The Veil in Christianity.....
The Veil in ChristianityIntroductionA common misconception is that Muslim women are the only ones who cover their hair. It may be true that Islam is the only religion in which most women follow its directives to cover the hair, but it is not the only religion to have such directives.It is particularly interesting to look at the case of Christianity, since Christianity is the predominant religion in the West, and it is Westerners, including observant Christians, who are often the first to criticize Islam because of the hijab (modest dress, including headcovering).Is Covering the Hair a Religious Commandment for Christian Women?There can be only one answer to this: yes, it is! Simply open the Bible to the First Epistle to the Corinthians, chapter 11. Read verses 3-10.But I would have you know that the head of every man is Christ and the head of the woman is the man, and the head of Christ is God. Every man praying or prophesying with his head covered, disgraces his head. But every woman praying or prophesying with her head uncovered disgraces her head, for it is the same as if she were shaven. For if a woman is not covered, let her be shaven. But if it is a disgrace for a woman to have her hair cut off or her head shaved, let her cover her head. A man indeed ought not to cover his head, because he is the image and glory of God. But woman is the glory of man. For man was not created for woman, but woman for man. This is why the woman ought to have a sign of authority over her head, because of the angels.The meaning of this passage is plain enough. We can make the following syllogisms:Syllogism 1Praying with an uncovered head is a disgraceHaving a shaved head is the same as praying with an uncovered headTherefore, having a shaved head is a disgraceSyllogism 2If it is a disgrace for a woman to have a shaved head, she should cover her headIt is a disgrace for a woman to have a shaved head - see syllogism 1Therefore, a woman should cover her headIn other words, the passage means what it says. Have you ever wondered why Catholic nuns dress like they're wearing hijab (Muslim hijabi women, have you ever been mistaken for a nun? I have, more than once). Have you ever wondered why Mary the mother of Jesus (peace be upon them both) is always depicted in Christian art with her hair covered? Did you know that until the 1960s, it was obligatory for Catholic women to cover their heads in church (then they "modernized" the service)?There are some interesting points that can be made about the Christian directive.1) The explicit purpose of the Christian woman's headcovering, as stated by Paul, is that it is a sign of man's authority over woman. The explicit purpose of Islamic hijab is modesty. Strange how so many Westerners think that the purpose of hijab is a symbol of male authority. Maybe they know that that's what it is in their own religion (Christianity) so they assume that Islam must be the same...!2) The Christian woman is to cover her head whenever she is praying, whether it be at the church service or just personal prayer at home. This may mean that if she is not praying at home, she is uncovered around male guests who are not related to her; or if she is praying at home, that she is covered around her own husband and family. If any more proof were needed than Paul's own words that the Christian headcovering is not about modesty, this must certainly be it!This puts hijab in a whole new perspective, doesn't it! To my non-hijabi Muslim sister who feels that hijab is a sign of oppression for the Muslim female, please do read the above and then read the Quran. Believe me, if Allah SWT meant for hijab to be a sign of male authority, the Quran would be as unambiguous about it as Paul is in the Bible. Isn't this difference the kind of thing that attracted you to Islam in the first place?Do Any Christian Women Today Cover Their Heads?It is true that most Christian women do not, and many don't take other teachings of the Bible (against pre-marital sex, adultery, etc) literally either. However, there do seem to be a growing number of Christian women out there who are committed to following the Bible as it is written. Below are some webpages that I found that call for Christian women to cover their heads in accordance with the commandment of the Bible.
Our Prophet said the closest to us are the Christians!
And that is very true! As he meant closest to the true followers of what he was upon than any other non muslim.
Maryum : Umm Hasan bint Abdullah Alshabrawishi
"Our Prophet said the closest to us are the Christians!
And that is very true! As he meant the true followers of what he was upon!"
I've heard this before and I believe the same now if we can just convince everyone else - I think a lot of problems could be solved.
after reading of Noah. Abraham at the age of 85 deperately wanted a child. Check it out.
This is true in Christianity as well. We are taught that relying on ourselves is what leads to trouble. I also agree that there is a lot of goodness in the world.
I know what you mean about people being grateful for what they have. That is not prevalent in our world. We always seem to want more. In fact that is one of my struggles - I call it one of my signature sins.
Anyway - its late and I need to get to bed. Thanks for the discussion - I enjoyed it and its proof that discussion on religion can take place without two people resulting to insults.
For the record PH - I don't disrespect your opinion - I'm just trying to understand it. You make some good points about our human nature to follow the way of the world instead of the way of God and that is something everyone struggles with. Which is what makes us human. And I believe that it is our humanity that has led to the current problems in the world and these problems have been compounding since the creation of man. It is because we are human and incapable of living perfect sin, free lives. Of course there are some of us on this planet who are worse than others and you just have to read the newspaper or watch the news to see how truly evil some people can be.
Further to your last post,
I'd like to tell you a story if I may!
A scholar of Islam used to teach his class Tawheed (which is the subject title we use to teach people to only worship Allah and call upon him for help as well as believe in his existance and characteristics.) And one day he told them of an evil story where a man slept with his own mother. The class was horrified and gasped at the story. One student asked, "how could a person do such a thing. It must be the most evil action on earth."
The scholar would teach Tawheed every week to the class including a story about a Man who rejected the existance of God! And one day the students asked the teacher why he does not teach them other things. As all the members of the class believed in the Oneness of God, his characteristics, existance and Aid.
And the teacher said.. do you remember when I told you of the man who rejected Gods existance? No body in the class reacted to such a despicable thing. However when I told you about the Man who slept with his mother you all shouted it out with horror! It is because of this that I teach you Tawheed every week. Because you do not realize that, according to our religion, it is the most despicable, disgusting and arrogant sin on earth. When you realize this fact and feel it deep in your heart then we shall move on to other important subjects!
(Note: In islam we believe that Noah was a prophet and the only thing he directed his people was towards the worship of God. He did this for 950 years of his life).
Tweety I think the world is an extremely evil place. However, I also feel that their is a tremendous amount of good and kindess in the world too! And it is this that makes it such a blessing. Even a poor child from Africa who has sufficient (but simple) food will feel happy. Until he realizes that their is more in the world and starts to desire those things and reach for them! Much like children we as people have little control over our desires until someone teaches us how to effectively use that control and be happy and grateful for what we have been given.
Maryum : Umm Hasan bint Abdullah Alshabrawishi
Islam is very close in sentiment to Christianity and not just in the fact that we both believe in the same one and true God. And your comment about free choice is what I call free will. I think it is the greatest gift God has given us but it is also the one that gets us in the most trouble!!!
For the record PH - I don't disrespect your opinion - I'm just trying to understand it. You make some good points about our human nature to follow the way of the world instead of the way of God and that is something everyone struggles with. Which is what makes us human. And I believe that it is our humanity that has led to the current problems in the world and these problems have been compounding since the creation of man. It is because we are human and incapable of living perfect sin, free lives. Of course there are some of us on this planet who are worse than others and you just have to read the newspaper or watch the news to see how truly evil some people can be.
Tweety,
I would like to refer you back to my post above. Please read my statement in response to the previous posts. One statement which you said:
I'm not sure what point you are trying to make about the west being proof that mankind does not have the wisdom to make up their own laws. That, in my opinion is a pretty broad generalization considering there is much about the west that works and works quite well. Honestly PH, do you believe that mankind is doing that much better in other parts of the world
The point I am trying to make is that the west doesn't work nearly as well as people seem to think. We have a multitude of problems just like in every culture and country on earth just as you have stated. As I stated:
What our progress does is misdirect us to yet another problem that needs solving without curing the first problem.
however, I would like to suggest that despite the evil that lay outside the walls of our homes Islam has protected women from it by laying a foundation of laws in which to follow. And education and action starts within ourselves, the home, our neighbors and the rest of society. Its the butterfly affect that happens from our good actions like antibodies gaining strength and numbers to fight off disease. Although we will never be free from it on earth!
Tweety.. you somehow think I am against the west! I am not!
I think the west has done far more then muslims have in centuries. Especially in terms of giving womens their rights (although they have been taken away from all of mankind in other ways). And I am equally as passionate towards members of the muslim world who have introduced alien ideas into our religion (which I personally deem perfect and they, the muslims, attest to this fact).
My point being that Islam has given us common sense options to combat these problems on earth whilst giving us our full rights and deepest desire of justice and peace for all. Whilst doing it all so we can establish worship of God on earth and make mistakes along the way (free choice). (And this was in reference to Diamond Girls post)
That statistic came from a World bank report some time ago where they have written extensively of the woes of our current monetary system. Unfortunately my pc has a virus and I am unable to find and copy the statement. (it was also more of an analogy then bonafide statistic as it came from a memory of about 2 years ago. ).
Last of all Tweety, you need to govern yourself and your country to what you think is best! I am only stating my own personal beliefs and giving naseeha to the muslims who do not understand the common sense behind our great and fantastic religion. For me I currently believe that the perfect faith and system of Laws is Islam because it was written by God. However, I am not certain of this and could change my opinion in the future. Which is why you will not see on any of my posts that I demand another person to follow Islam. Although I do clarify a person if I feel they, who claim Islam as their faith, go against Islam in their sayings on this website. And even then I am very mild and careful considering some of the sayings on here. (although a non muslim would not understand this or a person who lacks knowledge of Islam and insight).
Many westerners have written extensively on the excellence of our faith when followed correctly. I do feel that it is upon every sincere person, who loves good, to search for that system of beliefs which is righteous or the nearest to righteousness! None of us may get it right, perhaps only a few, and perhaps we are all right but if, with pure sincerety in our hearts , we seek the truth then nobody can fault our intentions!
Maryum : Umm Hasan bint Abdullah Alshabrawishi
PH...
From where are you quoting the statistic below?
"did you know for every person who takes a mortgage 10 people must become homeless as this is the nature of an inferior monetary system?"
Also - you keep referring to the West and said the following: "For instance, statistics aside how many of us westerners know a friend who has been raped or molested. how many of us ourselves have judged other people based on their outward appearance and actions (that did not truly reflect their intentions or person inside)? Or did not befriend a person because others did not like her/him and you did not like to be the oddball out? "
Do you think these things were invented in the West and are unique to the West because I see those things here in the ME as well and not just amongst people from the West. In short evil exists everywhere amongst all races and religions but to say one sector of society has a monopoly on it is pretty short sighted.
You also said the problem is with democracy because it is governed by Human intellect. What about dictatorships, a monarchy, or any other form of government. Should we just toss out this type of governing of the people and let religions fill the void that will be left? Which religion should rule? I'm sure I know your answer to that but what about the different sects or groups within a religion whether it be Protestant or Catholic or Sunni or Shia - which one is right, which is wrong, which should be the one to rule?
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tweety
The problem with the world and democracy is that it is governed by human intellect that places ourselves above God as our guide. It will never be perfect because of our deficient intellect. Which is why we need God to tell us do's and dont's because he has no deficiencies.
We are just making the same mistakes over and over again in the world. The only thing that is improving is technology. What our progress does is misdirect us to yet another problem that needs solving without curing the first problem. (an example would be child custody where men have little chance to see their children and women are not able to do it all on their own! Islam cures this problem by demanding men to take care of their kids whilst giving the right of custody to the mother in early years and then further gives the right of the child to decide once they reach a good age! All the while protecting the children from harm of the parents. And protecting the parents from the loss of their child and divorce is never easy).
if we look at your ideas of the west we can see that the system is not working nor is it actually making life better. For instance, statistics aside how many of us westerners know a friend who has been raped or molested. how many of us ourselves have judged other people based on their outward appearance and actions (that did not truly reflect their intentions or person inside)? Or did not befriend a person because others did not like her/him and you did not like to be the oddball out? How difficult is it to find a successful husband these days without having some refined social skills or being a size 8? (At least it was in California last time I checked). Why is it that America has so many homeless people? What is the real affect of alcohol on our society? Interest, did you know for every person who takes a mortgage 10 people must become homeless as this is the nature of an inferior monetary system? From the judicial laws to how people clean themselves without water Islam has given us the best advice for all times.
the fact is that both men and women need protection from ourselves. We our own worst enemy, selfish and harmful to anyone who stands in front of our desires without realizing it. Or distrustful of anyone who does not fit into our illusion of what we call reality. I do it, you do and so does everyone else.
Islam protects the rights of both men and women based on human nature. A nature that the west has yet to recognize or admit is part of us. This is why the quran says that they are deaf, dumb and blind because we only harm ourselves and do not realize our own deficiencies.
And that includes the muslim who becomes deaf dumb and blind as well on certain issues!
It is very typical to look at one part of Islam and say it is oppressive. When in fact it is liberating us from our selves. Islam has condoned a women working and made means for her to do so as well as protect her (with no one having an excuse should they harm her) from unwarranted attention that could cause her or others(including those who judge her based on appearance.. designer clothing) to become distracted from the true purpose in life: Which is to make all worship for Allah and act upon that! Islam makes the life as easy as it can possibly can become. It is not meant to get rid of the all the trials in life but that is part of the test we have chosen according to the Quran.
However, Islam can improve our condition to the best it will ever be in this world. It will protect as well as ensure that the rights of all mankind are given (to best degree this can be accomplished). And men also have restrictions different but equal to that of the women!
Maryum : Umm Hasan bint Abdullah Alshabrawishi
Are you serious Eco??? so basically if you see a woman out without a keeper you have a right to rape her???
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"We do not have the wisdom to make up our own laws. The west and thousand of years of philosophy are evidence of this. "
I'm not sure what point you are trying to make about the west being proof that mankind does not have the wisdom to make up their own laws. That, in my opinion is a pretty broad generalization considering there is much about the west that works and works quite well. Honestly PH, do you believe that mankind is doing that much better in other parts of the world - whether Christianity, Islam or atheism is prevalent?
Also I agree with DG about the oppression of woman. Women do not ask for rape or any type of abuse whether it be physical, verbal or emotional. Taking away a women's rights in the name of protection makes no sense to me. And the way it is constantly presented it sounds like the problem lays with the men who have not been taught to respect women so why is the woman the one who has to make the sacrifice? Sorry guys - I mean no offense but this is just how this whole things shakes out for me with respect to women covering themselves, not allowed to interact with non-familial men, etc.
Jauntie my opinion is that all humans are delusional to some extent! Our desires make it that way and blind us from reality whether we like to admit this or not!
What is the yardstick to measure common sense in the people?
How do we as people achieve the ten commandments if that is yours? Are we so arrogant that we believe that we have enough wisdom to achieve those goals without guidance.
I as a muslim believe that guidance is in Islam. You as a christian believe that guidance to be in Christianity. Or an atheist believes in the guidance of laws and what they can measure and see. Who is right and who is wrong? Obviously only one of us can be right! And we can only try our best!
Maryum : Umm Hasan bint Abdullah Alshabrawishi
and I doubt very much if DG or Alexa are either.
Oh and there are other religious laws other than Islamic ones and generally speaking I believe that most (most) man made laws have generally followed the basics of the 10 Commandments (even if some religions didn't even know they existed!) as social guidelines, and did so prior to Islam.
Anyway, on that happy note I'm off to bed without a care in the world :D
Nite all
x
obviously not Diamond girl! the evidence suggests that if men and ladies have wisdom they are also easily deterred from using it. I believe misdirection is the word....
We do not have the wisdom to make up our own laws. The west and thousand of years of philosophy are evidence of this. How many people feel they could make the system better in each and every country if only they were president or ruler?
However if one analyses Islam one would be hard pressed to find a better and easier to understand option. May I add more common sense option as well!
People make life complicated! Not the other way around DG.
Maryum : Umm Hasan bint Abdullah Alshabrawishi
will finally result in rape. That was my point
Common sense and a sense of self-respect is what is needed to be in society and function well. Most people are able to work that out without having to refer to a set of dos and don'ts.
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diamond girl .. I have never disagreed with what you have said!
yes it is fine..she can meet them in a public place (using every means neccesary to avoid meeting them alone with no intense personal conversations) and also in her office which is full of windows. However she should not be alone with men or mix with them in non public places without having a mahram with her. And this is for a variety of reasons! And what we see these days is that many men and women are mixing and flirting which causes big fitnahs in society. (not everyone is as devoted to their husbands or serious in business as yourself and even then there is temptation due to loneliness in the jet set world.) So it is upon the muslim to avoid this fitnah whenever possible! And create other avenues to achieve their endeavors! It is not that we don't trust you .. it is that we don't trust Shaytaan!
People oppress themselves by not following the religion. They create obstacles that have no need to exist in the first place. This religion leads the way to success to the hereafter and life as well as deals with many conditions and circumstances. However, it is never meant to make the world a perfect place to live as injustice will remain as long as humans are hungry for bloodshed and evil.
Which is why the angels asked Allah .. why have you created man who will only shed each others blood and Allah said that he has wisdom that you (the angels) do not!
The laws of Islam are the better than any other man made laws on earth although it is difficult for our delusional minds to comprehend!
Maryum : Umm Hasan bint Abdullah Alshabrawishi
It is absolutely fine for a woman to work and in a normal working environment and be out and about in society. I am so sick and fed up of the oppression of women in the name of Islam.
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Actually Eco is right! A women can only intermingle with her father, uncles, brothers and grandfathers and men her mother has breast fed 5 times before the age of 2! All other men are not allowed to even be alone with the women in the same house/room let alone outside without her mahram (protector).
However, Eco I don't think that rape or molestation is stopped by the veil.
Maryum : Umm Hasan bint Abdullah Alshabrawishi
Eco Savvy you are allowed to speak to male relatives, those are the only men a Muslim women CAN talk to.
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Qatari youth charged with murder of a female relative(intermingling with cousins, bro-in-laws is strictly forbidden)
Quote GT
The main accused, according to the public prosecution,
“lured the victim in her mid 30s to a remote area where he tried to
rape her”.
How can a wise, sensible, God fearing person be lured? How can she go with the accused when you are not allowed to mix with male relatives
Eco savvy - are you saying that "believers" are not subject to rape because they are protected by a higher power or are you saying that non-believers are raped because they are not under the protection of a higher power and thus are being punished or are you saying that a rapist can look at a woman and know immediately that she is a believer therefore he will move on to someone else to abuse? What exactly does being a believer have to do with being the victim of rape or not being the victim of rape?
Nicely done... hmm... was about to say too, that I didn't think a rapist would ask "are you a real muslim believer?" or "just someone wearing abaya for your own reasons".....
"if you don't like the heat... get out of the kitchen... but stop trying to fan the flames before you leave... it will burn you on the a** as you go through the doorway...." ME
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Dear all respectables
1) All arguments , which discussed above. rapes, harrasement and etc. In my point of view, in current global era, it just depends on personalaties and one's character, and how and in which environment ones got brought up.
2) We should respect laws of each other religions, every group has choice to adopt their religion laws. If one country approves for women if they want , come in public without upper clothes, we should respect.
and if muslim's religion not permits to shake hand with other women, we should repects also.
we feel proud and respect , when nuns are in hijab dress, and same time women are in naked dresses in markeet and feels proud as feelings of modernasation. It seems contradiction, but we should repects also one's desire. and on other hand we are not as practical as our religions wants . If one's like to wear hijab, let them enjoy their choice and similarly someone not want, let them also enjoy their choice.
As I said Eco Savvy, read the papers, there are cases of rape in Qatar all the time. I don't think they ask these Qatari girls how much of a believer they are.
Here's a couple of examples from Gulf Times:
http://www.gulf-times.com/site/topics/article.asp?cu_no=2&item_no=193224&version=1&template_id=36&parent_id=16
http://www.gulf-times.com/site/topics/article.asp?cu_no=2&item_no=193313&version=1&template_id=37&parent_id=17
http://www.gulf-times.com/site/topics/article.asp?cu_no=2&item_no=190696&version=1&template_id=37&parent_id=17
http://www.gulf-times.com/site/topics/article.asp?cu_no=2&item_no=186861&version=1&template_id=36&parent_id=16
and finally, just a little quote "Al-Ghanem said that 63% of those surveyed were found to be victims of beating, while 52 cases of “strong violence” like rape and about 120 cases of sexual harassment were recorded.
“During the course of study, I discovered that women’s cultural values are affected because they accept the violence and did not speak about it in public; they kept it to themselves,” she said.
According to her findings, some 50 women have tried to commit suicide due to this “culture of silence” among the victims."
But I'm sure Eco Savvy you will just say that none of them are believers.
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I'd like to know her opinion about this...
I'm just an audience here, folks...READ MODE only.
Life isn't about how to survive the storm, but how to dance in the rain!- UNKNOWN
I think covering the hair has alot more implications then fending off rape and abuse. Nor do I think covering oneself could be the entire answer to rooting out the problem completely!
To cover means protect in Arabic! And certainly a women should be protected with a cover (which could be the law, clothing, men in her family, herself, society). However, following one aspect of the religion does not mean it will cure all of the diseases within societies.
Maryum : Umm Hasan bint Abdullah Alshabrawishi
is new, SMU?
Life isn't about how to survive the storm, but how to dance in the rain!- UNKNOWN
Hmm strange everything is going round and round
has been one of the religious traditions I grew up with.
Till college days back in my homecity, we wore them...even when we sing in the choir. But as the years went by, it's been forgotten...too bad
Life isn't about how to survive the storm, but how to dance in the rain!- UNKNOWN
or give me one link. Again I am talking about believers, not those ppl who wear abayas bcos they are forced to wear. I did hear these stories that ppl change
remove their abaya in flight and thats true cos on my way to heathrow I saw these 3 beautiful arabic gals change thier clothing. Believe they were shying away from me thinkin I am arab bcos they never expected me to land with abaya. You have to understand me when I say believer (these ppl are totally different, they are not chameleons) And my God will never never humiliate them, they supplicate all the time.
I was seated beside Al Jazeera news reporter, he too advised me to be safe in UK cos muslims are targeted. Believe me I got all the respect and never did any body question me or searched me, I was so impressed with their hospitality.
We have to understand there are angels to guard you.
We are 5 sisters, I have dozens of cousins, nieces and I come from very notorious state. My class mates were harassed, my neighbors were harassed I have spent more than 7 years fighting for these helpless women.
Eco Savvy you should read the papers, women in Saudi and here in Qatar are raped all the time, Local Women! who were abayas. The papers report the convictions.
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What doesn't kill you make ya stronger!
Maryum : Umm Hasan bint Abdullah Alshabrawishi
Its ok ALexa. I kow exactly what you mean. Just remember, that you dont have to prove yourself to anybody, especially people that are just looking to argue for any reason or people who are so unhappy with their lives that they make it their mission to make others miserably.
Some arent open for discussions, they just want to pick a fight...
Exactly Xena, sick minds...
It doesn't matter what a woman wears, if her head is covered, if she is a believer, if she is conventionally beautiful, provactive or anything else that people use as an argument that "she asked for it".
It goes on criminal mind and intent as too who the rapist's victim will be.... not cause she looks sexy...
What about men that rape women because they look like their mothers, and they have psycological issues, cause she was a dominating person so they rape someone that resembles her to get their own back.... where does clothing come into that?
"if you don't like the heat... get out of the kitchen... but stop trying to fan the flames before you leave... it will burn you on the a** as you go through the doorway...." ME
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lol Alexa
Not to mention that "some muslim men rape their wives...Again it has nothing to do with religion, more to do with the mind of some sick men who think they have power over women..
Rape has nothing to do with what women wear, its has to do with sick men. Ive heard of men raping old frail women and women with disabilties who were powerless do anything about it...
And Xena is right its not only hard to prove it but most women wouldnt advertise it for personal and cultural reasons.
I think the point truth is making in this article is that Chritian women used to wear the hijab as well, as some nuns still do..
Sdkak to say in the olden days QUOTE "
Remember... olden days also had a lot of of tribals fighting and kidnapping women & raping them and making them slaves. Again the reason for the coverup..
Times have changed and so should the dress. I might be wrong but thatz how i see the covering of females in olden days.
But why now ?????????????????
Are you saying that rape doesnt occur these days??? Hmm maybe Im on a another planet...
But when you ask why now, its because as muslims we follow what god has ordained on us in the Quran which requires head covering. Whether women in Islam or Christianity do it it is their choice, no one is forcing anyone to wear it but for some women that do wear it, rest assured they are not oppressed, they do it by choice.
I dont see what the big deal is anyway, everyone has a right to choose what they want to wear for what ever reason. We dont all have to think the same.
Alexa, i always thought that the nuns who do wear headcovering is because they are devoted to god but im not an exepert on Christianity...
embarressing for the person to admit it, as they will be harassed by the police as in some Muslim countries, if you report you were raped, you get into more trouble than the rapist does.... besides having to pull 4 witnesses out of no where to prove your innocence...
If there are 4 people standing by and watching a woman being raped, I would hold them just as repsonsible as the rapist... wouldn't you?
for some reasons, dont misunderstand me
I am discussing believer here. NEVER DID I HEAR ANY BELIEVER is raped
raped anywhere (dont go to war zones )
May be I have missed some news bcos I dont remember any muslim wearing abaya is raped.
Scarlett keeling case is fresh in mind, I just cant get over it and I am following her report everyday
First a rape is NOT an accident.
Second, if a woman is wearing long or 3/4 length trousers and a short sleeve top does not mean she is not covering herself up and does NOTgive a man the right to commit such crimes.
lynd1lou it is a concept not just to compare between old and new times.
If the history had many of the accidents then what about nowadays?
I don't think that nudism and exposing women in such ways in the media and fashion has no effect in the increase of rapes and harrassments.
This had led to more weird incidents that we used to hear about, more frequently.
Wear improper clothes is a good reason to attract those sick ppl to commit raping.
I am not saying that covering up will totally stop these types of accidents.
But it does helps alot. I think this is natural that seeing a woman with so light or open clothes will affect some men, more than when seeing a woman with decent clothes.
I think you didn't get my point in the third para. I am just saying that the climate was not the reason to ask women to cover up. Otherwise what about in spring times where weather is moderate and nice.?
Again youdid not get what i mean regarding respect. Dressing up well, is not all about respecting a woman. I dont say that i ask women to cover up coz i respect her.
I am talking about the principle of why the religion asked for it.
It just helps to keep women away from sick ppls eyes
Yes you are a little confused. "The old times" you mention where you said there was not as many cases of female sexual harrassments and rapes. Read your history, and dont forget in the "old times" we did not have the media coverage we have now.
Lamea the Nun wears an Habit, NOT a scarf.
Decent mind: u are confusing a lot of things here.
the reply to your above second paragraph is PLZ DUDE.. PLZ control ur libido and there will be no rape. If men like u & me cant control it, ther wont be any need for women to wear a tent.
Your third paragraph is ill informed. Middle east heat conditions dont allow u to go around naked. U will be roasted and u wont even need a micro and/or a grill for that. ur body needs to be protected from winter and summer climates. u also need to cover ur body for protection against dust storms etc etc etc.... U stiil think one can go around naked in ME... do this experiment yourself and then tell me the experience.
Your Fourth paragraph is self explanatory.. u give respect to women and that even stops them being raped and harassed. & where does respect says.. u are gonna respect me because I am dressed from tip to toe ?????
Your last para... has the reply in my reply to for your 2nd para...
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[olden days also had a lot of of tribals fighting and kidnapping women & raping them and making them slaves. Again the reason for the coverup.. ]
skdkak if you can notice the amount of cases of female sexual harrassments and rapes nowadays compared to old times then you will know that it is ever more required nowadays to wear coverable clothes and avoid open or sexy styles.
It is not the weather conditions which enforced women to cover up. Otherwise all women in the gulf region or middle east would have been ordered to remove all their clothes :)
The concept in religions is to have the woman been respected and treated as a precious creature.
Being covered does not mean to wear a full tent from head to toe. Any thing that keeps her body covered (and hair) and not looking in an erotic way then it is acceptable, regardless of the colors or clothes style etc.
nuns (christanity), means the origin of was in cold climate - so the cover to save urself from cold and harsh climate.
similarly Islam started from Middle east.. hence again the cover ur entire body to safe guard against cold / heat and dust.
Remember... olden days also had a lot of of tribals fighting and kidnapping women & raping them and making them slaves. Again the reason for the coverup..
Times have changed and so should the dress. I might be wrong but thatz how i see the covering of females in olden days.
But why now ?????????????????
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Alexa you crack me up!
Being a muslim is also a profession!
Maryum : Umm Hasan bint Abdullah Alshabrawishi
The nuns in my school never covered their heads?
_[]~SMoKE~[]_
yes i did always wonder why the west made such a huge issue of hijab when all their nuns are fully clad with their head covered. i wonder if they will abolish the nuns scarf too!!!????
my grandparent raised me w/ a nun disciplinary styles (dress from neck to down covering my feet/ long sleeves)...
I was teenager i was active in the church and i started to wear veil...white veil when i was medidating the holy rosary, angelus, & other related holy avtivities... Straight 5 years , i always use loose dresses and i never use pants and shirts and a white veil on my head...
I reached my Junior & senior times and i joined the training for military (my dream to be an army) so i started to use pants, and shirts, i did not attend my holy activities already because the community knew that i am in military training........because of hectic trainings, i also forgot to pray .....means i forgot to use my white veil,,,,,,,
After my college, i want to go back on my holy community(church) but how? people are pushing me away.... I attended masses & prayers in other churhces (ofcourse i need to wear my veil)..but on that churches, people who are not wearing veil are all staring on the people who wears veil...the ratio was 10% w/ veil and 90% w/ out veil.....after weeks, i observed the same person who wears veil before was there but not anymore wearing veil....
i don't know if you understand what i am trying to point out....some people in the chucrh believe in modernization (maybe).
and there are many sects in christianity who doesn't believe on some verses in the bible. All sects they teach the bible using their own understanding specially if they are very good in reasonings & speech thats why politics come on the picture of every sects.
If you're looking for a problem, you're probably gonna find one.
part two have been posted and discussed already
http://www.qatarliving.com/node/78249
- live your life as simple as you are
- money doesn't create man, but it is the man who created money
- don't do what others say, just listen to them, but do what you feel good