The Long Dark Tea-Time of the Soul.
I do not differ at all, but if someone needs to prove some thing like this topic he needs to decide the boundries first, in which he needs to look in, got to involve each and every espect of it's surroundings to know and prove the subject, which is I'm doing... without seeking any help/reference from any existing religion these days, word of mouth or book references...
I agree with aak point of view that its the reponsibility of one to find the right path for his survival on the day of judgement. One cannot say that he was born in XYZ religion therefore he was not aware of the right path. Al Mighty has given so many options to mankind to find him, so many maricles around us, who is the creator of Universe? the sky, sea, earth?
What about the Prophets ? Who were those ? Messengers of Allah (GOD) ??
Instead of discussing what we don't know is useless, we should first do the research from the reliable sources, from the religious people discuss the religion and see which religion is inviting you for your better life and your generations and once we have the true knowledge of religion then we should discuss on it.
I have noticed here that many of them even doesn't know what they are talking about? what is their beleive, what is their religion? Are they on the right path?
Sayed Ali Zakir
Have a look at this regarding your statement:
"AND THEIR NUMBER OF WORSHIPERS/BELIEVERS PROOVES THAT THE GOD DOES EXISTS TO BE PRAISED BY THE MANKIND"
I don't go to mythical places with strange men.
-- Douglas Adams, The Long Dark Tea-Time of the Soul.
Helloo Guys... Is this Discussion ends here? Seems very quite here, don't u gyus wanna raise any question to my research posted earlier...
does indeed exist in dictionaries with and without a capital letter.
So do the words Utopia, Dodo, Evolution and Supercalafragerlisticexpeallidosouis (well in a film it does :) )
I don't go to mythical places with strange men.
-- Douglas Adams, The Long Dark Tea-Time of the Soul.
FROM MY POINT OF VIEW: What is yours?
This is a discussion for Academic researchers and Philosophers or a religious students who are searching for the truth; though various philosophers from different school of thoughts have discussed FOR and AGAINST the Existence of GOD; but I'm refraining myself to seek any example or help for any religion or thoughts into my discussion;
Usually we discuss only those things, whom are Known to us by any means... (There is no Question about it, that; We all aware of this fact, that; there are some means of knowing someone or something, Via News Media, Views of others, by writing/reading, by the world of Mouth, Visual experience, Advertisement, by smelling, tasting or feelings, by using Our Instinct and Miracle,..etc.., are some examples I can add here, in fact it could be anything else, which conveys something in us; give us the knowledge to discuss about that thing,
it is quiet obvious that NO ONE among us (mankind), can discuss about a thing that we don't know about... (Dear Reader; I don't know who is reading this; therefore I can not discuss/comment about U, at least i need a least info about u to discuss such as, your Gender, Name, Place, Education, Reason to Interest in, Age, School of thought u belongs to, or u post some comments back to me... ect...)
If uptil now, this point is clear to u, than we can proceed further and U can follow me; otherwise; Please "STOP HERE"... DO NOT PROCEED... convince me first about your views in this regards... and I'll try to redirect my search based upon your views, others who understand this point can proceed...
In order to prove the above Subject; Selected for this Forum by Gypsy; I need to discuss few more things about the WORD G.O.D (God), we need to know that; how this WORD G.O.D (God) came into EXISTENCE in our dictionaries and from their to our Daily USE, This is another fact that any WORD we use in our daily life has some meanings/values based on our Custom, society, Location, Language and Believe; but when someone use the WORD G.O.D (God),Even though, he is referring to the One he believed that his Mighty Power; he has to define It's meanings using his own way of believes... because there is no Physical Evidence of GOD, so far, nor anyone has/had seen Him ever Before, till to date; October 07, 2007; all the meanings and explanation used by human being about GOD are self-explanatory and different among different groups/religions;
Since the WORD G.O.D (God) does Exists in our dictionaries, therefore, we can say that there was something un seen, superlative power, to someone or some group of people in early ages; who introduced the word "GOD" among the mankind; Maybe they felt, assumed, realized, invented, created, his word, whatsoever was the reason, my conclusion is that this WORD G.O.D "God", does exists in our Dictionaries; My Conclusion to this paragraph is Whether U believe in the WORD G.O.D (God) or not but infact it does exist in our dictionaries, and dictionaries doesn't belongs to any group or religion... therefore we can say that the WORD G.O.D (God) does EXISTS, who-ever denies this fact must have some solid contradictory grounds; and I would like to hear about your views in this regard, others who are Agreed to this conclusion; can proceed further with me...
Since we are agreed with the Existence of the WORD G.O.D (God), that the WORD God does exists in our world at least in dictionaries/books;
Now we need to know what is the Meaning of GOD?
Before I proceed further here... I have a QUESTION from ALL of YOU, I challenge every existing Human Being, through this Forum to give me the actual Meanings of the word "ODG" and "OGD"... REMEMBER this, that; these words "ODG" and "OGD" Can be used as an abbreviations to any name of the group/organization, What i need U 2 search and tell me the actual Meaning of OGD and ODG... ... ... ... Come on Guys how much time do u think u need 4 research... come back... These Words Does not Exists to carry any meaning within them, these words OGD and ODG are meaningless words and only can be used as an abbreviations to some group or Organizations, phrase... DESPITE of all these meaningless words "ODG" and "OGD" they do Exists among us... and some particular people and the people concerned to use these terms "ODG" and "OGD" for their own use and benefits... these words "ODG" and "OGD" has NULL value among the other Human Beings... my second conclusion is that these words "ODG" and "OGD" does not belong to any group / religion / organization / school to thoughts / or any philosopher... therefore anyone can use these abbreviations "ODG" and "OGD" to their own use and benefit, for an example I SAY HERE THAT OGD IS THE ABBREVIATIONS OF "ON GOOD DEEDS(OGD)" AND ODG IS THE ABBREVIATIONS OF "OVER DIZZY GOATS(ODG), is there anyone who have any ground to object my explanations to the words "ODG" and "OGD"? Anyone can use these words the way they feel is right, and who ever intends to deal with u must use and accept your terminology for "ODG" and "OGD", whereas if u come to me that u need to follow my terminology not others; my conclusion from this debate is that the WORD "ODG" and "OGD" has three Alphabets used in the Name of G.O.D (GOD) if we assume that when this word was invented/created, every human being used this word GOD for their own purpose and benefits differently when used in their own Language, Culture, Society, Religion, etc... therefore we find different names such as El/Elohim, Bhagawan, Allah, Holy Trinity/Ghost/Spirit, Jehovah, Zeus, Lord, Ishvar, OM, Khuda' and many more are the names used by different people, Groups, religions, Since the English is from one of the most widely spoken language of our time, so when people from other believes and areas translate the meaning of their Creator into English; they choose the most commonly translation used in English Language; which is GOD/Lord; (After the 9-11's brutal incident Allah is the most popular word after God/Lord, used among us), therefore my third Conclusion is that If one needs to know the meaning of GOD/Lord, he must have look into the other details/definition used by other religions and groups using under their Perspective; but the General meanings of God is the Creator of the Universe and Mankind, and the Crator of all the Creatures in this Universe, So if we are Discussing about the One who is the Creator of this Universe and Everything Existing here within this Universe is reffered to HIM, than we simply have reached the conclusion that God of all religion and Groups mentioned above, DOES EXISTS... ...
FINAL CONCLUSION;
THUS; THE DISCUSSION ABOUT THE EXISTENCE OF GOD DOES ENDS HERE; COZ THE NAME OR WORD GOD DOES EXIST FOR EVERY HUMAN BEING IN THEIR DICTIONARIES AND BOOKS; ONLY THE REAL EXISTENCE WAS QUESTIONED HERE; AND THE REAL EXISTENCE OF GOD IS PROVEN BY THE GROUPS/RELIGIONS WHO NAMED HIM TO BELIEVE HIM AS; EL, ALLAH, LORD, HOLY TRINITY, ISHVAR, BHAGAWAN, KHUDA' ZEUS, JEHOVAH, AND LOTS OF OTHER NAMES COMMONLY OR PRIVATELY USED BY DIFFERENT HUMAN BEINGS, ACTUALLY IS THE SAME WHEN TRANSLATED INTO ENGLISH; ALL THESE DIFFERENT NAMES OF GOD, IN DIFFERENT GROUPS AND CULTURES; AND THEIR NUMBER OF WORSHIPERS/BELIEVERS PROOVES THAT THE GOD DOES EXISTS TO BE PRAISED BY THE MANKIND;
ANSWER #2. BASED UPON ABOVE CONCLUSION WE CAN SAY THAT GOD DOES OT POSESS ANY RELIGION COZ RELIGION MEANS A GROUP OF WORSHIPER/PRACTITIONERS AND GOD DOES NOT FITS IN THIS CATEGORY TO WORSHIP/PRACTICE SOMEONE OR HIS OWN LAWS... IT IS DISCRIMINATORY TO GOD IF HE ADDOPT/SUPPORT ANY PARTICUALR RELIGION COZ HE IS THE LORD OF ALL MENKIND, AND HE SETS THE RULES AN REGULATIONS FOR THAT RELIGION, FOR THAT PARTICULAR PERIOD OF TIME/AREA/PEOPLE, UNLESS HIS FOLLOWER DOSEN'T MAKE BRING ANY MAJOR CHANGES/AMMENDMENTS IN THE RULE AND REGULATIONS OF THAT RELIGION; IF THE RELIGION'S LAW ARE PURE, AND BENEFITED TO HIM AND OTHER MENKIND, THEN GOD OWN THAT RELIGONS AND THEIR FOLLOWRS AS WELL; THEREFORE WE THE PEOPLE NEED TO BELONG WITH A RELIGION TO BELONG WITH GOD; GOD DOES NOT NEED TO BELONG TO THE RELIGION TO BELONG WITH US, COZ WE CAN NOT BE BENNIFITED TO GOD IN ANY MEANS... THAT'S ALL FOLKS FOR TODAY...
Finally I would like to add that after all these efforts writing all these here I still say that this is my personal point of View to the question about the existence of God?
if still someone is not Satisfied/agreed than I will try to use some other common examples around us, for that u need to ask me personally by messaging me, I assure u that I'll try not to seek any support from any religion/Group to Proove your Question. I appreciate your comments and views in this regard, pls update me as well, Thank You, Zafar Naqvi
Something along the lines of there is no power except in Allah the all powerful. It's a common expression used by Arabs to signify impatience. It is usually said in place of "counting to ten" in engligh to gather yourslef before a reply. At least that's my take on it....am I right Frog?
As for the OP...Gypsy hasn't posted in awhile, I got defensive because Adey, Skdkak, and others (me too) were throwing thoughts around when you made your comment. Still I like this thread and gave her credit for posting it. If you find it (and others of her posting) not to your liking, you can easily avoid them.
Stay safe all.
Perfection does not exist. The question therefore, is: what level of imperfection are we willing to settle for?
Millions of people used to Believe in Zeus and Odin, and we now are certain that they were wrong Canarybird....so it doesn't matter how many believe, its WHAT they believe in that counts.
And the fact that MOST people follow the ten commandments....which they themselves come from Hamurabi's code (thousands of years before Moses) should give you a clue about what is divine and what is man made.
But like I awlays say...whatever works for YOU (people in general).
Stay safe all.
Perfection does not exist. The question therefore, is: what level of imperfection are we willing to settle for?
Anybody care to explain what Froggy is upto and what is he trying to communicate. ""لا حول ولا قوة إلا بالله العلي العظيم ""
I thought he knew english a little time ago .. can't say anything now.
As I have refereed many many times in this forum.. when you try to put some logical and rational question to some characters ... they go into their shell and resort to many things, one of the example is above ...
لا حول ولا قوة إلا بالله العلي العظيم
[img_assist|nid=38314|title=Crazy Frog|desc=|link=node|align=left|width=180|height=179]
Some are Wise ... Some are ...Otherwise
""1)If you think its a waste of time to post in threads which contain so called rubbish questions...then why are you posting in it?
2)And even if you do think it's a rubbish question....maybe others don't....who made you the police of what we should consider rubbish or not?""
Chill dear. there are a lot of Frogs here who by nature live in a pond or a well . do not know the outside world. And when you try to show them a lake, sea or a river.. frogs cant digest there is something larger and better then the well it lives in.
These characters have a habbit of meddling in other's affairs without contributing anything whether for or against.
Ask these characters any academic question and they become blank..
Lets not dilute what we are discussing.. we have better things to discuss than frogs .. do not waste your energy on unwanted things.
One does not arrive at a stage where he says that he has the absolute truth. Hence, no one can speak of God in absolute terms, due to his human limitations. Man’s search for God is constant and continuous. This striving takes him one step closer to God every day.
Finally, God is the absolute, and we all deal with relative truth. All that we speak of religion, all that we speak of God, all that we speak of saints, everything is only relative. We can never be absolute in our expression of God. We can never comprehend Him, and even if we start to express it, we only create mistakes. That humility is needed in every religion, and every religious leader. Only God is absolute, and we all deal with relative truth. All our expressions, our methodologies, our dogmas, our rituals, and liturgies, are relative.
[img_assist|nid=28861|title=believe and u will see...Life is as simple as we make it complicated|desc=|link=none|align=left|width=122|height=180]
It's only a discussion people and it is more interesting than jibber jabber as many of QL participants have a very different view on God or religeon for that matter.
Throughout mankind people have believed in various Gods or idols to prevent them living without hope and as mentioned above security.
There are many things in the world that can't and don't have an explanation and which leaves room for serious doubt, however, don't you think is is a little mysterious that so many millions of people, whether Muslim or Christian believe in one God and that belief is carrying a great many followers who have not seen God but believe in him anyway.
We don't really know if God gave Moses the ten commandments but we do live our lives according to those commandments (most of us).
Under the motto seeing is believing is irrelevant in this case because we will believe what we want to whether we see it or not.
not to be worry frog. the writer not to be question now. i to be write all answer to gyspsy in morse code and writer gypsy to be still put head on wall bang bang to understand code. she to be say only what what what friendraj. hey hey hey !!!!
gypsy dit dit dat dat dit dit dit dit.
At the beginning I was commenting, but when I saw that the writer keeps on asking the same questions which are provoking more than anything else, I did speak out my heart. The so called writer did not accept critics and she started responding on a sarcastic tone....so what would you expect from me ? to stay in my corner? I prefer people who try to provide answers rather than those who keep on questioning anything and everything. Unfortunately this is the case for this thread author. Try to track her writing and you will see yourself : Asking about Marriage , religion, God pffffffffffff .
[img_assist|nid=38314|title=Crazy Frog|desc=|link=node|align=left|width=180|height=179]
Some are Wise ... Some are ...Otherwise
1)If you think its a waste of time to post in threads which contain so called rubbish questions...then why are you posting in it?
2)And even if you do think it's a rubbish question....maybe others don't....who made you the police of what we should consider rubbish or not?
Stay safe all.
Perfection does not exist. The question therefore, is: what level of imperfection are we willing to settle for?
I'm spicing up the does God Exist thread, so now I want you to tell me that if he/she/it/what? does exist, what religion does ? belong to?
Then Prove it. Mawahahahahahaha.
No seriously, prove it.
IF THAT IS WHAT YOU CALL A SERIOUS THREAD , THEN I WOULD GO READ SOME JOKES FOR SURE, but before I would just tell you again: your posts are full of nonsense and you're making people lose their precious time in responding to such rubbish questions.
[img_assist|nid=38314|title=Crazy Frog|desc=|link=node|align=left|width=180|height=179]
Some are Wise ... Some are ...Otherwise
I find myslef unable to agree or disagree with you because i'm not understanding your point exactly.
Are you saying God does not exist because we made up the word? Obviously the words (language), the ink, the books themselves are all man made, but we are discussing if the message is too.
Do you think it was also made by man, or truly divinely inspired by a powerful creator who sent messengers?
Stay safe all.
P.S. No need to send me those lengthy copies of your posts in my PM, I can read the threads just fine.
Perfection does not exist. The question therefore, is: what level of imperfection are we willing to settle for?
While it MAY be true (or not, we are not certain)....it would seem to indicate that ANY belief will do.
After all, we have had (recorded human history) that predates the current incarnation of God by a few thousand years....and mankind survived.
But that is a great point....our belief in God now, does for us exactly what belief in older mythologies did for earlier humans....provide a security blanket for our fears.
But most believers today foam at the mouth when I call their religions mythologies too lol.
Also, I realize that a LOT of people need something to believe in, but not ALL do....i'm just fine admitting I don't know what comes after death (for example)....and i'm not immoral or evil (at least I hope not).
Stay safe all.
Perfection does not exist. The question therefore, is: what level of imperfection are we willing to settle for?
Well we can't see air but we know we need it and it's there.
Deep rooted belief is what keeps nearly all human race alive.
If the majority of mankind did not believe in God, there would probably be no tomorrow.
I really appricaiate ur coments, well, taken as compliments, thank u again C ya, Bye... Later... PEACE
I will surely comment on whatever I understood but later as I also have to go.
I strongly believe in God and is strictly my personal belief. I am not for or against God and am trying to be as neutral as possible.
Its only a discussion forum and will c ya later.
Got to go now.
C ya soon and take care
at least u can admit whatever u feel and what ur Instinct is guiding u towards... Therefore I have mentioned at the end that this is my point of view and I'm waiting for your approval otherwise if anyone has any objection than he must raise his objection particularly to the topic by explainig me in details what he is objecting and What is the Reason> then I'll try my level best to answer again..
I can only say excellent and well written.
U have proved your point of view and you are in agreement with all that you have written.
But theoritically writing and assuming does not prove anything. We are just trying to put some thoughts here and are guaging what common people have thoought about God.
When all of us agree with it or with any or all that you just wrote - then only can u cnclude "DOES EXISTS... ..."
Just by ur concluding nothing happens. All have to agree with you
Peace on all of U; hello skdkak and ragnarock.. how r u guys today... hope better... enjoy the reading and keep posting here.... i'll be back for the update, after 3 hrs from now. thanks
Good morning all,
Very enlightening thus far Adey and Skdak (and everyone else), but I fear the question of God(s)'s existence will never be agreed upon by everyone.
Either you choose logic and go the athiest's way, or you go with faith and believe...but in all my years of discussing this, it ALWAYS boils down (eventually) to: It's god's word, who do you think you are that you know more than god!
I guess we all know which side of the debate i'm on....but in the end, to each his own...and I cannot stress this enough....as long as you let everyone Chose what works for them!!!
Stay safe all.
Perfection does not exist. The question therefore, is: what level of imperfection are we willing to settle for?
Good morning Guys...
What have you all been doing since last 19 hrs. There is absolutely nothing happened here since I left yesterday. Pin drop silence.
Where are you guys ??????
We have yet to establish God's existence and his/her religion...
supposedly creation took 6 day and god rested on the 7th according to the old testament, the Quran says 6 days for creation also.
I agree, because without a god religion is just a bunch of people doing similar things.
I don't go to mythical places with strange men.
-- Douglas Adams, The Long Dark Tea-Time of the Soul.
its a nice place to be but have to go now.
Chauu guys, c ya tomorrow.
I do not know which book/s says 6 days. All i know about is creation in 7 days. Sorry for my poor knowledge...
Lets first try to prove whether he/she exists then go to next part of who/where/when/why/which etc. etc. ??
that creatures are all the same is WRONG- they are not all the same. Crocodiles for example are different depending where in the world they are. Why did a creator make different 'drawings' of them?
Darwin's theory of natural selection is a well supported 'theory' but evolution is a fact- you can actually see it at the virus level, do you think 'god' just alters viruses to be drug resistant to punish us?
In that case 'god' is still creating, so it didn't take 6 days as two of 'his' books say.
Thus 'his' books are contradictory and as god is infallible then these cant be 'his' books or 'his WORD'.
Thus you cant use these books as evidence for god.
So what other proof you got?
I don't go to mythical places with strange men.
-- Douglas Adams, The Long Dark Tea-Time of the Soul.
Two things worth mentioning here.
1. If u read the topic again ""does God Exist thread..." we started with if (IF) God exists.
2. we are trying to go cronologically. When u agree God exists then only can we go ahead and discuss the second part ""what religion does ? belong to?""
Can u decide which topic we should discuss, coz we were discussing Which Religion God Belongs too and now we r discussing about the exsistece of the God, and How? Come on My Dear... Pick Your Topic, I believe in this case We must Choose Exsistence of God, since exsistence is not proven, how cum V can Jump to discuss God and His Religion
if i ask all of u to draw a pictre or write down an essay, do u think that you can draw identically ideal pictures and write same essay using same wordings as others, I believe it is not possible for any ordinary Human Being, if some special people, try to Draw an Identical Pictre then there must be a dispute among them claiming which picture belogs to whome because both pictures ar identical, whereas all the Creatures in this Universe, and their species are Identicaly same, lets say picture of Palm Tree and write an essay on Palm tree.. There Picture's size, colors, combinations, number of scatches, amout of time to complete, will be different... and anyother can tell the difference between both pictures even though both had drawn palm tree on a paper..similarly both explaining about palm tree, but using their own words/sentences... whereas We don't see any difference in this Universe among any CREATURES, which leads us to the conlusion that thir must be ONLY ONE CREATOR who created them so perfectly.. have u seen a body without face? meaning, that the face is the only part of our body which differenciate us among eachother, circulation of our solar system around their orbit gravity for US but tree grows against gravity Y? lots of these questions and their answers leads us towars the ONE CREATOR OF ALL THESE CREATURES AND UNIVERSE. Coz we don't See any difeerence/conflict and trouble in this World. therefore, based on this, we can asume that their is Only One Creator, who is the Creator of Eyerything, us and around us,;
I have no idea.
The whole World's been waiting for such proof since man first thought up the idea. and we are still waiting.
I don't need to prove he/she/it doesn't exist, as you don't need to prove a negative, the same way I don't need to prove that Santa Claus, fairies, or Unicorns don't exist.
I don't go to mythical places with strange men.
-- Douglas Adams, The Long Dark Tea-Time of the Soul.
Well said, any idea how to prove what, where and which god exists..?
I, and many others , could form a group that believe The Beatles were the best band ever - doesn't make us a religion.
Prove god exists, anyone of them will do.
I don't go to mythical places with strange men.
-- Douglas Adams, The Long Dark Tea-Time of the Soul.
There r two meanings of this Question let me start with first one; Do U know what is the meaning of Religion; I believe Religion means "A Group or Set Of Common Belivers and practitioner;" if I am right than allow me that i can explain u more here but it seems good enough for wise people. Therefore, my friend, No one can Associate God with any particular Religion b/Coz Religion Belongs to Group and God meant to be EQUAL for all mankind. 2nd answer is; .. God Can not Belong to any religion, coz he will be confined in a particular group, can be questioned and measured by others according to the believes he posess, therefore God can not become a beliver/follower of any Religion, even His Own, and the one whome can be questioned, measured and confined in a Group can not be god, thus, the question is irrelevant...
Now let me change my own answer entirely different way and perspective; eventhough, if we study different religions, we will not find even one example in which someone(prophecies) narrated anything from the God that He said that He like this Particular Religion, infact He does said that He like the group of people who refrain thereselves from evil, who helps needy, dosen't steal, rape, lie and kill innocent; etc... Meaning, anyone who dosen't harm anyother creatures INCLUDING HIS SELF, is blessed by God, and God called them from a set of belivers/Followers of God; God named and called those set of peoples differently on different ocasions, but the meaning of all names are same; those names are; People, Believers, Student, Followers, Peace Lovers, Surrender of their Souls, properties, families when required/needed by God beliver society's law, Fighter against any agression til it ends, Fighter - to bring peace, justice and harmony among Menkind, Figters against their own sins, protector of Mankind, peace, obedience, is the set rules for this group of peoples; eventhough God named these set of Group differently but He never said that He is a part of this Group. HE (God) said that these Criterias are for your own good, if u want to live peacefully, my dear, If we are from this set of people mentioned above then God dosen't need to join us coz He is the One Who sets these rules and regulations for menkind, for our own benefits, Not to become Beliver/Follower of His Own Rules...
Thanks for your reply :-)
"Even an atheist is somehow related to religion. When an atheist opposes God, he/she is indirectly accepting there is God. You cannot be opposing something when there isn't anything."
But boy, are you SOOOO WRONG!!! You have missed the whole point completely, which god am I accepting Odin, Jesus, Allah, Shiva, God, Wicca, etc etc???
I don't oppose god/s, that would make me a Satanist. When I have proof of any god I will believe. There are, and I can't stress this more strongly, NO SUCH THINGS AS GODS.
See, you are still trapped in the bubble of 'if there is no creator, then who made all of this/us'?
A-Theist means NO SUPERNATURAL GODS/CREATORS.
Sorry just to put you right on a few things, wasn't shouting just emphasizing. :-)
Peace
I don't go to mythical places with strange men.
-- Douglas Adams, The Long Dark Tea-Time of the Soul.
Peace on U all... I'm back and reading your post, sinec I left there is not much progress so far Hu,mmm...
I know you can't ban religion but we can make it redundant and private.
I don't go to mythical places with strange men.
-- Douglas Adams, The Long Dark Tea-Time of the Soul.
on others:
Abortion is baned in Ireland and Doctors shot in America
Restrictions on products in Islamic countries (not everyone is Muslim there)
Embassies burnt in Italy(?)
Creationism taught as science in U.S. schools
Bishops guaranteed seat in UK second chamber
Sectarianism in N.Ireland, Iraq, Iran, Philippines, Thailand.
The Crusades, Bin Laden
The list goes on ad on and on...all based on something with not a shred of proof.
And finally a lot of the proponents faith DO denigrate other faiths (no good just wishing they didn't)
I'll let you go now :-)
Peace
I don't go to mythical places with strange men.
-- Douglas Adams, The Long Dark Tea-Time of the Soul.
U are not allowing me to go......
I never said to scrap and do away with religion. Follow what you feel good and do not impose ur religion on others. Live and let live.
And stop derograting other faiths and religion.
I was listening to FM qatar about a month back. Islam was being preached (not a bad idea) but along with it hinduism / christanity and all other possible religions was being referred and their existence being questioned. I mean - this is state sponsored preaching a particular religion and at the same time saying all sorts of things about others.
You will find such people in a TON and more than that here and elsewhere in QL too.
"some people stressing on a particular religion / faith being the best and the only one to follow. For them all other religions are satanic religions and all non-believers (READ - not following a particular religion) will go to hell.
if u are good - u have heaven here on earth itself. and if u do bad - ur hell is also here. U (not in particular you in person) dont have to actually look forward what happens to ur body and soul after u are gone."
So the answer (to get back to the OP) is do away with all religion and just be. And try to be good. :-)
I don't go to mythical places with strange men.
-- Douglas Adams, The Long Dark Tea-Time of the Soul.
Creator is what i do believe in to Adey.
U are following what u are born into and I am following what I am born into. Same case with all of us.
What I am saying is all lead to same goal only means and the way is different. I was only referring w.r.t some people stressing on a particular religion / faith being the best and the only one to follow. For them all other religions are satanic religions and all non-believers (READ - not following a particular religion) will go to hell.
if u are good - u have heaven here on earth itself. and if u do bad - ur hell is also here. U (not in particular you in person) dont have to actually look forward what happens to ur body and soul after u are gone.
have to go now.. will be back after few hrs.
Bye for now
These immortal higher beings like to watch us humans trying to conduct games of one man upship.
Our God likes to watch us humans play and laugh and pity us... for our foolishness and beastness.
To some extent all religions are irrational. Its how man has interpreted the books and teachings. Most of the religious customs (of any and all religions and faiths) on this planet are man made.
Even an atheist is somehow related to religion. When an atheist opposes God, he/she is indirectly accepting there is God. You cannot be opposing something when there isn't anything.
We say mankind started from XYZ... date depending upon which religion you belong to.
Was God insane before he sent his/her first / last messenger and all of them in between. (messengers of all religions are included - i am not targetting any particular religion).
What did he think before God'd first messenger came here.
What were humans following before a particular messenger came.
If we think any one particular religion is pure and all other religions are not what God is related to, then my friend God has done lot of mistakes and still doing one.
he sent his 1st messenger - then he/ she thought it needs to be updated and revised.
He continued correcting his/her mistakes and is still not perfected as to what his created mankind should follow.
My assumption is GOD / ALLAH / BHAGWAN / etc etc are a bunch of ....... somewhere and look down on earth for what they have created and enjoy the fun between themselves.
that all religions have to be by their very nature irrational then?
In the OP it says "prove it" It's up to religions to prove god, I'm just giving them the opportunity - so far no one has.
The typical 'religious' devotee believes in something they cant prove and then cries off for protection quoting 'sacred' texts which again offer no proof.
This debate goes way over the head of most religious followers, but those like PM, DG and army001 at least investigate what they believe and for that they have my respect. I still think they are wrong.
One of my friends was struggling to become a Muslim, after having been brought up a Roman Catholic, and we often read and debated what was in the Quran. When his father died he could not square what it said about life after death in both religions and he came to the conclusion there was no such thing as god if these were supposed to be his revelations. He began to use the brain that has been developed over eons. At least he used it, whatever conclusion he came to(god/no god/which religion)was a choice and not blind faith without evidence. The indoctrination (here's the controversial bit) of children is a form of child abuse IMHO , and it impairs critical thinking for life when it comes to religion. It's very difficult to entirely break free from it, some people disown all religions but remain deists i.e. that there is a creator of the universe but it has had no interaction with humans, does not intervene in the world and in fact does not care. But most find it difficult to break away from the idea of of a creator.
Reading your post again you may well be agreeing with me, cant really tell. :-)
Peace
I don't go to mythical places with strange men.
-- Douglas Adams, The Long Dark Tea-Time of the Soul.
Cool Down My Dear Skdkak... paitence is the key to the knowlege, through your brain to Command your heart, under the Natures Law, if U understand the Meanig of this... U'll find ll the answers ... chill bro.. got to go now... c ya.. chat with u guys later.. bye
didnt ask ur comments and suggestions about how to relieve my fatigue and tiredness.
C ya around
if not then I'm posting here below... I didn't ask anything about an Atomic Bomb, it's used as an example to prove the Questioner's Question about GOD... and your concern about people bringing Islam in their Discussion..
Surely, Everyone who is gonna read my question, their INSTINCT immediately tells them that I,(Zafar) seems very stupid to ask such question here, because No one on this forum has any knowledge about the Assembly of an Atomic Bomb, and if for instance there is one who is capable to answer my question will not answer this question to me... because He don't know how knowledgeable I am to handle his answer... so Y i asked something, which I'm not supposed to ask, and Y people are posting their Blogs here since we all are not capable to discuss GOD and His Exsistence... the Only reason i'm discussing here is that God Allowed Mankind to Discuss HIS Exsistence and Qualities, but once those r proven to us then we r bound to respect and follow... so if u asked the question from everyone then u'll get the answer u asked for
Szafar: I do not understand why u are asking me abt the knowledge of making a A.B..b. We had our first blast of it in 1974 and surely had the knowledge since 1964.
There is a lot of this knowledge in this region. Why don't u ask ur friends in Iran / Iraq (was supposed to have it as per uncle Sam) / even pakistan has it (thanks to their neighbour China and a friend korea)..
After our blast long back.. we do not read the latest about it as we have delegated this job to very good people. we just live happily (if we are allowed to do so).
Gypsy: Your forum is going in all possible directions but not where it is supposed to. I would be a spectator from now on and only comment if there is a good suggession from a good soul..
Surely, Everyone who is gonna read my question, their INSTINCT immediately tells them that I,(Zafar) seems very stupid to ask such question here, because No one on this forum has any knowledge about the Assembly of an Atomic Bomb, and if for instance there is one who is capable to answer my question will not answer this question to me... because He don't know how knowledgeable I am to handle his answer... so Y i asked something, which I'm not supposed to ask, and Y people are posting their Blogs here since we all are not capable to discuss GOD and His Exsistence... the Only reason i'm discussing here is that God Allowed Mankind to Discuss HIS Exsistence and Qualities, but once those r proven to us then we r bound to respect and follow... so if u asked the question from everyone then u'll get the answer u asked for
Hot or cold potato.. that i do not know but whenever u try discuss any damn thing under the sun with a muslim and he is unable to answer ur rational questions in a proper and rational and logical point of view.. he will surely take support of Islam and try to prove it to u somehow.. And if u r a non-muslim, u do not have an option but to shut ur ears or argue..
A proper discussion then is thrown to garbage.
No hard feelings to any muslim (My closest and greatest freinds are muslims and have great regards to them and their religion).
threfore, people take the support of thier religion, when their Ego tells them that he is about to fall down, so instead of accepting his defeat and surrendering to brighter thoughts, he/they stood against their INSTINCT, and try to USE the Boundries and Pilars of thier Faith, by knowingly that others will not question any religion's Boundries and It;s Foundation/Pillars..
Probably because we live in an Islamic society/state I guess.
For people in other parts of the world I guess it's because Islam is a bit of a 'hot potato' at the moment. Haven't you noticed?
I don't go to mythical places with strange men.
-- Douglas Adams, The Long Dark Tea-Time of the Soul.
why only people in this area. People from any part of the world will try to get in or somehow squeeze in Islam into any forum and discussion.
It realy does not matter to them if what they are trying to prove is relevent to that particular forum or discussion.
you are 100% correct. As this is the forum for discussion and regarding ur second last post - I felt u are going in a direction which does not fit ur personality (that u have created) and surely does not fit into this forum. so was my reply.
To answer your question: It's because most (and I am aware that I am generalizing) Muslims in this area have not had access to Comparative Religious Studies. As most (generalizing again) non-Muslims have, then our common point of focus and discussion is Islam.
Hope that answers your question.
Peace
I don't go to mythical places with strange men.
-- Douglas Adams, The Long Dark Tea-Time of the Soul.
I was almost loging off, but saw ur post, decided to come back.. Dear SKDKAK We r not discussing any religion here, what we r discussing is "What is the Religion of God", though the answer is very simple, which i already answered earlier in my post, but i took very long run to come to the Conclusion and i didn't seek support from any faith, religion, and book references in my posts, because God Belongs to all menkind, It is only Menkind who does not belongs to the GOD... I am not draging this topic to prove any religion specially Islam, because God Does not belongs to Muslims only; let me add one thing here for your kind information and Knowledge that. All the Religions including ISLAM are the best religions to follow, but their followers are the worst examples on the face of earth. it is only the follower who made changes and braught ammendments to his religion believes, they have changed the norms and values of the religion to fulfill their needs. and we the follower let them do these changes, because we belive in hem most rather than God, their is no problem in any religion to follow .. all religion leads u towads God; the only secret is we need to follow the religion 100% acoording to their Teachings...
Have we heard Christanity, Hinduism, Buddhism, Zoorashtraism or any other religious words and meanings written in this forum.
I have not seen any of the above religious topics discussed or referred to in detail and in depth. But what I can see here and in many many many more topics in QL that Islam being preached and referred to in length.
SZafar... You seemed to be a very logical and rational person. But sorry to say.. u too are going in the expected direction.
This is not the problem with you but a lot of guys get Islam in one or the other form in any topic whether it be religious topics / national topics or any other.
Why do u do it always... ??
Got to Go now, C ya in same forum again bye... keep posting..
In the path of searching the true values set for menkind, one must not believe on anyone and anything until it's proven to him by his own instinct, because the human INSTINCT never lies... coz it's not under our control I'ts called Nuf-se-Ammara and Nuf-se-Sue... if we follow our own instinct without any prejudice, then it will be lot easier for us to Understand the possibilities to Answer the Question "in which Religon God should belongs too" you will get the answer by using your own instinct knowledge.
You are my leader, I'll do what ever you tell me to. :-)
Have a good day
Peace
I don't go to mythical places with strange men.
-- Douglas Adams, The Long Dark Tea-Time of the Soul.
I've saved your Queation and will reply u later...
Peace on U
It would help if I knew what orkut was!
Is it some internet messengering system?
I don't go to mythical places with strange men.
-- Douglas Adams, The Long Dark Tea-Time of the Soul.
Gypsy; What has happend to ur forum. Guys have forgotten the real topic to discuss abt God and it existence and religion.. but I can see lot of things writen. One thing that I could see is Terrorist and terrorism.
Now that we are in this topic.. Let me inform.. there was a report in One national daily news paper of India as below.... And it is impt. for all.
""Today in Mumbai Mirror (India) Daily, it is written that so many terrorists and under world people has got connecting through orkut. Like Dawood Ibrahim,Chotta Shakkil ....so many people are getting new man power through Orkut only. The IB (Intelligent Beureau) has started their investigations. So please reduce the contacts through Orkut.
It is usual that we receive friend request from unknown people. But if
you actually do not know that person it is good to reject that request.
Because, if one terrorist is found by Police, his entire friend's list
will be carefully followed. And if you are there, you also will be in trouble.
So be careful! Also forward it to all your friends.
You may be thinking that why these people are adding so many friends
through orkut. It is simply because to mislead the Police. When Police get a huge friend list they will be concentrating on them.
They may be innocent people. At that time the real terrorists can
escape. So friends, please forward this information to all you know.""
I'm sorry Mr. Ram U've missed the answer earlier, I already answered this question in the begining and i would like to give u the answer again in detail: Since the value of this question ends automatically when someone asked about the religion of God? for an example let me tell u the story; A Mosquito complains against Wind in the Court of SULEMAN stating that Wind, Blows him away and bother's him in flying too much, Soleman Called The Wind to testify, when wind came... U Know what happened again? Mosqito disapears again... Wind blow him away, and the Case was dismissed automatically, since the Complainant was not there anymore... let me come to the point; There r two meanings of this Question let me start with first one; Do U know what is the meaning of Religion; I believe Religion means "A Group or Set Of Common Belivers and practitioner;" if I am right than allow me that i can explain u more here but it seems good enough for wise people. Therefore, my friend, No one can Associate God with any particular Religion b/Coz Religion Belongs to Group and God meant to be EQUAL for all mankind. 2nd answer is; .. God Can not Belong to any religion, coz he will be confined in a particular group, can be questioned and measured by others according to the believes he posess, therefore God can not become a beliver/follower of any Religion, even His Own, and the one whome can be questioned, measured and confined in a Group can not be god, thus, the question is irrelevant...
Now let me change my own answer entirely different way and perspective; eventhough, if we study different religions, we will not find even one example in which someone(prophecies) narrated anything from the God that He said that He like this Particular Religion, infact He does said that He like the group of people who refrain thereselves from evil, who helps needy, dosen't steal, rape, lie and kill innocent; etc... Meaning, anyone who dosen't harm anyother creatures INCLUDING HIS SELF, is blessed by God, and God called them from a set of belivers/Followers of God; God named and called those set of peoples differently on different ocasions, but the meaning of all names are same; those names are; People, Believers, Student, Followers, Peace Lovers, Surrender of their Souls, properties, families when required/needed by God beliver society's law, Fighter against any agression til it ends, Fighter - to bring peace, justice and harmony among Menkind, Figters against their own sins, protector of Mankind, peace, obedience, is the set rules for this group of peoples; eventhough God named these set of Group differently but He never said that He is a part of this Group. HE (God) said that these Criterias are for your own good, if u want to live peacefully, my dear, If we are from this set of people mentioned above then God dosen't need to join us coz He is the One Who sets these rules and regulations for menkind, for our own benefits, Not to become Beliver/Follower of His Own Rules... NEED MORE>..??
Anyway, Back to me, I am Spartacus!, woof woof, what's that dripping out of my ear. I got to point Shiva and then some bugger nicked my bike.
I don't go to mythical places with strange men.
-- Douglas Adams, The Long Dark Tea-Time of the Soul.
"If we have reached the Conlusion; that there is only one Creator of this universe, so pls let me know that i shold go ahed and discuss who that creator might be?"
All this time and u were proofing that there is only one creator ..
Please concentrate in the topic question.. what religion does GOD belong to? and how u can proof it .. don't deviate to other topics or people are rally going to get bored .. if u have a point then please share it with us .. if ur have other points non-related to our topic as corne suggested u can open a new thread to discuss it ..
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http://www.showcaseyourmusic.com/LittleGuitarist
"Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake."
Napoleon Bonaparte (1769-1821)
If we have reached the Conlusion; that there is only one Creator of this universe, so pls let me know that i shold go ahed and discuss who that creator might be?
take an example of two people,, any religon and group u choose... give them a task to draw any one picture, lets say picture of Palm Tree and write an essay on Palm tree.. There Picture's size, colors, combinations, number of scatches, amout of time to complete, will be different... and anyother can tell the difference between both pictures even though both had drawn palm tree on a paper..similarly both explaining about palm tree, but using their own words/sentences... whereas We don't see any difference in this Universe among any CREATURES, which leads us to the conlusion that thir must be ONLY ONE CREATOR who created them so perfectly..
Let me Phrase this way if every one is reading and believing the same I'm writing down, I believe there will be no conflict among any of us and everyone can say that they are right,.. Repeat this Loudly pls...
My Dad is beter than any other person in the world
when I say my dad against ur dad, conflict starts here when i give my judgement on someone's dad, basically, our nature dosen't allow anyone to give judgement on someone's private matter... so pls refrain
My Dad's Canadian, he'll kick your dads butt while drunk!
"I fight with love and I laugh with rage, you have to live light enough to see the humor and long enough to see some change." Ani Difranco
I never say any guys in swim shorts. :( Ummmmmm! ACK!
"I fight with love and I laugh with rage, you have to live light enough to see the humor and long enough to see some change." Ani Difranco
Due to my very limited thinking, I can't see the relation between writing essays and the existence of God. Anyone care to explain ?
Oh and Gypsy, my dad's younger than ur dad, so he'll kick ur dad's butt blind-folded! :P
MY question to U pls read carefully; especially Cornellian, I'm sorry about my French,
if i ask all of u to draw a pictre or write down an essay, do u think that we can draw identically ideal pictures and write same essay using same wordings, I believe it is not possible for any ordinary Human Being, if some special Human Being, try to Draw an Identical Pictre then there must be a dispute among them claiming which picture belogs to whome, whereas all the Creatures in this Universe, and their species are Identicaly same, have u seen a body without face? meaning, that the face is the only part of our body which differenciate us among eachother, circulation of our solar system around their orbit gravity for US but tree grows against gravity Y? lots of these questions and their answers leads us towars the ONE CREATOR OF ALL THESE CREATURES AND UNIVERSE. Coz we don't See any conflict and trouble in this World.
My Dad could so kick your Dad's butt.
"I fight with love and I laugh with rage, you have to live light enough to see the humor and long enough to see some change." Ani Difranco
God will be Exsisted automaticall to all Mankind, when we start denouncing terrorist, one can not find and see God, if someway he/we/they supports terrorism, either, financialy, morally, by voting and electing them, or anyotherway, it's mean we/he/they can not find the exsistence of GOD, Because God created this univers, BALANCED, and Peaceful for all the creatures on this planet
I soooooo knew u were gana say that! Ur becoming too predictable :P
p.s. MY DAD is better than ur dad!
Corne, my Dad is better then your dad. :P
"I fight with love and I laugh with rage, you have to live light enough to see the humor and long enough to see some change." Ani Difranco
Religion is "supposed" to bring peace and harmony, unfortunately religion is the reason most wars happen, and alot of hatred is formed. It's not that religion tells us to kill others, but human interpretation and ego leads to it. It's kinda like my dad is better than ur dad argument.
Wheter U call yourself Muslim, Jews, Hindu, Christian etc,.. or u believe none of them, but U R A HUMAN BEING, for being a Human Being we all love peaceful atmosphere around us, so Y we r Discussing Religion, which is not harmful to eachother, instead of Bringing Peace and Harmony among the MANKIND
Gypsy...shhhhh....I just said that so that he wouldn't go on explaining! hehe.
SZ, I would love to continue arguing about terrorism and muslim consent and all that, but it's off topic, so open a new thread and we can debate it there.
Do u think that 1% can survive without the support of 99%, I am one of 99%, and everyday i denounce everybrutal act commited by anyone, If We 99% don't allow and give excess to these 1%, I assure U my friend, it will take only one NINO second to bring peace in our region and in this world...
Corne, you know what he's talking about? Mind filling the rest of us in?
"I fight with love and I laugh with rage, you have to live light enough to see the humor and long enough to see some change." Ani Difranco
Oh right now I get what ur talking about. Sorry. Didn't read it properly.
By the way, 99% muslims are against all that terrorism, only the extremists and terrorists themselves support it.
Ok we're going off topic...back to existence of God.
I said Osama Bin laden and his followers are the true examples of those terrorist who Called theirselves Muslims of that time, but Killed other Muslims brothers, women and Children, even killed Prophecies and their Progney... But Y the Muslims of TODAY Do not Denounce their Brutal act, and their So called leadership... eventhough Everyone knows those Murderors, but most of the Muslims call their names very respectfully...
Terroist or terrorism supporter where ever they are must be brought to Justice, because they r destroying the peace of all the mankind. if u know anyone around u, U must try to stop THEM... easy way or hard way, choice is yours... If u do not stop them, means U r with them and there is no space for u in ISLAM because Islam is for Peace not for Distruction. Let me Rephrase again, ALL THE MANKIND (PEACELOVER) WHATEVER RELIGION OR GROUP THEY BELONGS TO IF THEY ARE PEASE LOVER THEN THEY ARE UNDER THE FLAG OF ISLAM, DESPITE OF THEIR DIFFERENCES.
I'm saying that U must Denounce all the Terrorism, and Terrorist, wherever they are and help others to brought them to Justice...
Oh so terrorists who blow themselves up in public places and kill innocent people are "true muslims" ? U must be kidding me!!
I'm talking about the Islam that promotes peace, tolerance, kindness and justice. I have no clue what Islam ur talking about.
before I refresh your memory about Islam, i want u to know that I Belong to ISLAM (PEACE)
There are 124 thousands prophisies in Islam and Most of the Prophits were Brutally assasinated and tortured within the same nation they preached... eventhough the Last Prophet and His Progney was Brutally assacinated by the SO-Called Muslims of That Time, Now a days People Like Osama and his belivers/followers are the true example's of those so called muslims... Can U explain which Islam U r talking about... ?
hello Guys... Once again,,, I'm back for a while,
Ok I started reading some of "the prophet"'s posts but my brain couldn't handle the nonsense anymore. Sorry.
As for Alexa's comment, there's alot of hypocrisy here. Alot of people only talk about religion but only few actually follow it. If everyone here followed Islam properly, things would've been much different.
I don't see anything wrong with this thread. Don't you sit by yourself and ask:
- Why God is a male not a female?
- What is spirit? And why when the Creator claims it back, we rot and decay?
- What it means when you’re alone and find yourself singing, as if you hear some music in your head? Do we have jukebox installed in us?
- Was Jesus beautiful?
- Why some people only know god existed when they've seen death with their own eyes, but were saved?
- Humans have 5 clear senses, but what is the sense of guilt???
- Why Quran is in Arabic?
- Why there is abject poverty if god promised to support his creation?
- Where god came from and when?
- What is this guiding inner voice you hear often, but you don’t see it shaped in any form you can recognize?
- What is conscience and where it exists in your body?? How do you weigh it?
- God appears to believers in different shapes and speak to them all in their languages, how can he accommodate and master all that without a flaw?
- What does god want from us, he is all powerful and needs no one, yet his remembrance is the feast for believers?
- What do we mean by soul searching? Where is that huge space we dig into to search, if our bodies dimensions are less than 2X1 (height and width in meters)?
- Why do we say my aching heart is broken? Although science (lab) shows it is pumping and pulsing!
Salam
If you're going to stay away from it and keep your thoughts to yourself, why did you post?
Also that wasn't the purpose of the thread at all, in fact we've been having quite a rational discussion.
"I fight with love and I laugh with rage, you have to live light enough to see the humor and long enough to see some change." Ani Difranco
This thread's mean purpose is to invoke criticism of other's religion so I am gonna stay away from it and keep my thoughts to myself. I respect all religion and believe that people have the right to live and practice their faith freely and athesits also have the same rights just like other religious believers
You can be first hand maiden and venerated ever more. I'm sold!! don't be a a heathen now, lets see you bowing and prostrate (ohhh missus, stop!)
I don't go to mythical places with strange men.
-- Douglas Adams, The Long Dark Tea-Time of the Soul.
FriendRaj...What?
gypsy ji ---- dit dat dit dit dit dit dat dat dit dit.dit dit dit dit. dat dat dit dit dit. dit dat dat. dit dat dit dit.
Wow..........Guys I think we've found the new prophet!!!
"I fight with love and I laugh with rage, you have to live light enough to see the humor and long enough to see some change." Ani Difranco
when i'll be back... got to go now... TC
Take Care
Anmials posess knowledge and power, way before we gain ours, when we born or came to exsistence in this universe these mamals (moter in animals) respected our presnce among them and tells other animals to respect us as well. they didn't bother u at all since u were born/hopeless, now since u r in power u need to help them too and don't bother them as well... Misconduct is our behaviour with them...
but I'm using the Greek alphabet with a smattering of Arabic and Hindi. How long, however, should I stop at the 'temporary' resting places?
I left point Alpha a long time ago and I've heard Zeta's not 'all that'!(Well not since she married Michael Douglas)
I'm scared :( , I need a guide!!!
I don't go to mythical places with strange men.
-- Douglas Adams, The Long Dark Tea-Time of the Soul.
C ya after while, if anything new rises in ur minds, u can ask anytime, i'll try to get the answers for u, till then PEACE... bye from Zafar naqvi
come on guys, pls be consistent.. do not switch the subject..
if one come and go with his own choice than he could decide which direction should he go, Since We didn't choose where to born and Die, therefore still we can not decide which direction we might go. but there is another fact. if one need to go somewhere, he sets his points from A - Z he starts from A and Ends at Z... whatever comes in between are the temporary stopover or resting places... coz our ultimate goal is to reach Z from our starting point A...If one in this Universe has st his points then he/they can find the answer theirselves very easily... Have u set your points of directions?...
If u have ever supported/agreed or feel proud to discuss any Misconduct or behavior(whatever is the Extent), eventhough with Mammals too, than believe me one day Nature will bring justice on you and will do the same to you, it dosen't matter how good or bad we R no one is allowed to do unjust, only deal with him according to his act, and up to the extent that they deserve not a single penny more... No Excuse
I don't think the lads minded! he he
My mother didn't go to that school? She was nearly 40 at the time, but thanks for asking.
If I've got to leave the universe what direction do you advise me to head in?
I don't go to mythical places with strange men.
-- Douglas Adams, The Long Dark Tea-Time of the Soul.
I mean any sexoffender, male or female, place your male/female loveone into the car and think again what would u say now...
if one still think that act is ok then i must dare to place your motheer in that place and now think and tell me how much is your blood presure now... I'm Sory .. Just an example, anyone's mother is my mother and I can not diferrenciate between mothers the most respected personality after any Creator.
Whatever makes you think that his French teacher was a man, but not a woman?
I see that you passed out from a school that didn't support co-education.
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2100 QL Points!!!
Yay! Way to go Ray!
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www.e4u.name.qa
Do U still call that homosexual, a Teacher or he was pretending as a teacher, and posses no qualit for being in that possision... we leave our children to their trust that they'll help us raising our children with us, better in our Society... Since we all are crimnals that's why we talk about that homosexual, and we still called his as a TEACHER, if we r truthful to ourselfes then we must punish to that homosexual so harshly that no one cn even dare to think to look at someone's child... but once again since we all are criminal therefore we criticize someone's act but by enjoying it... SO SHAME FOR MANKIND...
just round the corner, it was closest and it was free. When I was older the French teacher got caught having sex in the back of her car with two 15yr old boys during lunch break.
My school closed 8yrs after I left
Much like an organised religion really.
And thats a true story.
I don't go to mythical places with strange men.
-- Douglas Adams, The Long Dark Tea-Time of the Soul.
this is my picture, Indeed, One need to discuss the truth, must not conseal his self and Identity, hiding yourself means that u r not truthful... purposely U can Conseal yourself, in order to protect from being disclosed to some un seen danger,, Yes it's ok...
#4. We had authurity to discuss about school and it's policies prior to entering the school, now we cann not differ with them if still someone intends to differ with school's policies and it's authorities, either he must leave the School or he will be expelled, So Point No. 4 is if one need to object on God's Exsistence, either he has to Leave his World/Universe or he will be Expelled by his CREATOR (GOD)
Tears of laughter streaming down my face here.... I was holding it together until Rayyz mentioned profile, and I went to look - that finished me off.
Oh my, my ,my ... I'm gonna go for a lie down with a book :P
Way to go boy! A winner indeed.
Is that you in that display picture of yours? I better remember it for its the picture of future president of the united states. LOL
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2100 QL Points!!!
Yay! Way to go Ray!
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www.e4u.name.qa
To study in this world there r two many schools around us I mean for us and our children. there is one thing COMMON. we choose our shool by ourselves, we decide where to go, how to pay, what to study, what will be the outcome/end result of the study. let me begin here step by step here for better understanding and remember only talk about mutual and common grounds among mankind, at this point, pls. do not discuss ur faith with me...
step #1. we have absolute authority and power to choose our shool, we try to match our standard of living with the school in order to compete in the society;
#2. We set the Goal/achievments in our mind after the completion of the school (rewards), therefore we choose our own subjects/majors,
#3. we need to prove the school authority that we are capable of joining you by giving an aptitude exam and by paying their Fees.
#.4 once we enter/join our school, we loose all our rights to discuss about the school, raising any issue against the school and it's policies, we do not have the power to change any teacher or princpal of the school, all we have to do is follow our teachers and to succeed weneed to pass the exam... NO ONE CAN SAY THAT HE PAID every month and he is entitled to jump into another grade, one can not even jump grades in shool without giving an exam, how can u people talk about GOD, and u r not even entered into the bouries of HIS SCHOOL..
more is coming...
LOL.
I just had a look at his profile, he sure looks a winner to me!
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2100 QL Points!!!
Yay! Way to go Ray!
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www.e4u.name.qa
I beg to differ, I read them , he's a genius. You cant see the true message, probably you are taking the writings out of context. ;o lol
I don't go to mythical places with strange men.
-- Douglas Adams, The Long Dark Tea-Time of the Soul.
Dude, we have no idea what are you talking about. And I can you for a fact that no one even bothers reading your posts, cos at least I tend to overlook at your lines. So please don't bother yourself putting in so much of efforts.
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2100 QL Points!!!
Yay! Way to go Ray!
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www.e4u.name.qa
Well said. I guess thats why we all are quite content following religions that we do.
I FEEL, we have been brought up getting convinced that our religion is the right or true religion. It is drilled into us to such an extent that most of us even fail to look beyond and try to accept that the other religion could equally make sense. By saying this, I don't mean to say that God belongs to any particular religion.
Religion has been so much tied up with God that we just cannot think of non-existence of any religion, it sort of means that you don't believe in existence of God totally.
250,000 years since humans came into being, isn't it amazing to imagine that more than half of the world's population is actually deprieved of God's "True" religion, with due respect to whatever religion a person is following. I do not have proper statistics of wolrd population based on religion, but am pretty sure that no religion actually exceeds 50% of world's population. So which means that does God actually want majority of his creations on planet earth to burn in hell or be on the ignorant side? Shouldn't at least the majority have been on the right side 250,000 years on?
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2100 QL Points!!!
Yay! Way to go Ray!
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www.e4u.name.qa
1. mankind is not allowed and capable of lifting their both legs in the air at the same time. the energy/power we posess in our body to run, if someday we get sick, meaning we can loose some of our powers either to move, talk, think, eat, speak etc... or may be toatl failure of power,one can not genrate his own powers, how com he is capable of generating any rules and regulation about any religion.
2. wahatever we have around us is invented by mankind, none of the things are been created my mankind, coz they were pre exsited and we just invent them... if we r inventors than who is the CREATOR. and where he/they r?
At last!!, I've found my prophet! I have no idea what you're talking about but it has that unfathomable religious thing going on. I will follow you to the end of my days. he he :-)
1,2,3...."I was lost but now I'm found"
I don't go to mythical places with strange men.
-- Douglas Adams, The Long Dark Tea-Time of the Soul.
I'm not getting personal with anyone, I'm just answering ur queries by using the common INFORMATION available around us, I don't want to raise any issues, discussed/proven by any religion or school of thaughts earlier, because those are ther's not ours and GOD is ours, for everyone, if he is not for everyone, than this is Discremination to us, and Discreminator can not be a god...
My Question to al of U, When u was born, Do u able to Speak? What Knowledge u posess at that time, do u remeber anything? etc... if the answer is none of the above... then answer me how u gain Knowledge, if someone told u about, than it's not knowledg, it's a transfermation of words, if u read to know anything than, u r not knowledgeable... if one don't know about what is KNOWLEDGE, how cum he talk about GOD, THE MOST KNOWLEDGEABLE
when we use term PERSON it's mean someone,... that someone/person has their own desires, fellings, and interest as we all have ours, if someone claim hisself god, then there must be a conflict between u and him. IF U CAN CREATE CONFLICT WITH ANYONE, THAT ANYONE CAN NOT BE god BECAUSE HE IS NOT EVEN CAPABLE OF RESOLVING DISPUTE. one can not resolve a simple disput can not become god, so my dear any person can not be a god.
God religion depends on the persons beleive according to me.
And god exist only to those people who beleive in him.
Syed Qadeer
So far, the Menkind are the Most powerful force on this universe. and The Animals are least fowerful than the menkind... AM I Right??? So Think and Think... Y the Animal's baby is so Strong than a Menkind, that whenever they born, They Born With knowledge, Power, Sight, Smell, I mean that they Born with Complete Powers, that they need to survie in this world, They born with the Knowledge, what to Eat, Where to Go, how To Walk and Talk. etc.. whereas, a Human Baby is So Hopeless, couldn't able to move, drink, think, see, talk.. No powers at all ... Do U know Y?
Who told u that religion are made by man kind ??? ohhh people i really don't know how do u believe in those things .. do u think that the human being were able to put rules to this world .. I'm not convinced with that point .. u r free to believe in wut u believe and i believe in wut i believe ..
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http://www.showcaseyourmusic.com/LittleGuitarist
"Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake."
Napoleon Bonaparte (1769-1821)
Religion runs by Followers, and Follower is not powerful enough and Capable to call himself god. so your point "Which religion GOD follows", the answer is follower cn not become god, since he is a follower. therefore GOD does / Can not not Posess any religion.
U must respect others Views, whatsoever... coz respecting their Views will not harm U at all... so Y disrespect?... Never get personal coz getting personal means U R not thinking properly and u need a treatment.
Ok too much reading for a Friday morning (my day just started :P)...so..
I believe that God does exist. My proof (and it convinces me, doesn't have to convince u all) is science. Most people would tend to believe that "God" and science are contradictory, but I don't think so. Let's start with the Big Bang theory...how did it start ? expansion of energy, but where did this energy come from ? Something must have created it because it can't create itself...and here's where God comes into play.
What religion does he belong to? None because God didn't create religion, man kind did. So if he doesn't belong to any religion, why I am following the religion that I am ? Well cause different religions have slightly different teachings (even though they're all based on the same fundementals)and I like the teachings of my religion, they make sense to me and the stuff that dont make sense I question them till I understand. So that's why I follow it :-)
This Goat vs Dog, +/- are the true natural examples around us, I put these examples because all the Belevers and Non belivers of any religion believes in these facts and can not DENY to the Nature of this TRUTH... so since we r Discussing GOD, we should use common examples to reach who could be a GOD, and HOW he posess this Possesion... It's kind of way of Investigation of any story, by reporter, and crime by Agency... it's called Investigation
Where can I buy some of what you've got?? lol :D
I don't go to mythical places with strange men.
-- Douglas Adams, The Long Dark Tea-Time of the Soul.
The Clan that thinks you need to lay off the drugs.
"I fight with love and I laugh with rage, you have to live light enough to see the humor and long enough to see some change." Ani Difranco
Searching for the truth. Still lot to be revealed, and believed accordingly (as per the unseen rules set forth around us by the nature...). there will be no conflict among anyone if they attend same school, same class, wear same uniform, and speak same language. this world will become heaven-on-Earth. its very easy and simple.
Look around u, there are at least two very popular animals among us, just take an example of a dog/Cat vs Goat/sheep, lets talk about Dog/Cat First: these animals are the most beloved animals by human on our planet; 96% off the population Don't eat Dogs/Cats instead 50% raise them and take good care of them. Their Birth ratio is much higher than a Goat/Sheep, they even live longer than Sheep/Goat, in the other hand, 80% of our population eat Goat/Sheep, 19% raise or care about them, but their numbers are growing everyday, whereas, despite of all love and care, dog/cat won't grow like Goat/Sheep, dog only Gather, when they need to attack their opponents, despite of their brutal and deadly act against their opponents, human love them very much, and ignore their Nature to Kill... Goat/Sheep always lives together in a CLAN under Leadership, they even jump from one end to the other after their Leader, there will be lot i can add here the reason of this example is that this is the way of differentiating between Right & Wrong, Good & Bad, Halal & Haram, Halal things, Right things, and Good things always Lives Togather & Longer, Never stays apart, eventhough u kill them, their number grows, higher everyday, Haram is Haram, we haven't seen their Clan, it dosen't matter how u take care and preserve them, U can not succeed ever, to have them sit down on one ground, eventhough all of the universe make one Coalision Force under One Flag, when they have fillfilled their stomatch after brutally snatching their opponents, they will disburse again, till further ATTACK.
So U can say that, all the evil Forces belongs to One CLAN and all the Good Nature Belongs to one CLAN, their is nothing inbetween, now ask yourself WHICH CLAN U SUPPORT AND BELONGS TO;
Now the acid's worn off, whats this thing with cats/dogs, goats/sheep, male/female, +/-, ying/yang et al????
I don't go to mythical places with strange men.
-- Douglas Adams, The Long Dark Tea-Time of the Soul.
The reason of my point is ur discussion about GOD... therefore If I join U guys, then I must Introduse myself and the community in which i live... if we become a member of the community than we can discuss GOD, and I'll be happy to share my VIEWS with u too...
Lets go back to Religion of God and start a new topic about human anatomy
to know this answer, One must understand Who he is, and where he stands, One can not Understand his self, sould not posess the right to discuss about other's specially GOD.
Thank U for Inviting me here, since ur msg was private, I would like to keep ur name private... unless u disclose yourself... by the way my name is Zafar Naqvi
Sorry, I'm a hermaphrodite.
"I fight with love and I laugh with rage, you have to live light enough to see the humor and long enough to see some change." Ani Difranco
Well said. Very intellectual point of view.
bUt whatz male / female got to do with point of discussion here.
If I have not understood ur point of view completely.. plz do explain
hello Guys, I said Hello + Guys, Because I don't know what is your daily practice, to introduce yourself to others (Salam, Namaste, Good Morning, Ola, Kamosta... Bla, bla, bla...)and what is your gender, Male Female there is nothing inbetween, One who don't exsist in Male and Female Category, is actually a Defected part of either Male or Female, all known as COMMUNITY, my point is either you are a maleperson or Female person of this Community, there is nothing in-between... Hope U can understand this point very easyly that this universe is devided into two Genders/forces called Male/Female, +/- there is nothing in between...If u know anything which comes and can exsist in between these Categories, U R most welcome to share with me... Before U start with me U got to Know me, Who I am and What believe I posess and Why? thanks...
What i saying is rules adhered by humans is more because when it is implemented by state and not what is written in religious books. Do read my post once again an reply all the points. y pik only some part of it.
As for killing.. Humans also kill each other and we have killed so many of them even animals will be ashamed of their being beast.
Screwing = I have been reading ur comments. ur english is not that bad that u cant write "love making or making love" in palce of what word u chose.
Sorry Ram, but the Adam and Eve story is just that, a story. I mean if you believe it that's great, however, I don't. Humans live in a complex social system and have for a millenia, in the cave man system it would have been very similar to the way wolves, lions or more accurately chimpanzees and gorillas live today, in that you would not kill or steal from a member of your pack. Yes there is fighting with other "stranger" groups, but for the most part that is nothing more then basic squabbles within the "family" unit. Now we've evolved past family units, so that now, more or less we are living in much bigger more complex family units, which means that we need to write the laws down and agree to them. However, these laws are just the simple extension of those common sense morals we had when we were in the smaller family unit.
If we had never had these morals we never would have evolved into what we are today, we would have killed each other off long before religion was ever even thought of.
"I fight with love and I laugh with rage, you have to live light enough to see the humor and long enough to see some change." Ani Difranco
Gypsy "They are basic social morals that we developed as cave men and have expanded upon as we've evolved." that's not right Gypsy ..
Go back to history of Adam and Eve and their sons ... When on of them killed his brother bcuz of a woman ... cave men used to kill each other and stealing .. it was the rule of the jungle .. The stronger last longer .. we human being did not developed it .. or u wouldn't know that it's something wrong until there is a religion or rules told us that it's wrong ... Now u ur self know it bcuz u were not born in the cave men Age .. but if u were born in that age u would find it the right thing to survive ..
but now bcuz since u were born u r in a society of rules and restriction .. so u automatically Gain it ..
"Ram, No you probably won't convince me, I've thought about these things for a long time and come up with my opinions, however I am always interested in listening to others points of view, and respect them. Also I think talking about lifes big issue can sometimes be a good way to pass the day."
Very good thing to listen to others and respect their point of views, But wut does listen mean? is it just that wave sound that goes into ur ears .. Listening or respecting other points of view means at least give urself a chance to think about it .. or it will be useless and waste of time ..
sdkak Tcom was right .. animal kill each other from the same type and some of them eat its kids .. However I will consider ur example that they don't do so but as u said "but it does not happen. they kill other animals." U just said it .. they KILL other animals .. so they still kill .. if there were a religion book or rules for them they wouldn't do this or at least the rate of killing will be at its lowest .. Do not make a comparison between Man kind and animals .. God has gave u mind to use it .. to think about life issues ...
"as for ur screwing females.. its a very derogatory word. If two people have mutual sex, u cant tell its screwing." English is not my mother tongue and I'm not that good in English so this is the word i know to describe a man having sex with a woman .. Sorry if i used it wrongly i didn't mean any offend ..
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"Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake."
Napoleon Bonaparte (1769-1821)
"Y are so narrow minded or are u with police or law"
What has this attack to do with the topic
I gave you proof also regarding animals killing their own kind n there u go to attack against me instead of prooving your point
If you can't change your fate, change your attitude.
Y do u think I am attacking anyone here. I was replying to comments written and I think thatz wot forums are meant for.
If i do not clarify things or dont understand others view.. How do u wanna do discussions. just write in air without commenting on other's comments.
The bigger picture is your are still wrong .... btw why r so imature as to attack on a person who does not agree on your views cant u put your vies across without personal attacks
If you can't change your fate, change your attitude.
Y are so narrow minded or are u with police or law. do not read between the lines so much. it was just an example.
Look at the bigger picture what am I trying to say here.
just to prove my point
http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,912086,00.html
If you can't change your fate, change your attitude.
You are wrong animals do kill their own kid even their own offsprings .... watch Animal kingdom
If you can't change your fate, change your attitude.
Rules might have been writen in all and any religious book but I do not think these rules are (were ever) follwed to the letter ever by humans of any faith / religion.
I think rules have more to do with laws of a state.. check the history even when religion across the world was prevalent but b'cos autocratic rules.. people were killed for fun and games and for similar reason..
If rules were written in religious book and we all were to follow them cent percent .. can you tell
Ram why dont animals of same species kill each other.. animals do not have any religious book. In ur view point.. then dog should kill dog.
tiger should kill tiger.. but it does not happen. they kill other animals.
as for ur screwing females.. its a very derogatory word. If two people have mutual sex, u cant tell its screwing.
But rules like don't kill, don't steal, etc predate religion. They are basic social morals that we developed as cave men and have expanded upon as we've evolved. I personally believe that not killing, etc is an ingrained value in most people, which is why the majority of the world will never kill anyone.
Ram, No you probably won't convince me, I've thought about these things for a long time and come up with my opinions, however I am always interested in listening to others points of view, and respect them. Also I think talking about lifes big issue can sometimes be a good way to pass the day.
"I fight with love and I laugh with rage, you have to live light enough to see the humor and long enough to see some change." Ani Difranco
If there were no rules from the beginning how can u differentiate between right or wrong ... for example: if i didn't know about any religion i would have been drinking, screwing girls and might be killing peoples who annoy me .. without knowing that this is a bad thing ..
Whether u like the rules or not doesn't change the fact ..
If u r working in a dep. u like ur job and u r doing well in it but there r some rules and restrictions .. which u can do ur job without it .. but u still have to do it .. Why?? if u answered this question u will be answering urself ..
Suppose u r the Head of a section, and this section is a new section in ur company .. u gonna do one of 2 things:
1- follow the company rules
2- Create ur Own Rules
if there is no rules how the employee will know if he make a mistake .. or if he came late or not .. there is not certain timing ... but if there is certain timing starting work from 7 am .. he will be dead sure when he comes at 8 the he delayed means he did a mistake .. otherwise he will never know it ...
Gypsy i like the way u drive the conversation, at least u r listening to others point of view. whether to be convinced or not this is another issue ...
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"Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake."
Napoleon Bonaparte (1769-1821)
Frog, all the people participating in this thread don't seem to think I'm being culturally insensitive, they see no issues, perhaps you should calm down and go read some joke threads or something.
Ram, but what if you don't like the messages that the messengers are sending. I mean some of their messages are good, but I don't agree with a lot of it and think I can live a better life without their rules. Especially since I don't believe God gave them those rules. I don't know, do you really think you would be a bad person if you had never heard of Islam or Christianity or any religion?
FriendRaj...What?
"I fight with love and I laugh with rage, you have to live light enough to see the humor and long enough to see some change." Ani Difranco
I've just raised the topic people, my own personal beliefs don't really weigh into this. Personally I think God's a scientologist.
............. so now I want you to tell me that if he/she/it/what? does exist, what religion does ? belong to?
No seriously, prove it.
Madam Gypsy ------- what you to be say ???? you ask question than to be say another thing. bluff bluff bluff. so that is to be why you are to be hide face.
Plz chill out .. this is not a place for fight .. we r just discussing
At least we shud accept others point of view even if they don't have point at all ..
GYPSY: to live this good life u r talking about u shud do wut messengers said and to do so u shud believe in in messenger so u will be believing in their message (which is the Religion)
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"Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake."
Napoleon Bonaparte (1769-1821)
If you really think lenghty posts are better than I would have lost my time. I tought you were more intelligent than that. I hope u will have more '' cultural awareness and respect'' next :)
[img_assist|nid=38314|title=Crazy Frog|desc=|link=node|align=left|width=180|height=179]
Some are Wise ... Some are ...Otherwise
so that means god is a black Christian billionaire!
Thats got to hurt! Slapped down so ruthlessly, and by a woman! lol
Well down Gypsy.
I don't go to mythical places with strange men.
-- Douglas Adams, The Long Dark Tea-Time of the Soul.
I'm sorry Frog who said I don't have a boyfriend? Just because you don't like an intelligent women who talks about life's big issues, doesn't mean other men don't. As for lame...well 3 pages doesn't say lame to me. How's your threads going?
"I fight with love and I laugh with rage, you have to live light enough to see the humor and long enough to see some change." Ani Difranco
Your discussions are a bit lame . Always asking about the silly ways of life . I know now why QL is becoming so boring. Too much talk about nothing. You'd better find a boyfriend instead of that who let you down. I can understand him, you're nagging all the time. arffffffffffffffffff
[img_assist|nid=38314|title=Crazy Frog|desc=|link=node|align=left|width=180|height=179]
Some are Wise ... Some are ...Otherwise
Frog, if you don't like it, don't read it. I'm trying to pass my time by getting into intellectual discussions, whereas you are trying to pass the time by complaining. TO each his own.
Ram, can't people live a good life without perscribing to a particular religion or beliving that God had messengers?
"I fight with love and I laugh with rage, you have to live light enough to see the humor and long enough to see some change." Ani Difranco
Not sure if this was a general question from you to the forum at large: "...So Ram, Jauntie, etc, if you don't believe that God follows any particular religion, why follow a religion?"
But if you were asking me, directly, then the answer is that I was merely saying God, by virtue of who He allegedly is! (and where Christians and Muslims are concerned), is on a somewhat higher plane than His followers.
I didn't say that I follow any particular religion myself.
This is a very very good question .. i really like it and i'm gonna answer it .. and there is no place for fight .. i'm an open minded guy and we r discussing such an important issue ..
There is another vers says that who believed in GOD, his BOOK(S) and his Messenger(s) will go to heaven ...
I did not deviated .. The Christianity is also having a religion book which is from allah .. and so on other religions (not all of them)
and i believe in God and his Books (plural) and his messengers (all of them) that is the faithfulness ...
So it doesn't mean that Islam is that religion which belongs to God .. other religions where from God too .. and we muslims shud believe in them too .. If we really understood wut islam meant ..
Gypsy: again to answer ur question why do we have to follow a religion??
How can God judge u without following a certain religion ..
it shudn't be written in ur Id that u r a christian but u might be following it by nature and u don't know ... by refraining from doing bad things u r following a certain religion .. but to be one of those who r going to heaven u shud believe in God (and Only God), His Books and his messengers (again all of them) ...
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http://www.showcaseyourmusic.com/LittleGuitarist
"Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake."
Napoleon Bonaparte (1769-1821)
Bro, well that is where you deviate.
You've just said that God doesn't belong to any religion then how do you know that Qur'an is indeed the book of God. Which means Islam is the right religion and God belongs to Islam.
I am not trying to create a fight here or drag the issue. But its like an un-ending loop. We just seem to contradict ourselves each time.
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My dear Gypsy your posts become a bit redundent. Are you serious about all these questions ? U're neither for Marriage nor for religion. And you are sure of nothing. Well My answer once for all is : God Exists and we are not supposed to prove it for you simply because you 're not looking for something to convince you. Unfortunately u're just messing around . What a pity and what a loss of time .
[img_assist|nid=38314|title=Crazy Frog|desc=|link=node|align=left|width=180|height=179]
Some are Wise ... Some are ...Otherwise
I think i need to start a new forum abt this thing... a real good topic to discuss and innovate.. Do innovate and contribute there..
Gypsy: Good Question but as i answered u b4 .. it's Rules .. something that shud have control over u ..
Rayyz: As i mentioned in my post .. it's to the extend of ur knowledge .. so if u know very well (i'm sure u nkow) that wine is Haram .. then u will be punished for that .. if someone really doesn't know that he won't be punished .. apply this to the rest ..
u said "If u were right" it's not me it's God's book
و الذين آمنوا وعملوا الصالحات سندخلهم جنات تجري من تحتها الأنهار خالدين فيها أبداً لهم فيها أزواج مطهرة وندخلهم ظلاً ظليلاً ) النساء/56-57 .
I'm not sure that u can read arabic .. I wish if someone could translate it (translation appreciated) ... but the explanation is just saying wut i told u .. that the Heaven will be for those who r believers/faithfulness and doing good things in their life ..
He didn't say those who r muslims .. or those who r believing in Islam .. Heaven is not Only for Muslims .. Or where would be Jesus and he is one of God's Messenger .. I don't think he will be in hell cuz he is not Muslim ..
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http://www.showcaseyourmusic.com/LittleGuitarist
"Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake."
Napoleon Bonaparte (1769-1821)
Why only planet earth? Whats with empty spaces in rest of the universe?
I guess they'd be allocated as palaces for the "good" guys in the afterlife. Would be nice though, a planet for one person. Better you've been on earth... bigger the planet you get! :)
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Yay! Way to go Ray!
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GOD could be a gr8 scientist who has a laboratory and is experimenting.
In one of his experiments he created few objects called planets. then he innovated and started putting cells which grew to become animals and all other specices and humans.
he wanted to control humans. so he created few special cells (hindu gods / muslim god / christian god etc.) and gave them their respective names. These fellas had a communication link with this scientist called GOD.
God then put these guys in different parts of the world to control one of his/her creations called humans. he knew how bad his human creation is and so wanted a control mechanism in place.
Now humans being humans.. we followed what these special cells told us to do.
Now GOD wanted some more fun. He did mess up with some of the genes of few people here and there, resulting in some people having one or the other problem. GOD being a scientist. He knew all the scientific terminology and wanted to chk how his creation is behaving with all sorts of mess he created among the genes (sub cells)......
its getting really long..
I will surely continue on this subject on a daily basis untill my theory is complete.
What I am trying to say is God does not have any specific religion.
Thanks for the effort and trying to answer my query Ram.
I wish it was like what you said. I have been asking this question to way too many people and still can't get a convincing answer to it.
Let's say what you said is correct, now if I still remain a good person, believe in one God and live my life with humility, but, I stop fasting, doing my prayers, start drinking alchohol, would I still be in heaven?
Do you think life is fair to me that I was aware of Islam and now bound to do prayers 5 times a day and restrict myself from so many things whereas someone who is totally unaware of it and yet gets to goto to heaven, like you just said. Whats your take on that?
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So Ram, Jauntie, etc, if you don't believe that God follows any particular religion, why follow a religion?
"I fight with love and I laugh with rage, you have to live light enough to see the humor and long enough to see some change." Ani Difranco
Why are you discussing in such length. Some people have not yet completely understood the topic what Gypsy has raised.
Chill dear.
Thanks for the clarification. :) Am glad its only a joke. On the judgement day, if God ended up favoring your religion then I'd be left high and dry. LOL
Well you see, that is exactly is my problem. I cannot get to terms with the explanations given for my question by learned muslims. I'd actually ask someone like PM, Amigo, Aak, Ram or any other learned muslim to tell me if God does not belong to any religion then why do we restrict ourselves from so many worldly pleasures, since religions are man made and they are self imposed anyway. So long as you have been kind and a good person (you know it when you are good or not) you should just goto heaven!
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u said "kafir's will burn in hellfire forever"
That's so right .. but how can u define Kafir
Kafir is the one who is not believing in any religion or in God existance. AND NOT the one who doesn't follow the islam ..
So for A christian he/she is not a kafir .. and Believe me he will be judged on his religion if his/her knowledge didn't reached to Islam ..
Cuz christianity is Also from the Same God, They r worshipping the Same god .. may be in different way but still the same god .. and a lot of wut they believe u will find it in Islam ..
What does Islam means ??? Islam is coming from salam which is peace ..
and all the religions were asking people to live in piece and to be kind to each other and not to hurt each other .. So we all have the same Princible .. so if a christian is living in piece and doing every thing in his life in the right way i don't think he deserve to go to hell cuz he didn't pray as we r doing .. and i would consider him muslim (which means Peaceful)
u said also "Also what you said is contradictory to the explanation "Aak" has provided on the previous page. He said that humans have been given brains and intellect to find the right religion and if they don't realize Islam is the right one then they will not goto heaven."
Go Back to Quraan and u will find a verse says that "god has prepared a heaven that no one will enter except the faithful people"
If it was for only for Muslims he would say "no one will enter except Muslims" which means that in heaven there will be different religions if they were faithful people and doesn't matter if they were muslims or not ...
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http://www.showcaseyourmusic.com/LittleGuitarist
"Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake."
Napoleon Bonaparte (1769-1821)
if everyone can choose his own god then god shud have the right to do it too:)
I'm not even touching that one.
Time for me to go play on the internet, or do the washing up, or just DO something anyway!
please read my post where I said God doesn't belong to ANY religion.
Assuming there is a God it's generally believed He is supernatural. If 'we' believe in a God then that God is the religion WE follow - He doesn't follow our 'Man made' religions, because He made Man!
And for the record, Christians believe that their God is a forgiving God and as such we all get the chance to be forgiven our sins and go to Heaven - although I have heard jokes that we Catholics used to think we would be the only ones there :D
I've just raised the topic people, my own personal beliefs don't really weigh into this. Personally I think God's a scientologist.
"I fight with love and I laugh with rage, you have to live light enough to see the humor and long enough to see some change." Ani Difranco
i do not have read ur earlier posts for correcting my earlier comment. The topic is completely different and nothing to do with a non muslim going to hell for what ever u think.
If u cannot discuss anything related to the subject why increase the length of this topic. Lets us stick to the subject. If u do not know which religion GOD belongs.. why comment with something datz irrelevent and not related to this topic.
Yes ma'am, kafir is for a non-believer.
I suppose you still haven't realised what I am trying to say here. I just want to know what happens to good people such as you, who do not believe follow Islam? Or someone who isn't even aware of Islam?
In other words, the question is very much in line with the topic of this thread. What religion does God belong to? Is it yours or mine!? :)
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........., so now I want you to tell me that if he/she/it/what? does exist, what religion does ? belong to?
gypsy ji into my maths class i to be prove only hypothesis.FIRST STEP IS TO BELIEVE EQUATION EXIST. if you not to be believe into GOD exist than to be NOTHING to prove. thank you madam.
Buddy, I wonder if that was for me?
If it was, then I'd suggest you to read all my previous posts in this thread before jumping the gun. I have been asking a genuine question which is directly related to the title of the thread.
Even if it wasn't for me, I have no idea what made you think that someone else was sounding like a fanatic cos most of the explanations provided here are pretty much fair and reasonable.
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The topic changed to 'what religion does God belong to'. Nothing to do with what a Muslim believes will happen to us "kafir's" after death if we don't follow Islam.
kafir? I guess that is someone who doesn't follow the teachings of Islam, right?
As I have said earlier this forum is gonna become a hot one and make sure QL is not gonna block it.
Some fellows here are trying to highjack it to a completely different subject (RAED FANATICS)
I am afraid that is incorrect.
Am muslim too and from what I know is that kafir's will burn in hellfire forever and only the ones who believed in Tawhid will goto heaven one day, no matter how bad or sinful he was. Isn't that right?
Also what you said is contradictory to the explanation "Aak" has provided on the previous page. He said that humans have been given brains and intellect to find the right religion and if they don't realize Islam is the right one then they will not goto heaven.
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You are welcome .. but i was not advocating .. I was just trying to guide u to the answer .. sometimes the answer is in front of our eyes and we can't see it and still seeking an answer ..
Contradicting Islamic !!
If u really understand Islam u wouldn't say so ..
cuz even in Islam it's mentioned that God will judge every one on his knowledge .. what does it mean?
It means if there is a christian or wutever religion he/she is and he doesn't know about Islam (has no knowledge) that doesn't mean that he will go to hell directly bcuz he/she is not a Muslim (as most of the muslims think) he/she will be judged on his religion and wut he reached with his knowledge ..
So i guess the answer is No, i'm not contradicting Islamic ..
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"Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake."
Napoleon Bonaparte (1769-1821)
Thanks for advocating on her behalf. :)
By endorsing her post, don't you think you are contradicting Islamic beliefs?
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I guess jauntie has answereed u .. read her post again she said "God doesn't 'belong' to any religion"
That's true .. well said Jauntie
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"Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake."
Napoleon Bonaparte (1769-1821)
Yawn! Two days on and we still couldn't find out an answer to what religion does God belong. :(
Whats up with you today?
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Human Beings follow (belong to) many different religions as their "way of life".
Even an atheist, agnostic, scientologist or whatever can follow his beliefs 'religiously'. A religion doesn't have to be to do with belief in any God.
God doesn't 'belong' to any religion. We mere humans usually do.
God is believed by some/many/most(?) to be the Creator of the World (as we know it); the Maker of Mankind; a supernatural being; omnipresent and eternal.
The last paragraph, of course, depends on who's particular God(s) you are referring to at the time!
You have raised a very touchy subject.. i mean there are a lot of fanatics around and they wanna prove just one religion is pure and something of that sort...
Well, u want to know about GOD... I request you to go to (and I mean it) world renowned CANCER / NEUROLOGICAL hospitals and check with the misery and deseration aroound.
DO also check the look of the patients and their family members (both trying their best to recover and at the same time boking / buying 3 feet by 6 feet of earth for their final abode.
Just meet the doctor in any of the cancer hospital.. and you will forget GOD.. I believe in GOD and the power behind the whole of universe.. but he would most certainly be like a good doctor in a cancer hospital, prescribing medicines and looking at the way to save a life or two.. he does not ask for the religion of his / her patient AND neither will GOD differenciate between his poeple on earth.
Fanatics... PLEASE dont reply to this... All others are welcome for your comments
I have no more ways to convince u .. so hope that someone else can do ..
nice to talk to u and to be exposed to a new point of view that i didn't expose to it in reality b4 ..
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"Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake."
Napoleon Bonaparte (1769-1821)
What is the need of a King? I don't believe that there is one. However if we want to talk about democracy, there is a need for that, that way the rules are decided by debate and discussion between many people with many different points of view, rather then by some overriding ruler.
"I fight with love and I laugh with rage, you have to live light enough to see the humor and long enough to see some change." Ani Difranco
Let's think about religion as the Rules ..
u r living in a country .. this country having an Emir, president, king or wutever is ruling the country .. so he puts some rules to follow ..
As if u r saying i believe in the existance of the king but thie rules doesn't make any sense to me .. does that make sense ???
what is the need of a king if u r not going to follow his rules ..
So god does exist (and u believe in that) and he put some Rules (religion) which u should follow .. wut do u think??
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"Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake."
Napoleon Bonaparte (1769-1821)
I've always more or less believed in God Ram. What I don't believe in is religion, never have, never will. Religion makes No sense to me.
"I fight with love and I laugh with rage, you have to live light enough to see the humor and long enough to see some change." Ani Difranco
Gypsy: I'm so glad that we ha d gain a point with u .. at least now u r thinking wut religion does he belong too instead of does he exist .. and that means that ur brain started to convince ...
Gypsy do u remember when u were at school .. i guess u didn't join the high school directly .. first u went to grade 1 then 2 then 3 and so on .. why?? so that ur mind can understand step by step .. thats bcuz u cannot understand it all together .. like in grade 1 u learned the numbers but u were not able to add or subtract ... in grade 2 u learned how to add and subtract ... then divide and multiply .. till u reach an advanced level of Mathematics .. u cannot jump from the first step to the last without passing through the others ..
Religions (all of them) was the school days for Islam (that wut i believe) u can consider them as stages .. our mind wouldn't understand the Islam without having this stages first .. just like the Math class .. and for that reason there was no messengers after Mohammed ..
cuz u were Graduated no more classes to be taken .. but still u can take some courses to understand wut u miss in the school days or in an advanced studies .. Does it make sense to u??
Alexa: God has said in his books (WE (God) raised the sky and if we want we could make it with the ground as one piece)
Forgive my poor english but i'm trying to translate it as much as i can .. i'm not that good in english but i hope u get the point ..
it's something much stronger than a human being's mind can understand
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"Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake."
Napoleon Bonaparte (1769-1821)
Have to agree with Rayyz Amigo, that's really not an answer and more of a....riddle, or a fable or something. Either way the question is no longer does God Exist, it's what religion does God belong to.
"I fight with love and I laugh with rage, you have to live light enough to see the humor and long enough to see some change." Ani Difranco
the fool hath said in his heart, there is no God. they are corrupt they have done abominable works there is none that doeth good.
i was looking for that one as well
Well mine was a serious question. Can you refer back to my post to "Aak" and give an answer to that?
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oh! I thought she was really looking for a serious answer.
amigo you are absolutely right. however the aim of posting this (as claimed by the author herself) is to "sharpen intellect' and revive debates on "boring QL". so just take it that way.!
do it right - the first time!
Fun apart....the qustion is being asked at the wrong forum (if seriously sought). For us who believe in Him its a feeling (just like pain). Sorry mate if u cant feel or see His presence. As they say different strokes for different folks.
I am personally neither qualified nor certified to debate.
I got this forward several times and its become a chain mail of sorts these days. I've read it just once and didn't make much sense to me. Have been deleting it eversince.
Btw, how does that answer either of the two questions? Whether God exists and to what religion does he belong?
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have not gone to a religious scholar...lol....someone emailed me this today.
There was a young man who went overseas to study for quite a long time. When he returned, he asked his parents to find him a religious scholar or any expert who could answer his 3 Questions.
Finally, his parents were able to find a Muslim scholar.
YOung Man:
I have 3 questions:
1. Does God exist? If so, show me His shape.
2. What is fate?
3. If Devil was created from the fire, why at the end he will be thrown to hell that is also created from fire. It certainly will not hurt him at all, since Devil and the hell were created from fire.
Did God not think of it this far?
Suddenly, the SchoLar slapped the young man's face very
hard.
Young Man
(felt pain): Why do you get angry at me?
SchoLar:
I am not angry. The slap is my answer to your three questions.
YOung Man:
I really don't understand.
SchoLar:
How do you feel after I slapped you?
YOung Man:
Of course, I felt the pain.
SchOlar:
So do you believe that pain exists?
YOung Man:
Yes.
SchoLar:
Show me the shape of the pain!
YOung Man:
I cannot.
SchoLar:
That is my first answer. All of us feel God's existence
without being able to see His shape... Last night, did you dream that
you will be slapped by me?
YOung Man:
No.
SchoLar:
Did you ever think that you will get a slap from me,
today?
YOung Man:
No.
SchoLar:
That is fate my second answer........ My hand
that I used to slap you, what is it created from?
YOung Man:
It is created from flesh.
SchoLar:
How about your face, what is it created from?
YOung Man:
Flesh.
SchoLar:
How do you feel after I slapped you?
YOung Man:
In pain.
SchoLar:
That's it. This is my third answer, Even though Devil and also the hell were created from the fire, if Allah wants, insha-Allah (God willing), the hell will become a very painful place for him.
Yes Willard, that's why the question is now IF God does exist, what religion does he belong to?
"I fight with love and I laugh with rage, you have to live light enough to see the humor and long enough to see some change." Ani Difranco
Gypsy,
the words already came from your thought/mouth...
you mentioned about a "divine force" and said," For me personally I "feel" the work of a divine plan or creator"... these alone answers your very own question about the existence of God... the very existence of evil concludes the existence of God himself... where there is evil, there is God... where the first trying to surpass God's ever presence and power...
When I was in my teens we used to spend school dinner time in my house bacause my Mum was out at work.
I won't bore you with the thinks that happend while we were doing it.
But, my Mum pulled me up with a VERY concerned and serious look on her face and said "whatever it is you have been doing in the house when I am out, can you please stop it, because it is starting to affect me."
It frightened the life out of me.
Whoever I have been with while doing it we have always got the same caracters coming through. I don't reccomend it.
Call me Maninibat!
LOL Gypsy! Way to go. We could have some serious fireworks before Eid! Hehehehe
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I reckon God's an atheist.
Joe Williams
[email protected]
http://earsopen.blogspot.com/
My question was very specific to people living in certain parts of the world where they have not moved out of their village, let alone hear of Islam.
There so many places still existing in this world where members of that community have no knowledge of anything beyond their village.
How do you expect them to 'discover' Islam by using their brain when they haven't even heard of it? All they have been doing is following the religion they've learnt from their parents/ancestors. Even if by chance, if they did hear of Islam from somewhere, lets say television or radio. They'd probably discount it as the wrong religion. Can you imagine someone walking upto you and saying Islam is not the right religion but some other religion is. How would you take that? You'd probably say he's gone nuts!
Also my question regarding people who died unaware of Islam wasn't about the people in the past, I was asking about the ones in today's times. What happens to them? Do the burn in fire because they died as Kaafir's or goto heaven cos they were simply the deprieved ones and no one reached them to teach about Islam?
If they do goto heaven, then why wasn't I lucky enough to be in that guy's place? Atleast he had his fair share of fun growing up doing whatever he liked to do and ended up going to heaven eventually. Was life fair to me?
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Cool idea Rayyz, Done and done!
"I fight with love and I laugh with rage, you have to live light enough to see the humor and long enough to see some change." Ani Difranco
Ram : I sort of agree with Gypsy. How could one know which religion is correct? Isn't it amazing to think that despite all these religions existing for so many years, there are so many millions of people around the world who are deprieved of knowing which exactly is the true religion? Whether it is Christianity, Islam, Judaism, Hinduism. All but one of them is wrong for sure! Is it right on God's part not to have let his beings know about his true religion?
Gypsy : You could perhaps spice this thread by changing the title to, "Which religion God belongs to?" LOL. Btw, speaking of some divine power that is behind creation of earth and humans. Then tell me whats with creation of rest of the universe and other planets? Why can't we find any other creatures besides earth? Could it be possible that humans were created or formed as a matter of chance? Like the way bacteria is formed from nothing.
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See The Official God FAQ, at:
http://www.400monkeys.com/God/
I don't go to mythical places with strange men.
-- Douglas Adams, The Long Dark Tea-Time of the Soul.
There are online Ouiji boards??? Sweet! Another way to pass my day!
"I fight with love and I laugh with rage, you have to live light enough to see the humor and long enough to see some change." Ani Difranco
Check out this answer I found on Yahoo answers for Ouija Board.
"I've responded to similar questions on Yahoo! Answers before, and I've replied in so many ways that I don't think Ouija boards are evil. I own a glow-in-the-dark model and I've never been visited by spirits when using it. Superstitious people often attribute ominous characteristics to the most innocuous of items. If you're prone to believe there are evil spirits among us then you're probably apt to believe that Ouija boards are evil or dangerous. I don't. I enjoy scary movies and tales about supernatural or ghostly things, but I've outgrown most of the fears that I developed as a child. I'd encourage you to try out an on-line Ouija board--by yourself."
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Ram, what you are describing is more of a divine force. The same thing many people describe when they say you can just "feel" the existence of God. The beauty of nature, evolution, etc.
For me personally I "feel" the work of a divine plan or creator, HOWEVER I do not at any point believe that that divine force spoke to Moses, Jesus, Mohammed or Binky the Clown. To me religion makes about as much sense as tits on a bull. Why would a divine creator push all this into motion just to turn around and condemn it? Why would he give us brains if he didn't want us to make decisions? Religion is what I believe doesn't exist.
"I fight with love and I laugh with rage, you have to live light enough to see the humor and long enough to see some change." Ani Difranco
probably should ask urself how you came into existence. what really happened where were you b4 that???
[img_assist|nid=21285|title=.|desc=|link=none|align=left|width=180|height=180]
forget all this ...how can you play the Ouja-Board without...sprits!!??!
Its played by invoking sprits.....now tell me how does it happen?
So why does god care if people are gay, but is fine with people marrying their first cousins?
'Our freedom is but a light that breaks through from another world'
Gypsy, human mind cannot comprehend god's existence. It is not capable. Brain believes in logic. However, when you are spirtually enlightened you may feel ashamed of this very question you have asked.
further..Cain and his followers.....had the "Tree of Knowledge" with them. And they branched out.
The 7 Continents can be linked to the Destruction of the tower of Babel (mostly by earthquake caused by shifting of plates.)
The 7 continents were previously one (scientist believe that) and then shifted apart.
The birth of different languages started from there. And also this goes to prove that the World was one place and not the "world that they knew at those times".
Also Due to the period floods (since world was one place) the sinking of the landmass was possible. Also Noha's flood was the last BIG-Flood. Thus any proof man's birth during those times can only be found if "those sites" are excavated may be to more than 100metres, as periodic flooding can cover previously exposed landmass with silt.
Gypsy,
God does exist and he has proved himself in various ways.If you are not convinced with all that he has already done,then the only way for you is to wait till he returns to prove it again but then you won't get a chance to believe.
Now about whether he cares if you are a Gay or not-Yes he does cares and if you want to be sure read ROMANS 1:25,26,27.To understand this or to be convinced you got to believe that Bible is the word of God otherwise nothing can convince you.
We human beings are created by GOD and we are asking our creater to prove that he exist.I am sure he must be laughing up there.
Time to Go home.Catch you tomorrow.
Cheers
You should take a trip to Fanar and ask ur questions, they will be answered by someone there... maybe then u will see the other side of the coin!
Too much to read but here is a theory;
Lots of things around us can be explained and catagorized by us but many things can't, so where do we catagorize them?
For instance, I think we all agree that atoms exist, but why do they pull themselves into a suitable composite form to make a human being [for instance] and constantly re-form into replacement bits and bobs to keep the form working?
Only to shut the form down and all break up then go and form other things, for no particular reason?
We don't know why so we say it is the working of some higher bieng.
If you believe in natural selection and the evolution of species or not there is a strong case for it, but how does some thing evolve an eye from where there was no eye before?
It is beyond our understanding, so it must be the work of a higher bieng,.
Shouldn't it?
As for the rules, I believe they are the work of high ranking individuals in past civilisations who want to offer guidence and order to otherwise chaotic settlements of people.
Of they tried to impose the rules as their own there would be difficulties in enforcement.
But if the rules are from the higher being then who could argue with them?
It's a bit like my Mrs telling the kids they had better do as they are told or Dad will be annoyed when he gets home.
I'm sure those ancient authors of the various beeks genuinly believed in what they were doing and I admire them for it, but who can say it was the word of God?
They will recount instances of God talking to people and asking for his word to be passed on.
My nephew is a paranoid schizophrenic and hears voices in his head all the time, could this be the same thing?
Call me Maninibat!
Gypsy I can accept your Question but at the same time I wonder if you believe the Darwin Theory?
Its possible to work backwards to Adam & Eve but its impossible to suddenly crossbreed & create the "Homo Sapian" that too as a couple. Not only that they had to keep doing that until the "Homo-Sapian" species were quite in number so as to survive in the wild (cause they were not developed to the level of Man).
The Darwin Theory is full of Holes if you take into Account the Blood groups & Eye colour.
One can divide mankind upon Skin colour (environment & climate affects the pigmentation) but you have only 5 blood groups.
Also one cannot use a monkeys blood on human!!!
The common Blood groups being A, B, & O.
Now if you bring in the Lucefarin suduction of Eve this makes sense.
as there were 3 people (Adam, Lucifer & Eve) involved in creating Able & Cain.
do u believe in wut u wrote ?? our body is made up of Atoms and so on ..
u poor guy .. u r a loser
can u tell me who is holding the sky .. how it is hanging up there .. or u gonna say it's flying atoms
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"Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake."
Napoleon Bonaparte (1769-1821)
Past Life...
Our body is made up of Atoms. When we die whether we are burried or burnt the result is the same...we go back to the soil...attach to some seed, become some plant, or some bird eat that seed and become part of that bird ...etc.
Matter is what matter was....or something like that.
Technically the Line in Thora-Koran-Bible "Wake up the dead" is not possbible.
This shows that the words & the lines in scriptures are not to be taken as it is but in the context of what is being said.
ur existence is a proof itself ... can u tell me from where did u come??
Ohh i know that very well u came from ur mum's tummy
ok and what about u mum and dad?? the same thing .. keep going on and on till u reach Adam and Eve ... from where they came ?? NO ONE .. God has created Them ..
same goes to the first bird, animal or insect ...
Havn't u ever looked to an ant .. how it dig her way through the ground without tools ??? i bet u can't do this without a tool even if u tried that for 100 years?? is the ant much stronger than u while u can kill it with just a finger press .. who gave it the ability to do this??
the creator .. and who is the creator ?? if u can create an ant i would worship u and call u a god and i bet u can't do it ..
SO simply it's God ..
you don't need a big obvious proof to believe .. if u just watched the details of life u will know that GOD do really exist ..
hope that answer ur question ...
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"Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake."
Napoleon Bonaparte (1769-1821)
Hmmm. Thatz a question I would like to speak in length.. but due to ramadan timings.. u know have to leave today .. but will surely have my theory put across here.
Patience dear
THat stuff about there being facts in the Quran that couldn't have been known is total and utter bollox. I have done the research on this. THe verses in the quran are classically vague and have just been interpreted.
Such a sh1t reason to devote your whole life to not having fun
rayyz....witness it...
All religions have it.....
As for mental illness ...a mentally ill person (stranger) cannot tell you your past...!!! Where as a man possed with sprits can.
Just like The Book of the Law , was received by Aleister Crowley in Cairo, Egypt in the year 1904.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Book_of_the_Law
Rayyz, You have put me in a difficult situation by asking me to explain quite difficult questions, but still I would try to, as this is the only way we can deal with them... I remember a lecture by Bilal Philip where he argues the same question, he said "I say I got this knowledge from my parents who got it from theirs"...But there is no guarantee that my fathers father knowledge was right, unless he got his knowledge from Allah and his rasool...
Therefore, being born in any religion is not anybody's fault...the fault is although God sent him with a superior brain, he did not use it to get to the correct path. The onus to find the right path lies on you and nobody else. You dont wait for ppl to travel to u and convince you that Allah is one... You have to find out...
Regarding your questions on ppl who died before Islam or christaianity.. it s very clear in islam, those who agreed with the Prophets of their time and did not reject any other prophet were all muslims.... therefore, a person beliveing in Moses died before Jesus was a Muslim, A person who believed in Jesus before Mohammad was Muslim. Its only after the first person failed to believe in Jesus and only believed in Moses that he unbelieved and similarly afterwards
.....You can't mean what you say unless you can say what you mean...
God's non-existence is accepted and trivial, if only in the sense that we can never absolutely prove the non-existence of anything. What matters is not whether God is disprovable, but whether his existence is probable. Look up Bertrand Russell's parable of the celestial teapot.
***********
"There's this thing called being so open-minded your brains drop out". - Richard Dawkins
Nopes never!
I have yet to meet a person who has been possessed, but from what I can imagine, I think its state of mental illness more than anything else.
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rayyz ...Gypsy....ever witnessed Exorcism?
Great, I am a Muslim too, Alhamdulillah. But few things have been bugging me a lot lately. Let's not put it on Satan for putting thoughts in my mind.
Can you explain this for me please?
What happens to people after their deaths from other religions? What is their fault that they were born into another religion and have been praying someother God. They were just following what were taught to do so eversince their birth? For instance in smaller towns of China, there are millions of people who have idea of existence of any other religion other their own and die even before hearing of Islam or Christianity! This is only an example, there are millions of similar smaller towns or villages that exist in this world. Are those people just plain unlucky or doomed in the afterlife?
What is their fault in it, that Allah or Jesus or Krishna decided to put them on earth in such a remote place and they ended up worshipping someone else?
If you are saying that it is a duty of a Muslim to reach different parts of the world and make them aware of Islam then still it doesn't really justify. What happens if no one reaches that part of the world before some of them die?
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Gypsy u're actually a hopeless case :D
[img_assist|nid=38314|title=Crazy Frog|desc=|link=node|align=left|width=180|height=179]
Some are Wise ... Some are ...Otherwise
Life is Beautiful...Indeed!
Those answers don't answer my questions Azee. None of them prove the existence of God.
"I fight with love and I laugh with rage, you have to live light enough to see the humor and long enough to see some change." Ani Difranco
Below is the link to find the answers of your question , especially existence of God
http://www.irf.net/irf/download/index.htm
Rayyz, Alhumdulillah I am A Muslim...and as far as the questions are concerned, I can also ask these kind of questions.... We need to reply in the best possible and not confusing manner, which I find myself to be incapable of....I would only quote Einstein ""Coincidence is God's way of remaining anonymous."
...You can't mean what you say unless you can say what you mean...
Well, I doubt that we'll ever find out if God exists or not. What we should be worried about at the moment is HOW we live our lives. Religions might've/could've/should've been created to give us a guide to being good human beings. Some people misuse religion as an excuse for terrorism or wars............
For example, the Qu'ran doesn't tell ANYONE to strap a C4 to their body and go running around a public place in the name of God. Since, the guilty people will be punished later anyways... I guess. We should be using the religious books and stuff to GUIDE our lives and not FOLLOW the books word by word. If it helps you to pray to someone as it gives you the feeling that all will be well, then go ahead. Whether this has any affect on your afterlife is questionable as we can't be sure that there is an afterlife. Who knows? It all depends on how you interpret the words of holy books and how they've changed over 2000 years, even though many say that they haven't...
Anyways, the religions are all mostly the same and try to bring out the good human qualities in everyone, however, some people take it toooooooooooooo seriously. I guess you should just live your life the way you want as long as you don't cause anyone else grief and suffering. I is not making sense, eh? Oh well...
Azee the main causes of theft are poverty, are you saying that Islam has figured out a way to end poverty? No. As long as there is poverty there will be theft, and I refuse to cut the hand off someone who stole food because they were hungry.
Also rape rates are just as high here and in the US, the difference is rape cases are reported more frequently in the US! Here they are rarely reported.
Why not read some of the news that comes out of Saudi if you believe so much in Sharia law.
"I fight with love and I laugh with rage, you have to live light enough to see the humor and long enough to see some change." Ani Difranco
Jack : I don't believe ghosts exist either! I'm serious. Now what?
Kitkat : Previous life? Please don't pile my soul with sins from my previous life! As it is, I am S*hit scared of sins that I've done in this life. How do I know that I ever had a previous life anyway?
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Gypsy ...Is there butter in Milk? How do to find out?
Its for you to find it, ie...go through the task.
Long ago I too thought so.....But kept on researching. Then suddenly it all fits like a puzzle.
I might/might not be able to prove to you or my own friends or my offspring that there is God. Its for him/her to find out.
How hard have you tried?
How many religious scripts/scriptures have you read?
Read as much as you can on every religion you can find.
Dont try to negate/compare one religion with the other. Try to fit one with the other .....they all fit.
The Journey might take days.....years...sometimes a life time.
The easiest way is to check out Witchcraft, Blackmagic, Exocisim...etc (which exist accross all seas, oceans, continents almost universally....the Dark/black side of Spirituality. That is proveable.
If anybody watches real life-Exocism for the first time it would put the fright of God in him for good.
If the Devil is proveable then the oppsite does exist by default!!!
Aak : Do you mind me asking what religion do you belong to? Do you want me to repeat my questions written above?
Azee : Please do not cut and paste lines from a website. I know I can goto www.islamqa.com and read it there. If you have something to say on your own then please do so.
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As I mentioned, to make your prayer work, you need to practice a lot. When you reach a certain level then only your prayers are answered, there is no one to guide them the right way of reaching GOD. Some people are suffering in this world because of their sins in their previous life.
UGH Azee! No cutting and pasting please. Most of it is just jibberish anyway!
"I fight with love and I laugh with rage, you have to live light enough to see the humor and long enough to see some change." Ani Difranco
Your thinking and beliefs may be wrong as well... just prove that you are right...
You can't mean what you say unless you can say what you mean...
All religions basically teach followers to do good deeds. Why should a person only follow Islam? Can he not follow any of the religions?
Answer
1. Major difference between Islam and most other religions
All religions basically exhort mankind to be righteous and eschew evil. But Islam goes beyond that. It guides us towards practical ways of achieving righteousness and eliminating evil from our individual and collective lives. Islam takes into account human nature and the complexities of human society. Islam is guidance from the Creator Himself. Therefore, Islam is also called the Deen-ul-Fitrah (the natural religion of Man).
2. Example - Islam commands us to shun robbery and also prescribes method of eleminating robbery
1.
Islam prescribes method of eliminating robbery
All major religions teach that theft is an evil act. Islam teaches the same. So what is the difference between Islam and the other religions? The difference lies in the fact that Islam, besides teaching that robbing is evil, shows a practical way of creating a social structure in which people will not rob.
2.
Islam prescribes Zakaat
Islam prescribes a system of Zakaat (obligatory annual charity). Islamic law prescribes that every person who has a saving that exceeds the nisaab level i.e. more than 85 grams of gold, should give 2.5% of that saving every lunar year in charity. If every rich person in the world gave Zakaat sincerely, poverty will be eradicated from this world. Not a single human being would die of hunger.
3.
Chopping off the hands as punishment for robbery
Islam prescribes chopping off the hands of the convicted robber. The Glorious Qur’an says in Surah Maidah:
"As to the thief, male or female, cut off his or her hands:a punishment by way
of example, from Allah, for their crime: and Allah is Exalted in power, full of wisdom."
[ Al-Qur’an 5:38]
The non-Muslim may say, "Chopping off the hands in this 20th century. Islam is a barbaric and ruthless religion!"
4.
Results achieved when Islamic Shariah Implemented
America is supposed to be one of the most advanced countries in the world. Unfortunately it also has one of the highest rates of crime, theft, and robbery. Suppose the Islamic shariah is implemented in America i.e. every rich person gives Zakaat ( 2.5% of his savings in charity above 85 grams of gold every lunar year), and every convicted robber has his or her hands chopped off as a punishment. Will the rate of theft and robbery in America increase, remain same or decrease? Naturally it will decrease. Moreover the existence of such a stringent law would discourage many a potential robber.
I agree that the amount of theft that takes place in the world today is so tremendous that if you chop off the hands of all the thieves, there will be tens of thousands of people whose hands will be chopped off. The point here is that the moment you implement this law the rate of theft will decline immediately. The potential robber would give it a serious thought before jeopardizing his limbs. The mere thought of the punishment itself will discourage majority of the robbers. There will barely be a few who would rob. Hence only a few person’s hands would be chopped off but millions would live peacefully without fear of being robbed.
Islamic Shariah is therefore practical, and achieves results.
3. Example: Islam prohibits the molestation and rape of women. It enjoins hijaab and prescribes capital punishment for a convicted rapist.
1. Islam prescribes method of eliminating molestation and rape
All the major religions declare the molestation and rape of women as grave sins. Islam teaches the same. What then is the difference between Islam and the other religions? The difference lies in the fact that Islam does not merely preach respect for women, or abhor molestation and rape as serious crimes, but also gives clear guidance as to how society can eliminate such crimes.
2. Hijaab for men
Islam has a system of hijaab. The Glorious Qur’an first mentions hijaab for the men and then for the women. Hijaab for the men is mentioned in the following verse:
"Say to the believing men that they should lower their gaze and guard their modesty: that will make for greater purity for them: and Allah is well acquainted with all that they do."
[Al-Qur’an 24:30]
The moment a man looks at a woman and if any brazen or unashamed thought comes to his mind, he should lower his gaze.
3. Hijaab for women
Hijaab for women is mentioned in the following verse:
"And say to the believing women that they should lower their gaze and guard their modesty; that they should not display their beauty and ornaments except what (must ordinarily) appear thereof; that they should draw their veils over their bosoms and not display their beauty except to their husbands, their fathers, their husbands’ fathers, their sons...."
[Al-Qur’an 24:31]
The extent of hijaab for a woman is that her complete body should be covered. The only part that can be seen, are the face and the hands up to the wrists. If they wish to cover, they can even cover these parts of the body. However some Islamic scholars insist that even the face should be covered.
4. Hijaab prevents molestation
The reason why Allah has prescribed Hijaab for the women is given in the Qur’an in the folowing verse of Surah Al-Ahzab:
"O Prophet! Tell thy wives and daughters, and the believing women,that they should cast their outer garments over their persons (when abroad): that is most convenient, that they should be known (as such) and not molested. And Allah is Oft-Forgiving, most Merciful."
[Al-Qur’an 33:59]
The Qur’an says that Hijaab has been prescribed for the women so that they are recognized as modest women this would prevent them from being molested.
5. Example of twin sisters
Suppose two sisters who are twins and who are equally beautiful, walk down a street. One of them is wearing the Islamic Hijaab i.e. the complete body is covered except for the face and the hands up to the wrists, and the other twin is wearing a mini skirt or shorts. Around the corner there is a hooligan who is waiting for an opportunity to tease a girl. Who will he tease? The girl wearing the Islamic Hijaab or the girl wearing the mini skirt or shorts? Dresses that expose more than they conceal, are an indirect temptation to the opposite sex for teasing, molestation and rape. The Qur’an rightly says that the hijaab prevents women from being molested.
6. Capital punishment for rapist
The Islamic shariah prescribes capital punishment for a convicted rapist. The non-Muslim may be horrified at such a stringent punishment in this age. Many accuse Islam of being ruthless and barbaric. I have asked a common question to hundreds of non-Muslim men. Suppose God-forbid, some one rapes your wife, your mother or your sister and you are made the judge. The rapist is brought in front of you. What punishment would you give him? All of them said, "we would put him to death." Some went to the extent of saying, "we would torture him to death", If your wife or your mother is raped you want the rapist to be put to death. But if someone else’s wife or mother is raped, capital punishment is a barbaric law. Why the double standards?
7. U.S.A. has one of the highest rate of Rape
The United States of America is supposed to be one of the most advanced countries of the world. An F.B.I report in the year 1990 says that 1,02,555 cases of rape were reported. It further says that only 16% of the cases of rapes are reported. Thus, in order to know the actual number of rapes that took place in 1990, the reported figure should be multiplied by 6.25. We get a total of 6,40,968 rape cases that took place in the year 1990. If the total is divided by 365 the number of days in a year, we get an average of 1,756 rape incidents everyday.
Later another report said that an average of 1900 cases of rape are committed in U.S.A every day. According to National Crime Victimization Survey Bureau of Justice Statistics (U. S. Dept. of Justice) in 1996 alone 3,07,000 cases of rape were reported. Only 31% of the actual cases of rape were reported. Thus, 3,07,000 X 3.226 = 9,90,322 rapes took place in 1996. That is, an average of 2,713 cases of rape took place everyday in America in 1996. Every 32 seconds one rape is taking place in America. Maybe American rapists got bolder. The FBI report of 1990 continues and says that out of the rape cases that were reported only 10% of the rapist were arrested, that is only 1.6% of the actual rapes committed. Out of those arrested, 50% were let free before the trial. This would mean that only 0.8% of the rapists faced a trial. In other words if a person commits 125 rapes the chances that he will get a punishment for rape is only once. Many would consider this a good gamble. And the report says that of those people who faced trial 50% received sentences of less than a year’s imprisonment though the American law says rape carries a seven year sentence of imprisonment. For a rapist, the judge is lenient to first time offenders. Imagine a person commits 125 rapes and the chances of being convicted is only once, and 50% of the time the judge will grant leniency and give a sentence of less than a year!
8. Results achieved when Islamic Shariah Implemented
Suppose the Islamic shariah is implemented in America. Whenever a man looks at a woman and if any brazen or unashamed thought comes to his mind, he lowers his gaze. Every woman wears the Islamic Hijaab, that is the complete body is covered except the face and the hands upto the wrists. After this if any man commits rape, he gets capital punishment. The question is, will the rate of rape in America increase, will it remain the same or will it decrease? Naturally it will decrease. Islamic Shariah gets results.
4. Islam has Practical Solutions for the Problems of Mankind
Islam is the best way of life because its teachings are not doctrinaire rhetoric but practical solutions for the problems of mankind. Islam achieves results both at the individual and collective levels. Islam is the best way of life because it is a practical, universal religion not confined to any ethnic group or nationality.
Thanks for the lines. I'd rather love to listen from you rather than you cutting and pasting lines from a website. You could have pasted the link to the page instead.
Aak : Well I have posed a few question, can you answer those for me please?
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No the I think the responsibilty is up to the Religions to prove that God exists the way they say he does. I don't believe he does.
"I fight with love and I laugh with rage, you have to live light enough to see the humor and long enough to see some change." Ani Difranco
1. Belief in the hereafter is not based on blind faith?
Many people wonder as to how a person with a scientific and logical temperament, can lend any credence to the belief of life after death. People assume that anyone believing in the hereafter is doing so on the basis of blind belief.
My belief in the hereafter is based on a logical argument.
2. Hereafter a logical belief
There are more than a thousand verses in the Glorious Qur’an, containing scientific facts (refer my book "Qur’an and Modern Science-Compatible or Incompatible?"). Many facts mentioned in the Qur’an have been discovered in the last few centuries. But science has not advanced to a level where it can confirm every statement of the Qur’an.
Suppose 80% of all that is mentioned in the Qur’an has been proved 100% correct. About the remaining 20%, science makes no categorical statement, since it has not advanced to a level, where it can either prove or disprove these statements. With the limited knowledge that we have, we cannot say for sure whether even a single percentage or a single verse of the Qur’an from this 20% portion is wrong. Thus when 80% of the Qur’an is 100% correct and the remaining 20% is not disproved, logic says that even the 20% portion is correct. The existence of the hereafter, which is mentioned in the Qur’an, falls in the 20% ambiguous portion which my logic says is correct.
3. Concept of peace and human values is useless without the concept of hereafter
Is robbing a good or an evil act? A normal balanced person would say it is evil. How would a person who does not believe in the hereafter convince a powerful and influential criminal that robbing is evil?
Suppose I am the most powerful and influential criminal in the world. At the same time I am an Intelligent and a logical person. I say that robbing is good because it helps me lead a luxurious life. Thus robbing is good for me.
If anybody can put forward a single logical argument as to why it is evil for me, I will stop immediately. People usually put forward the following arguments:
a. The person who is robbed will face difficulties
Some may say that the person who is robbed will face difficulties. I certainly agree that it is bad for the person who is robbed. But it is good for me. If I rob a thousand dollars, I can enjoy a good meal at a 5 star restaurant.
b. Someone may rob you
Some people argue that someday I may be robbed. No one can rob me because I am a very powerful criminal and I have hundreds of bodyguards. I can rob anybody but nobody can rob me. Robbing may be a risky profession for a common man but not for an influential person like me.
c. The police may arrest you
Some may say, if you rob, you can be arrested by the police. The police cannot arrest me because I have the police on my payroll. I have the ministers on my payroll. I agree that if a common man robs, he will be arrested and it will be bad for him, but I am an extraordinarily influential and powerful criminal.
Give me one logical reason why it is bad for me and I will stop robbing.
d. Its easy money
Some may say its easy money and not hard-earned money. I agree completely that it is easy money, and that is one of the main reasons why I rob. If a person has the option of earning money the easy as well as the hard way, any logical person would choose the easy way.
e. It is against humanity
Some may say it is against humanity and that a person should care for other human beings. I counter argue by asking as to who wrote this law called ‘humanity’ and why should I follow it?
This law may be good for the emotional and sentimental people but I am a logical person and I see no benefit in caring for other human beings.
f. It is a selfish act
Some may say that robbing is being selfish. It is true that robbing is a selfish act; but then why should I not be selfish? It helps me enjoy life.
1. No logical reason for robbing being an evil act
Hence all arguments that attempt to prove that robbing is an evil act are futile. These arguments may satisfy a common man but not a powerful and influential criminal like me. None of the arguments can be defended on the strength of reason and logic. It is no surprise that there are so many criminals in this world.
Similarly raping, cheating etc. can be justified as good for a person like me and there is no logical argument that can convince me that these things are bad.
2. A Muslim can convince a powerful and influential criminal
Now let us switch sides. Suppose you are the most powerful and influential criminal in the world, who has the police and the ministers on his payroll. You have army of thugs to protect you. I am a Muslim who will convince you that robbing, raping, cheating, etc. are evil acts.
Even if I put forth the same arguments to prove that robbing is evil the criminal will respond the same way as he did earlier.
I agree that the criminal is being logical and all his arguments are true only when he is the most powerful and influential criminal.
3. Every human being wants justice
Each and every human being desires justice. Even if he does not want justice for others he wants justice for himself. Some people are intoxicated by power and influence and inflict pain and suffering on others. The same people, however, would surely object if some injustice was done to them. The reason such people become insensitive to the suffering of others is that they worship power and influence. Power and influence, they feel, not only allows them to inflict injustice on others but also prevents others from doing likewise to them.
4. God is Most Powerful and Just
As a Muslim I would convince the criminal about the existence of Almighty God (refer to answer proving the existence of God). This God is more powerful than you and at the same time is also just. The Glorious Qur’an says:
"Allah is never unjust
In the least degree"
[Al-Qur’an 4:40]
5. Why does God not punish me?
The criminal, being a logical and scientific person, agrees that God exists, after being presented with scientific facts from the Qur’an. He may argue as to why God, if He is Powerful and Just, does not punish him.
6. The people who do injustice should be punished
Every person who has suffered injustice, irrespective of financial or social status, almost certainly wants the perpetrator of injustice to be punished. Every normal person would like the robber or the rapist to be taught a lesson. Though a large number of criminals are punished, many even go scot-free. They lead a pleasant, luxurious life, and even enjoy a peaceful existence. If injustice is done to a powerful and influential person, by someone more powerful and more influential than he, even such a person would want that person perpetrators of injustice to be punished.
7. This life is a test for the hereafter
This life is a test for the hereafter. The Glorious Qur’an says:
"He who created Death
And life that He
May try which of you
Is best in deed;
And He is the Exalted
In Might, Oft-Forgiving"
[Al-Qur’an 67:2]
8. Final justice on day of judgement
The Glorious Qur’an says:
"Every soul shall have
A taste of death:
And only on the Day
Of Judgement shall you
Be paid your full recompense.
Only he who is saved
Far from the Fire
And admitted to the Garden
Will have attained
The object (of life):
For the life of this world
Is but goods and chattels
Of deception."
[Al-Qur’an 3:185]
Final justice will be meted out on the Day of Judgement. After a person dies, he will be resurrected on the Day of Judgement along with the rest of mankind. It is possible that a person receives part of his punishment in this world. The final reward and punishment will only be in the hereafter. God Almighty may not punish a robber or a rapist in this world but he will surely be held accountable on the Day of Judgement and will be punished in the hereafter i.e. life after death.
9. What punishment can the human law give Hitler?
Hitler incinerated six million Jews during his reign of terror. Even if the police had arrested him, what punishment can the human law give Hitler for justice to prevail? The most they can do is to send Hitler to the gas chamber. But that will only be punishment for the killing of one Jew. What about the remaining five million, nine hundred and ninety nine thousand, nine hundred and ninety-nine Jews?
10. Allah can burn Hitler more than six million times in hellfire
Allah say in the Glorious Qur’an:
"Those who reject
Our signs, We shall soon
Cast into the Fire;
As often as their skins
Are roasted through,
We shall change them
For fresh skins,
That they may taste
The penalty: for Allah
Is Exalted in Power, Wise"
[Al-Qur’an 4:56]
If Allah wishes he can incinerate Hitler six million times in the hereafter in the hellfire.
11. No concept of human values or good and bad without concept of hereafter
It is clear that without convincing a person about the hereafter, i.e. life after death, the concept of human values and the good or evil nature of acts is impossible to prove to any person who is doing injustice especially when he is influential and powerful.
Thanks for the compliment!
I'd like to take credit for that, right Gyps? LOL
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Does God exist? I find it interesting that so much attention is given to this debate. The latest surveys tell us that over 90% of people in the world today believe in the existence of God or some higher power. Yet, somehow the responsibility is placed on those who believe God does exist to somehow prove that He really does exist. To me, I think it should be the other way around
...You can't mean what you say unless you can say what you mean...
Just when an interesting topic like this comes along I gotta run....i'll check back in tomorrow....always interesting to read all the other QLers opinions....just remember to play nice all.
My hat's off to you Gypsy...you're on fire today with the inetersting topics!
Stay safe all.
Perfection does not exist. The question therefore, is: what level of imperfection are we willing to settle for?
I'd still call it as coincidence. Tell me why there is so much poverty and suffering even to people who pray the most?
Infact the rich guys pray the least and poor ones pray the maximum, yet they're the deprieved ones and always promised of a great life in the hereafter.
I am talking about rich not just financially, but mental state of happiness as well. Even otherwise, let's admit is money is indeed a major cause of mental state of unhappiness in countries below the poverty line.
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KitKat, lots of psychiatrists and psychologist today believe in the power of positive thinking, that if you think positively and act positively, postive things will happen. This is what occurs when people pray. Also look at things like "faith Healing" the human mind is a complex thing, it can trick itself into believing almost anything.
"I fight with love and I laugh with rage, you have to live light enough to see the humor and long enough to see some change." Ani Difranco
what about the poor bu**ers who don't miss the accident, don't recover from the fatal illness and who's prayers are not answered?
***********
"There's this thing called being so open-minded your brains drop out". - Richard Dawkins
If god is responsible for determining right from wrong....then why are all the major religions based on the ten commandments....which are themselves taken from Hamurabi's code that predates religion by thousands of years....God wouldn't need to plagiarize?
Stay safe all.
Perfection does not exist. The question therefore, is: what level of imperfection are we willing to settle for?
I'd buy that explanation, "Whatever be the religion, there is only one God, its the supreme power God treats all religion equally. If you worship Allah or Jesus or Buddha or Krishna its all the same! it makes no difference to GOD. Religion is man created, but GOD is the universal power."
But that may not be the case with all the religions you know. You have to worship the right God to get thru to heaven.
Also, why do we have to keep praying Him to please him? Isn't the belief and knowledge with acceptance that someone superior has created us isn't enough to take us thru?
I never asked God to create me, I'd rather be happy as to have been never existed rather than find myself in hell after 60 odd years of a testing life on planet earth.
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Coincidence wont happen many times, I can make things happen with my prayers...it may sound stupid.. but with meditation and prayers its possible. If you read more about it, you can try it yourself...IT WORKS. Not like winning a lottery or something. I can change a difficult situation to my favour, or change a person’s attitude towards me.
TCM, all of that isn't actually proof. It could just as easily be explained by coincidence. There is more scientific proof today that Jesus wasn't the son of God and that was actually made up later to make more people follow the religion.
"I fight with love and I laugh with rage, you have to live light enough to see the humor and long enough to see some change." Ani Difranco
What about those who practice polytheism...they do not believe that there is ONE god....are your beielfs better than theirs?
I'm not picking on you....just food for thought.
Stay safe all.
Perfection does not exist. The question therefore, is: what level of imperfection are we willing to settle for?
GOD exist, you can prove it within oneself, HE is around...HE exist, from the moment you sleep and the mystery of waking up..HE is responsible for everything you see, feel...
GOD is responsible to determine what is right and wrong...to feel guilt and compassion...
well, the list is endless that GOD do exist..:)
[img_assist|nid=12867|title=Nothing in life is to be feared. It is only to be understood.|desc= |link=none|align=left|width=44|height=180]
Whatever be the religion, there is only one God, its the supreme power God treats all religion equally. If you worship Allah or Jesus or Buddha or Krishna its all the same! it makes no difference to GOD. Religion is man created, but GOD is the universal power. Believing in God is not called religious, people who practice too much religion is called religious... I know, I dont make much sense ..LOL
Good question!
Well for two reasons mainly :
1. If God didn't exist, I'd rather save my time from pains of going to a Mosque, Church or a Temple.
2. If he did, then I'd rather be in the right boat than the wrong one. Don't wanna get screwed up forever you know in the afterlife! LOL
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http://www.everystudent.com/features/isthere.html
If you can't change your fate, change your attitude.
please pray to YOUR God(s) that I don't crucify my Yahoo Rating any more than I already have.
:P
"When you near miss an accident, you recover from a fatal illness. When your prayers are heard, When you get want to wish for which may be near impossible."
I could also be a good mixture of coincidence and superstition.
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why to border yourself with those questions?you get the answer after you closed your eyes forever.not before.nobody can tell it truely and nobody on this earth can give you the only right and true answer.
*Create your own destiny,fighting against your dark sides,raise your
spirituality.Every day is a new day.A new life.
Keep the faith!*
We feel the existence of GOD in some curtail times in our life. When you near miss an accident, you recover from a fatal illness. When your prayers are heard, When you get want to wish for which may be near impossible. Getting married got nothing to do with Gods existence, but I believe in life after death, you are accountable for your sins on earth..LOL
Archer78 Homosexuality is not a disease or a choice it's something you are born being, and there is nothing wrong with that.
Rayyz. I always thought they went to Limbo or something.
"I fight with love and I laugh with rage, you have to live light enough to see the humor and long enough to see some change." Ani Difranco
Alrite, let me get a little serious here and post the question that I did in the other thread.
What happens to people after their deaths from other religions? What is their fault that they were born into another religion and have been praying someother God. They were just following what were taught to do so eversince their birth? For instance in smaller towns of China, there are millions of people who have idea of existence of any other religion other their own and die even before hearing of Islam or Christianity! This is only an example, there are millions of similar smaller towns or villages that exist in this world. Are those people just plain unlucky or doomed in the afterlife?
What is their fault in it, that Allah or Jesus or Krishna decided to put them on earth in such a remote place and they ended up worshipping someone else?
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Yes God Exists ...It Depends on a beleiver ...Yup he doent care if people R gay R les ...People who R gay r Les the develop this disease by themself its not given by god ...........
A god or multiple gods....all man made....but it helps some to believe in higher powers...whatever floats your boat as long as you are not hurting others.....since Religion (Almost ALL Religions) have been used as a rallying cry for war...they should all be banned! But that's just my opinion.
Stay safe all.
Perfection does not exist. The question therefore, is: what level of imperfection are we willing to settle for?
The big guy who sits on clouds with a long white beard, may or may not have a son named Jebus.
"I fight with love and I laugh with rage, you have to live light enough to see the humor and long enough to see some change." Ani Difranco
To accept he doesn't exist means you have to accept he does exist in order to have something not to believe exists .......................argh.............my head !!!!!!!!!
Which god Are you talking about ? Gautam Buddha ?
"Drink Beer Save Water"
LOL. I also don't think he cares if people are gay!
"I fight with love and I laugh with rage, you have to live light enough to see the humor and long enough to see some change." Ani Difranco
Does God Exist, yes I think so, but there's no proof of it, and I don't think he gives a rats arse if people are married or not, but that's just me. :P
ROFLMAO!
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2100 QL Points!!!
Yay! Way to go Ray!
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