Qataris this...Qataris that!!!
**by dr. Amal Al malki
Whenever an expat writes a piece in which he criticizes “us”, we get angry and suggest to him that if he doesn’t like it here he can leave! His response, usually, is that we need to get educated about constructive criticism and we need to open up to different perspectives, and in short we need to grow up and stop thinking that we are always right.
Criticism can be harsh. I think that criticism should be harsh, and that burying one’s head never changed anything. It is only when some one exposes the problematic status quo, critiques it and provides alternatives that a situation changes. In order to progress, we need to constantly evaluate our present to better our future. Yet, the criticism needs to come from a good place within us—one that hopes for the prosperity of one’s country.
What makes us angry isn’t the criticism in specific but its language! There is a negative rhetoric that is spreading among the expat community, conjuring up an Orientalist one. This kind of rhetoric that uses English as a powerful and worldwide language is used to describe the “Others”- in this case “us”, their mentality, their life style and their beliefs as the total opposite of the “modern western” paradigm that these people subscribe or belong to. When they criticize a situation, they talk about the ignorance of the people involved, and ignorance triggers a chain reaction! How many times have we heard about the lazy, ignorant, super-wealthy Qatari who has no sense of responsibility or commitment! This myth that they have created has been employed in every piece of critique I’ve heard or read, reproducing such stereotypes and multiplying them within different discourses and under different topics. This ‘Orientalist’ approach has become the basis upon which every piece is built, and instead of repeating it, all they need to do is allude to it. Such condescending rhetoric is what gets us mad and not the actual criticism.
How many expats think that the years they have spent in Doha qualify them to become anthropologists who have credibility to comment on the ‘people’? Some of the people I know have “absurd” assumptions that they forward as “accurate observations”, which in fact can make up not so bad fictional work, especially about aliens! Most of those people do not know one single Qatari on a personal level, they haven’t visited a Qatari home, and they didn’t even bother to learn our language! Still, they act like ‘experts’ on Qataris!
If you have noticed, I am also using the same language they use and that is the binary opposition of “us” and “them”. Yet, I won’t assign each reference with any specific attributes. I will never identify myself as Qatari and thus more civilized, international or educated than others. I will never group others under one false homogenous identity like some do to make it easier to criticize all of them in one go. But I won’t keep silent each time someone criticizes Qataris and I will point out the pitfalls in their argument.
There are some expats that really care and truly mean well. For those I hold the upmost respect.
I am a Qatari and I dont agree with a lot of the stuff we do, but I am sure all of you feel the same about your own people.
when you encounter a negative behavior from a Qatari or non-Qatari try not to be influenced by it. meaning dont treat arrogance with anger it does not help...rather do the opposite and thats how you change things around you.
I left QL for over a year and we are still discussing this !!
For me as expat... if any of us doesn't want how Qatar works including their people of course...we are free to leave the country...as simple as that...
Even if we spit those nasty words directly to they face, One thing is for sure, we can't change Qatar and Qataris because it's theirs not ours... :D
"BRING IT ON DUDE!!!"
I totally agree with Punita. It is non Qatari Arabs who create misunderstandings for their own personal benefits. Problem is money attracts lots of greedy people, situation is inevitable.
Are you nuts?......no doubt I am crazy about you!
Excatly punita1, there are lots of young qatari working together with us here at all level in the O & G sector. Infact they are quite friendly, approactable, respectful and mingle quite well with co-worker expatriates from any other countries. Maybe there are only few or even none who have gone overboard in behaviour but that should not be the reason to generalised them as all qataris. As what happens in many other countries, this kind of misbehaviour are part and parcel in plural society.
Just remember one thing, It is not Qatari people's fault that oil and gas was discovered here. Qatari nationals are very nice but a lot of Arabs from other countries move around in national clothing and give Qataris a bad name.. I had an 11 hour meeting with 3 Qataris today to finalise some design, they were incredibly nice. May Allah bless them...
Candlestick......so much hate in your heart......will harm only your ownself.....be positive.......maybe it's not so bad after all. I hope you will find what you are missing in life.......goodwill of christmas
Are you nuts?......no doubt I am crazy about you!
The website is blocked though
StoneCold, that's impossible.
Thats sad, Bleu. People all around the world are reading it and think its a correct episode. Hope someone will find a solution for that.
StoneCold, QatarSucks doesn't deserve any counter reply....
If an expat slips, they'll say that a Qatari pushed him.
pennypitstop said I agree with Tallg ...
the locals are hard to get to know. However, I don't think that is a bad thing.
After all who are they meeting, Indians and people from the Phillipines. I don't want to know them really so why should the Royal Family?
They don't want to know us either.
There are more Indians here than anybody else. What are you doing? You hate the fact UK colonised you but here you are colonising.
Sad.
My thoughts are my own, but I doubt my Mum would agree with some of them.
Suprised that there is hate-qatarliving face book. Maybe they should do a similar one for www.qatarsucks.com as well to counter reply all written abuses.
Sand, your days have come early, ignore the twat.
candlestick - if you really are from the UK, I'm embarrassed to say we come from the same country.
*****If you haven't got anything nice to say, don't say anything at all*****
We rule here??? Why didn't anybody tell me that before :(
By the way we are ruling Qatar and are not even at the manager level, so are the managers here following the words of their juniors or what?
I think you just won the award for the most incoherent post of the day, Congratulations :)
http://skadian-lifeinqatar.blogspot.com/
It is safe...well apart from the lack of law!
Qatar is great for earning money....and this is their problem.
How can any country grow when the Police do nothing about their greatest problem!
They send out directives...but all the time we see, people on mobiles, kids not strapped in etc...this is in front of the Police.
So, anybody looking at this; 'sponsoship' means slavery...driving a joke....the locals drive dangerously but strangely safe...avoid Indians....just avoid Indians...they are the vast majority here, they control the Press, they are nepotitistic, they rule here...the good thing is...they are so thick and uneducated none of them get to manager level.And those that do FAIL.
Qatar is run by Indians....the thickest, racist people on earth....I hate them.
For anybody that judges me....come here and speak to the locals, then the ex pats...we all take the piss outof the wobbly headed thick twATS.
You come across good & bad in every country. Hopefully better sense will prevail.
genesis, since you posted this and i believe your intention, let the changes begin within ourselves
i agree, let us change the way speak, the way we react, the way we respond to any thread.
i am for healthy discussion, informative, life-changing comments.
i am for respect of every views, complaints, or anything that will be posted here at QL.
progress
Rizy ur line is busy
Edited by Mod:Please use the "Religious Teaching Group"
http://www.qatarliving.com/group/religious-teachings
...where all are welcome to further others understanding and have discussions about religion.Thanks!
Genesis,
We are just debating, my friend.
All I am saying is that, there are real reasons why expats complain.
On the other hand, I admit that the language used by the complainers is NOT always fair to the nice people of Qatar.
There are social behavior problems here in Qatar but that does not mean that every single individual is part of that problem.
It would be great to see some official action to educate society. I know something is being done but not enough.
And by the way, PM's initial post, your posts, QLers reactions, our debates, the article in the paper and the facebook site are all great contributors for a better Qatar as they incite debate and exposure to the problem, which for sure will motivate that so needed official action.
Apparently, you don’t read what I write And have always written. Not to mention, have not understood what dr. amal wrote in her post.
Therefore , it’s pointless to argue with you in first place.
Genesis,
Have any Qatari wondered why these expats arrive here in this country and the entire sudden have this need to complain about certain Qataris?!
Maybe there is in fact an issue to be reflected upon!
Nobody complains just for the sake of or just to hurt an entire nation!
Where there is smoke, there might be fire.
Are there any serious social studies on Qatari Society that would explain why all these expats complain so much about Qatar?
I would love to be living here, just like I lived in some other countries in Europe, North America and Far East Asia, and feel the drive to get to know better the local culture, get to understand it, get to admire it and even get to integrate it!
I hate negativism and I hate the fact that there are reasons to complain.
No country deserves this self punishment and Qatar should tackle the root causes of these complains, if they would like to improve the bad image apparently perceived by so many expats.
Every nation,every society has BOTH good AND bad people that constitute the numbers & the same holds true for Qatar...there are MANY good Qataris & there are MANY,erm...not so good ones shall we say?...my question is this,why do the good,educated Qataris not openly accept that there are these bad apples in their midst? It's not unique to them,every nation/society has it's rotten elements,the key difference lies in the fact that to MOST Qataris,another Qatari can do no wrong or rather,they will NEVER admit that to an expat/non-Qatari & this in my humble opinion has to do with the tribal culture that's still very prevalant in this neck of the woods...mind,i'm not criticizing it,the good thing about it is the fierce loyalty one sees practiced much more so than most "developed/first world" nations/societies where the "me,myself & i" culture is prevalant...the downside however is that loyalty often overclouds fair judgement,so it often turns into,"he's my brother,he couldn't have done that"...but the fact is,brother or not,he did do that & you're standing by him despite that because your tribal culture requires that of you,to not do so would be to literally go against your tribe...the truth isn't worth THAT much,at least it isn't to most people...so this isn't an issue that's going to go away overnight...Dr. Malki talks of educated,well travelled,knowledgable Qataris(of which there are plenty,i have & do meet a fair number of them) but what she doesn't mention is the very important fact that this tribal culture prevails over ALL of that education & experience & the few people that do go against it are often ostracized from society although you & me as expats wouldn't see it,that's what happens...so this is something that will take some time to resolve itself so that a healthy balance if at all may be achieved between tribal loyalties & the truth...good luck Qatar...
yea bash Saudi. that will be like an invitation to the Great Hackers Saudi has. and the site will soon be Saudi living .com.
Can't we all just bash the saudis and then we can all join in....
Genesis it's very mindful of you to post this article. However, I don't agree with you. Most of the expat know that Qatar is a nice country otherwise they wouldn't be spending so many most productive years of their lives here. Most of the Qataris are tolerant and nice. However, some Qataris use their nationality as a excuse to exploit others, cheat others, break laws and in general to promote corruption. When these things are exposed, they very conveniently get away using their nationality for cover. My question to good Qataris like genesis is that why doesn't a good Qatari stand on the side of truth and justice rather than protecting an obviously corrupt and cheat Qatari?
'For evil to flourish, good people have to do nothing and evil shall flourish'
- Edmund Burke
Are you nuts?......no doubt I am crazy about you!
Great writing on the blog...
Thank you Mandi... Appreciate it.
http://skadian-lifeinqatar.blogspot.com/
I like your blog, Sandee.
Mandi
Ok I have posted a new blog about my views on the National day controversy, you can read it by clicking the link below..
http://skadian-lifeinqatar.blogspot.com/2009/12/qatars-national-day-aftermath.html
Personally,
I had met good Qatari friends, well educated yet humble. I do have some not so good experiences at the roads among men/s wearing thobes but i may be wrong if i assume them all as locals. But i can still remember the time i got bogged down on the dessert and a local coming swiftly to my rescue. Once i also stalled with a dead battery on a Doha road and so there goes a local again.
In general, i had my good share of fun on my 4 years stay in Qatar which gave me no reason to bash the very dear host who had provided my well being for a meaningful while.
Actually, IMO, it's the visitors who are more arrogant at times.
Cheers!!
If only people can stop thinking of Qatar / Qataris to be as they would like it/them to be else it/they qualify(ies) for ridicule, I think lot of rudeness can be avoided. Need to appreciate that this like any other country has its own identity, culture, strengths, perceived weaknesses which cannot be the same as in the countries we come from and if they want it to be like that, that should not be an issue to us.
And I suppose all of us who log in on QL and participate on forums regularly are atleast well educated and qualified to understand how, what we write, would be perceived... a little care and consideration would avoid lot of ill will. I personally feel very uncomfortable even to read such posts which are filled with hatred, foul language, etc.
Just wish 2010 would bring some sanity and good will among us all and we can live upto the purpose of this site (a fantastic site I should say)...Everything about Living in Qatar... and can live amicably.
_______________________________________
One life to live, live it to the fullest.
I remember there was a thread about all the hate that was going on here and I replied to it, I replied that I haven't noticed any of the hate mentioned and that was probably due to the fact that I barely log on to this site.
But I can say that now I have seen it all and I have read a lot of venomous comments and replies to certain threads from some members that only want to vent or spew venom and negative thoughts and it just seemed to get worse.
Finger pointing back and forth and mostly because someone would come up with a very pessimistic view about a situation that happened some where and what do you know within seconds people would start pecking at each other without addressing the subject at hand not to mention straying off topic only to turn it into a very nasty dissing party.
... whereas the "anti-qatarliving.com" Facebook page is less than edifying.
Mandi
Yes, people need to be more tolerant of others opinions, even if it goes against their grain.
Plus the Mods need to be more vigilant about such threads. I know you guys have jobs, but these threads just spoil the whole environment.
Ok I just want to say one more thing, a bit of request actually...
Can we just take a pledge to be a bit more tolerant to each other's opinion and don't mock them at the first chance we get... I am myself guilty of mocking some faiths and cultures here and will try to improve, I hope we all do..
http://skadian-lifeinqatar.blogspot.com/
Wrt having a blast...yes Qatari girls. But I do know some guys too, and they are good decent folks like us.:)
Sandip I am not hijacker!
A little bit of e-bashing is not detrimental to your health!
Ice Maiden, you are talking about Qatari girls here. Right?
A little bit of e-bashing is not detrimental to your health!
Edifis...I lived here all my life. I grew up here. I've come across some really rude, arrogant Qataris, but at the same time I've come across some really fantastic ones, who've gone out of their way to help me...when i got stuck in the dunes :), or couldn't be bothered to change the flat tyres of my LC. So i don't generalise.
A lot depends on our interaction with them. They are a bit socially reserved, but once you get to know them...well all I can say is beneath that costume they are like the rest of us...& they have a very wicked sense of humour. I don't know many but the few that I know, I have a blast with.
To be honest I always enjoyed some kind of bashing threads, even when I am on the receiving end(Indian bashing is quite common) And I enjoy "Filipino Bashing", "Qatari Bashing", "American Bashing", " West Bashing" etc. To some extent It's fun!
A little bit of e-bashing is not detrimental to your health!
lol edifis don't try to hijack this thread, it is serious... :)
http://skadian-lifeinqatar.blogspot.com/
Genesis & Blue, I enjoyed reading a lot of your threads. So please dont get into that " You kick us, we kick you" mindset.
There will always be a few ....crazy dingbats. Dont let the hatred/ negative get to you. Just filter it out. You guys are better than them.
I think the Admins should put some plan into place whereby the topics first get screened by moderators and then only appear on QL. A lot of rubbish floating around.
blue, I never had much interaction with Qataris, during my stay in Qatar. Whatever I know about Qataris is either hearsay or from websites like QL.
So I have not formed any opinion about Qataris yet!
But I know all the things some expats say about the Qataris....
They will first say....super rich, lazy, spend thrift, uncivilized etc. And when they feel they have said enough they try to make up for it by saying "I know all Qataris are not like that....I know a few excellent Qataris myself......bla bla..." But the tone says it all!
I'm not... :P
to stomach the criticism, especially when some of it is so mean-spirited. I truly regret that what I wrote was viewed in that light. It has obviously enraged a number of Qataris, including people that know me personally. That was not my intention but I do feel responsible for being the match that set afire this huge pile of rubbish that has been waiting to be lit.
At this point, I feel the "clash of civilizations" is inevitable and the desire for peace hopeless. Astagfirullah.
I didn't drink the kool-aid! -- PM
Bleu I used to give your example as one of the few people here who don't get ruffled by some hate filled comments and concentrate on the good inputs so would be really disappointed if you joined that group.
http://skadian-lifeinqatar.blogspot.com/
My intention of this thread was never to provoke more tension among both expatriates or Qataris. I read dr. Amal post and thought i must share it on QL As it summarizes what many local feels.
I don't think in today's electronic world you can suppress a huge percentage of the residents of your country from expressing themselves, they will find a way.
Most expats don't hate Qatar or Qataris. They are very likable people but at the same time they will not agree with everything that happens in Qatar.
Let us just learn to appreciate our differences, sooner the better.
Whats happening on QL may not be good. But it reflects how some expatriates view the Qataris!
This website is the only way to know what people think about each other. Nobody speaks their mind in your face. It's always behind the back or from behind a mask. Funny isn't it?
When people from different cultures come face to face, be it one on one interaction or in a group they mostly exchange pleasantries and say good things about eachother. Strange! Such hypocrisy!
Like religion, there is no end to this kind of thread / discussion. It will end to nothing but hatered.
Suffice to say that - THERE IS NO SUPERIOR CULTURE!!! Any learned person knows that.
If anyone does not understand Qatari culture or any culture for that matter, then just go live somewhere else.
==========================
When in Rome do as the Romans do!!!
For society to prosper, progress people should be allowed to voice opposing views or opinions. Hopefully it should be done in a matured & dignified manner. Realistically it does not happen so.
But I still believe the Voice of dissent should be allowed, even if we do not agree with their ideals.
punita, many Qatari girls would use photos of American actresses or singers.
nadt, it's a new group...
Now that is just taking it to an extreme but I guess it was always on the cards after the Blackberry episode.
http://skadian-lifeinqatar.blogspot.com/
This is very interesting. bleu, I was afraid something like this would start.
wow had no idea theres an anti QL group on FB
Check out the display pic in the owner and moderator's profile of that group.
http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=207571888439&ref=nf#/profile.php?id=4812690
She is definitely upholding Qatari culture...
edifis, no... maybe "not yet"?
blue, are you a member of that group?
Thank you, Genesis, for the introduction to Dr. AlMalki's blog. I'm enjoying it very much.
Mandi
From This facebook group...
This group is to protest against a website called qatarliving.com where many expatriates who live in Qatar post long threads where they criticize the Qatari citizens and culture using very rude and vulgar vocabulary.
Many of the expatriates on this website (not all of them but most of them) use bad language when talking about Qatari people. They have called us names such as pigs, uncivilized, racist barbarians, and many other hideous names. They say that we cannot survive without them and that we cannot handle or manage our country. They also say that they are the ones who built our country fo us and the ones who are teaching us how to behave like humans.
Our aim is to have this website closed for good and teach whoever is attacking our Qatari identity that Qataris should not be underestimated and underrated and we want all of them to see how vicious we are whenever anyone goes beyond their limits while talking about Qatar.
These people have no appreciation of what this country has given them and we will not let them get away with all of this.
Spot on Alexa.. QL is not the same any more..
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"HE WHO DARES WINS"
Derek Edward Trotter
Alexa
It's called integration. But that will never happen here. Here only segregation works.
The problem is that every one has the mentality that I is better than you. Rather than respecting each other, most people end up critising just to make themselves feel better.
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"HE WHO DARES WINS"
Derek Edward Trotter
Well said Doctor.
"From Mideast to Midwest"
I am so glad that Mrs UKEng never got fond of the addictive site..:) lol
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"HE WHO DARES WINS"
Derek Edward Trotter
PM was just saying what she saw and wrote it. It is a pity that it turned into a full blown up retalition against her and other expats who just wanted to point out what they had experienced.
Anyway Expats are just guest workers here, work hard and enjoy your stay..
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"HE WHO DARES WINS"
Derek Edward Trotter
Your right Alexa.. QL now can make or break your day..
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"HE WHO DARES WINS"
Derek Edward Trotter
Once someone starts saying to expats that "you are taking our money" is what starts the problem for me. I am an expatriate, I am not taking anybody's money except my own, which I am earning through my work.
Still as has been mentioned a million times on this website alone, let's not generalise any nationality on the basis of your experiences with a handful of individuals. I don't know too many Qataris personally but from what I have heard from expats who have been here for a long time, they are basically very nice people.
She does write a lot of sensible things in that blog of her's though.
http://skadian-lifeinqatar.blogspot.com/
C'mon guys/gals...enough of this bashing threads. Its supposed to be Qatar LIVING, not the WWF or whatever they call it now.
There are so many interesting aspects to life in Qatar, lets talk about that. Tired of reading mode, give me a thread I can comment on. So I can add to my points, you know. *Grinning*
I follow her blog, this post would most probably be about QL...
This is a post by dr.amal Al malki that is featured in
Her blog;
http://amalalmalki.com/
Here we go again.. Round three..:@)
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"HE WHO DARES WINS"
Derek Edward Trotter
Sometimes what you see in the posts may mean good but the sarcasm hidden behind is not too easy to find. Thats the reason why you find people going after each other.
Some have made it an art of making their statements dripping with sarcasm and hiding behind saying that they have been misunderstood.
What you have posted is relevant, but it just does not end there. The same is the case with religion.
genesis...is it like a "copy paste" statement by Amal Malki from some website or paper...or is it you?
----------------------------------------------------------Whenever I find the KEY to SUCCESS...Someone STEALS it.