Saudis give nod to Israeli raid on Iran !

tsk... tsk... tsk...................................

http://www.gulfnews.com/news/gulf/gcc/10329196.html

Saudi Arabia and Kuwait have made swift and clear denials over press reports that Israeli warplanes would be allowed to fly in their airspace during an attack on Iran.

An informed Saudi official branded the reports "stupid", and a "pathetic way (from Israel) to gain some recognition from some Arab countries or Muslim countries" through giving the impression that it has communications with the Kingdom.

However, these Arab and Muslim countries "didn't buy it", the official said.

"Of course, Saudi Arabia would never open its air space and land to a friendly country to launch an illegal attack on another country, let alone to open its space for a country that doesn't have any relationship with Saudi Arabia," the official explained to Gulf News.

i think in this case alot of problems will be occur and world may go to the last step of the 3rd world war. else this whts will b result, only Allah (God) kows better.

LOL. Well from what I've been lead to understand there hasn't been much interference by other governments in the Iran case, unless you count media support for the opposition. Which I see no problem with.

So, the old sovereignty and non-interference in internal affairs only applies when it affects us ??????????

Hmmm personally I say keep interfering and speed up the process of disintegration.

Its a good idea, as long as 'external powers" stop interfering...

Wouldn't it be easier and more effective to sit back and wait for Iran to tear itself apart?

Like you , I have lost faith in the U.N.. The power to veto is the single biggest obstacle to the proper functioning of the organization. The other thing is horse trading and manipulation by the permanent members and their "allies'.

The U.N , as we've seen does have the power to invoke sanctions when it deems fit. This mechanism could be used to bring Israel into line. However, I can't see it happening in my lifetime..

...

...

I refuse to drink the kool-aid! -- PM

but there is very little success of it ever working. Even in the Gulf war, many people say it was the US pushing their agenda and not many recognize it as a UN effort.

I think the American vetoes that Israel has floated on are shameful. But I also don't think anything would be different even if the US had not vetoed.

Sorry, but I am just not a big believer in the UN as it now stands.

I refuse to drink the kool-aid! -- PM

Multi-national military forces can be formed as happened in the Gulf war.. Sanctions can also be imposed.. but every time Israel gets away..

to enforce SC resolutions. Even if a resolution WAS passed, there is no practical mechanism to enforce it on a sovereign nation. Just look at the UN troops in Rwanda and Bosnia to see what I mean.

I refuse to drink the kool-aid! -- PM

The resolutions of the UN General Assembly aren't enforceable even if they were unanimous.. but those of the UNSC ARE enforceable but they always get aborted by the veto..

and totally revamped. I think they should have the right to make binding and enforceable resolutions. But I don't see any sovereign nations agreeing to that; least of all the US and the other permanent members of the UNSC.

Frankly, it is a post-war white elephant.

I refuse to drink the kool-aid! -- PM

Their resolutions aren't really enforceable anyway. What good any SC resolutions have done anywhere anyway? That is my point.

And no, the notion of 5 permanent members does not seem reasonable.

I refuse to drink the kool-aid! -- PM

The Security Council IS the teeth of the UN but crippled with the biased veto.. Does it seem acceptable in the third millenium that five countries nominated in the 1950s or so decide for the whole world what to accept and what to reject?

And unfortunately nobody in power seems to want it to have any real powers. So democratizing the UNSC doesn't make any difference since they can't enforce anything. It would just be a meaningless gesture, although one that might get some good political mileage.

I refuse to drink the kool-aid! -- PM

With some pilitical reform to the UN the nuclear weapons can be eliminated and destroyed for good.. But as long as the UN is too weak and corrupt it will not be respected by Iran and personally I hail Iran for this dignified stance..

Now the US got out of their way to democratize the ME.. Well, good deeds begin at home..How about democratizing the Security Council?

Not in my back yard.

In all fairness, I don't think the issue is about nuclear power. But even in terms of nuclear weapons, I have argued many times that you can't curtail others from having them when you have them. There is not even a pretense of having a moral high ground. I'm for eliminating all nukes -- but don't expect that to happen. So in that case, Iran has as much right as anybody else (although I definitely don't want to see more nukes).

I refuse to drink the kool-aid! -- PM

[quote The Dude]: "It is funny how some CAN and some CAN NOT have nuclear power. Who gets to decide?"

Who else? the ppl in the back yard!

When air strikes are used that means it will be a destructive large-scale war.. Imagine how many times the "smart" missiles will go nuts! :P

As you say, they've got themselves into a mess too many times before.. From what I've read, the option is only air strikes using bombers. I doubt whether the USA would actually be willing to use its own aircraft or cruise misiles..

[quote]: "It will not be a large scale war.. it'll be a surgical strike by the Israelis using US sattelite and intel guidance."

This what they say (both US and Israel) before every single war and when they screw up they begin to find excuses to inject more money, send more troops and ship more weapons before they go back and lick their wounds..

I never proclaimed it to give you permission to cheekily say 'Ya sheikha' you deducted it from when I said "just because i share in the same lieniage, it doesnt mean blah blah...." ALL speculative, or are you an expert on our lenieage aswell?

Potato - Potato

PM I would , but I wasnt awear I broke any since im new and your old and you called me Sheikha & royalty, to me that sounds like you calling me by my last name which is against the rules aswel , is it not?

Do enlighten me

potato

The Saudis WILL turn a blind eye if not take a part in it.. We saw their "neutral" stance on the war against Hizbulla in 2006.. But I doubt that the Israelis will dare to do it given that the US isn't likely to support a new war.. They couldn't achieve their goals in the tiny area of Gaza Strip..

I know. They love this country. Have given back through their work (2 worked in DAGOC), one in A-J and they have represented QATAR (not Palestine) when they have attended conferences and received awards.

I'm sure there are Palestinians who don't want to assimilate and surely trying to maintain a separate culture affects that. But I am only speaking of the cases I personally know something about.

I refuse to drink the kool-aid! -- PM

I refuse to drink the kool-aid! -- PM

I refuse to drink the kool-aid! -- PM

britexpat : Balls to you ! Dont florish fake news in QL and dont try to malign gulf countries from where you are earning your living, so better be careful. These Medias are bullshit they just fool around by giving fake news and try to create problems, because of this Media which aired old days of Saddams, when he was celebrating and they aired as if this celebrations were done after 9/11, so you Americans, Israelis and British people are sailing in the same bloody boat. You people should be kicked out from Gulf countries atleast and lets see.

I refuse to drink the kool-aid! -- PM

There's not anything I wrote in this thread that could even be construed as that. Unless you are just lying again.

Read again: saying that we like to blame EVERYTHING on Israel and the West is not referring to the occupation of Palestinian land. It is a looser term meant to point out how no one really wants to do much to help the Palestinians other than throwing money at Hamas or the PA, which they know will in some cases do more harm than good. They just sees it as another way to attack the West.

I refuse to drink the kool-aid! -- PM

I am simply saying that when you can help put someone out of their misery, it would be the decent thing to do. I am not saying that Qatar and every other nation doesn't have the right to decide who gets citizenship. I am simply pointing out that this idea really doesn't correlate with Islamic values, in my opinion. Yes, they have their rights as a sovereign nation, but let's call it what it is.

That's all.

I refuse to drink the kool-aid! -- PM

and yet you love to lord the fact that you can get Qatari citizenship anytime you want it. How does that work?

I know the reasons they have not had it processed. At least I know the reasons they were told. "It is being delayed for now, but your applications and fees have been noted". That's not speculation, vermin.

I refuse to drink the kool-aid! -- PM

No need to split hairs, i've edited the post to make it PC and speculative....doent make that much of a difference....Ho Hummm :/

PM Are you always so fiesty?

Pity you didnt go to war on Iraq with you Ex, you could have save the whole reigon the heartache and spared the USofA from its economic recession :p

Referring to me by any other name... be it haq or hashin or irani or iraqi can be construed as an effort to divulge personal information... now that's not something we want to engage in... knowing how paranoid you are PM..

IF I am hashin... then you shouldn't be calling me that :-)

I refuse to drink the kool-aid! -- PM

Will you not abide by the "rules" you yourself brought up yesterday???

I refuse to drink the kool-aid! -- PM

PM, Really was I? I thought it was ok because you keep calling versi Hashin , isnt that his presumed name?

PM correction.. 'THAT' land was Always shared , the Quds mosque is part mosque and part synagouge!

But were not dealing with jews, were dealing with Zionist jews ...........................Greater Isreal

even be content if a country was created for them. Because the real issue is THAT land. Everyone wants to fight over THAT land and too few people are willing to share it.

Many of the Palestinians I know would be happy to simply be given Israeli citizenship and equal rights. But of course, that won't happen. The point I am making is that I find that some Palestinians are willing to become Israelis and give up the claim of exclusive right to the land, but a lot of the Arab world doesn't want that to happen. In some ways, the Arab-Israeli conflict fuels something in the Arab world that I think some would miss if there was resolution.

I refuse to drink the kool-aid! -- PM

You are blaming the people who are trying to solve the problem for not doing enough to solve it

Instead of blaming the people who cause the problem in the first place

And if you can't get that in to your thick head... YOU have an AGENDA and neither me nor anyone else can reason with you...

Im saying everyone should treat these injuries, but unfortunately unlike occupied Palestine, the palestinians wont be given a similar compensatory 'israel' out of a united nation guilt, because theirs is haulocaust without guilt, because guilt isnt even factored into the equation not even in the long run.

You said

"if you want to say that no should offer antiseptic, band aids or an ice pack until that bully is caught, then let's call that what it is."

i.e. ... that equates to saying that Arab countries are doing nothing

if I am saying things that have no relationship to what I have written. If you don't understand English then don't participate on the main forum.

I refuse to drink the kool-aid! -- PM

I know he doesn't speak for everyone and I know there are still hard feelings for many. But you asked me about my experience and I answered.

BTW, my wali was Palestinian when I married the Kuwaiti. That is how the conversations came up. He told me that there were some areas that contained mostly Palestinian businesses and during the Iraqi occupation that some of those Palestinians took their weapons on the streets and policed their areas, not allowing Kuwaitis passage and humiliating them. He also told me that all Kuwaitis he knew hated Yasser Arafat,

I am just repeating what I was told since you asked about my experience.

I'm not sure what you mean about the Sphinx. It's a static antique and lovely work of art, but rather meaningless in today's world (except as a historical monument). I hope that doesn't mean the Arab world will be static, pretty to look at and meaningless :-)))

I refuse to drink the kool-aid! -- PM

lets not forget the watchful eye of the bully's big brother who wipes the sweat off his brow and keeps everyone at arms length as all this happens... so the bully can continue to kick with renewed strength and vigour

Are you saying that Muslim countries are NOT sending ANY Aid to Palestine?

but until that bully gets called into the office and put on detention, wouldn't you treat the wounds of the victim???? That is what I am saying. Now if you want to say that no should offer antiseptic, band aids or an ice pack until that bully is caught, then let's call that what it is. You are willing to see people victimized to prove a greater point.

And I would prefer to treat the injuries while trying to get that bully under control.

I refuse to drink the kool-aid! -- PM

Alexa, its ok dear, appolgy accepted :)

PM you know what you just said now may have flown by many who dont know whats happening in kuwait, but any kuwaiti to have incredulously been ok with the informers whos effect is still rivoting through kuwait.

A few months back one member of parliment 'Alsana' was kicked out on the curb when he was filmed rejoicing with palestinians and kuwait was in a state of upheaval against sending in funds to palestine, this highly publicized event was sparked by a woman when she took the ghuttra (red n white male head dress) of her martyred brother and said here, pity this instead of the black n white palestinian kuffeya.

As for wanting to live long enough to see the day the Arabs get their priorities right, you just may witness it...like Spinx :)

Its like a kid who is being hit by a bully repeatedly

and then everyone blaming the school nurse for the kid's problem...

The root cause of the problem is the bully

Not the nurse's inability to heal the wounds quick enuff

Who are you to judge whether Qatar any other Muslim Country is not doing enough to alleviate the problem?

Based on what FACT are you stating this?

I refuse to drink the kool-aid! -- PM

Did you just say that we should not blame Israel for the Israeli occupation of Palestine?

Could you please clarify what you meant by that?

Pls don't lie about me PM...

Can you pls show me where I have 'lorded' the fact that I can have Qatari Nationality?

I am very proud of my Indian nationality and I do not feel any compulsion whatsoever to attain any nationality other than what I have at the moment

So stop waving that card at my face as you always do...

As for your childish idyllic world, get real...

Not for a second do you fool anyone with your compassion for the cause of the Palestinians

Your banter on the idyllic world is just an excuse for you to ridicule Muslims the way that you do always...

In an idyllic world, there would be no poverty

In an idyllic world, there would be no hunger

In an idyllic world, there would be no illiteracy

and yet in YOUR idyllic world you are more concerned about the Palestinian issue?

Don't shed your crocodile tears here

I refuse to drink the kool-aid! -- PM

represent. I just hate the hypocrisy of always crying crocodile tears over the poor Palestinians so you can feel good about yourselves and blame everything on Isreal and the West.

BTW, I did not live in Kuwait on a full-time basis, but my ex-husband was in an Iraqi prison until the liberation. Even he doesn't resent the Palestinians the way many do, and he said the whole matter had been seriously blown out of proportion with lots of false reports made.

I would love to see the Arabs get their priorities straight. I hope I live long enough :-)

I refuse to drink the kool-aid! -- PM

britexpat thank you for your sensible reasoning

Alexa...you mean a commite like the one PM singlehandedly formulated now?

PM b4 (actually IF) I read your post. Maybe, just maybe Qatar hasnt issued them passports for the possible reasons the palestinians who were born and raised and established themselves in kuwait, were the very same ones who when Iraq annexed kuwait, rejoiced and supported another country that they have no affilation with and they themselves aided the destruction by becoming informers leading the Iraqis to massacre and kill and take prisioner many kuwaitis who till this day arent found...You most of all should know this, or did this happen after your time in kuwait?

Rather than dishing out knee jerk solutions let the arabs get their priorities straight first

The root cause of the problem is not the fact that Muslim countries are not doing enough to help the Palestinians

They can do more to alleviate their state... true... but would that solve the problem... No

That's why what you are suggesting is like prescribing paracetamol for brain cancer

The root cause of the disease is not that the head ache is being controlled by giving pain killers

We can give pain killers to ease the pain... true... but would that solve the problem... No

The root cause is unrightful occupation of Palestinian land and that's the problem that needs to be solved

I guess I wanted to believe the Muslim world was better. :-(

I refuse to drink the kool-aid! -- PM

I agree with you.. What you ask is in an ideal situation. Trouble is that the world is far from idylic..

Any State has a right to deny its citizenship to aspiring applicants... one has to respect the right of that State...

Even the US for instance reserves the right to deny citizenship to an applicant regardless of however long they may have resided in the US

Agreed... the criterias in the Middle East are more strict...

But I don't know of any place in the world where immigrants or refugees have unconditional citizenship being granted to them by any country

So PM, unless we know the details as to WHY citizenship was denied to your friends, you should not speculate, it is unethical...

Sure one could say that Qatar has done enough by allowing them to work here away from the conflict. But then, one would perhaps expect more considering that these are their Muslim brothers and we are always reminded of how being muslim binds us together and separates os from the Kafirun.

I refuse to drink the kool-aid! -- PM

so your assessment is MOOT.

When you have cancer, the first thing you try to do is remove the immediate pain that you can control. Then you treat it and try to cure it.

What have the Muslim countries done to treat the pain OR cure the problem?

I refuse to drink the kool-aid! -- PM

Shameful as it may be, but Qatar or for that matter any other country has no obligation to give citizenship to the Palestinians..

I agree that it would be a fine gesture after all they've given to the country, but one could argue that the country has also given them abode and a place to bring up their children in safety.

Population Estimates of Americans of Palestinian Ancestry

Posted on Tuesday October 17, 2006

Palestinian immigration to America dates back to the late nineteenth century. Among the earliest evidence of their presence in the U.S. was the 1876 Centennial Exposition in Philadelphia at which several entrepreneurs from Palestine explored trade with American counterparts. Like other Arabic-speaking immigrants who arrived before World War I, many were involved in peddling, import/export and shop keeping.

While some Palestinians arrived in America as refugees from the 1948 Arab-Israeli war, the largest number immigrated after 1965, mostly from the West Bank and Jerusalem. This wave included students who remained after college and professionals, many of whom spent some time in Gulf countries. Both Christian and Muslim, Palestinian immigrants have settled throughout the U.S. and have major concentrations in Chicago, Detroit, Cleveland, San Francisco, New York, Houston and Jacksonville.

Statistics on Palestinian immigration are difficult to confirm given the multiplicity of travel documents and countries of last residence on which data depends. One albeit imperfect measure is the ancestry question in the U.S. Census. Roughly six percent of Americans of Arab ancestry identified Palestinian heritage in 2000, which adjusting for the undercount would represent at least 250,000.

Reasons for the undercount of ancestry groups from the Arab world include the effect of the sample methodology on small, unevenly distributed ethnic groups, high levels of out-marriage among the third and fourth generations, and distrust/misunderstanding of government surveys among recent immigrants. While the 2000 census accounted for close to 1.3 million persons who trace their heritage to the Arab world, AAIF estimates the population at closer to 3.9 million.

2000 Census Data AAIF Estimates

Palestinian Ancestry 72,000 252,000

All Arab Ancestry 1,300,000 3,900,000

http://www.aaiusa.org/issues/2550/population-estimates-of-americans-of-palestinian-ancestry

I refuse to drink the kool-aid! -- PM

You can't expect all Islamic nations to agree on every given issue...

Simply making decisions based on Islamic principles does not mean that they all end up making the same decisions...

As for this whole discussion of What are Arab countries doing to help the Palestinians...

That's a moot point...

Giving passports or whatever is just symptomatic treatment, doesn't help solve the problem

Its like trying to cure brain cancer with pain killers

The root cause of the problem is the ISRAELI occupation

The root cause of the problem is NOT what the Arab countries are NOT doing to solve the problem

American citizenship and will continue to have more, I am sure.

The reason I said Arab countries is because of the shared culture. I know so many Palestinians who have lived in Qatar for 30+ years and STILL don't have a flipping passport and citizenship!!! Every time they are told that the rules are going to change and they can apply for citizenship, nothing ever comes of it. I know one family who has sent 6 of their children to QF universities and 2 to the aeronautical college here. All the kids were born here (they are aged 19 to 30 now) and both parents were career teachers for Qatari schools. Yet, they have no citizenship and theirs is only one story I could tell you.

To me, THAT IS SHAMEFUL.

I refuse to drink the kool-aid! -- PM

Alexa....apparently not the ones who are shamefully dying in exile

http://home.earthlink.net/~lazarski/home/Middle-East.gif

Have a look at the map

Israeli jets flying over Saudi or not makes hardly a difference...

Yes, but not all Palestinians are Muslim !

PM "And yet generations die in exile, without even the benefit of having a freaking passport! It's shameful."

True I wholeheartedly agree, but shouldnt this be an international responsibility and all other countries, especially the 'neutral ones' extend the same invitation.

If anything it would promote the great big melting pot you mentioned in earlier posts.

provides your basis for everything in life. Strictly speaking, in Islam there is no such thing as separation of Church and State. There is a Caliphate that rules over ALL Muslims (the ummah). All decisions would be made according to Islamic principles. So all these countries that profess to be Islamic countries are not at all; because there is no such thing as islamic countries. Their is an Islamic nation that would embrace ALL Muslims.

These countries are not Islamic. They are dominated by Muslims.

I refuse to drink the kool-aid! -- PM

All counties, whether Arab or not have their own best interests at heart - Rightly so..

The mistake people tend to make is that they believe that because these countries are Islamic, they must act for the benefit of the Muslims in general. This is not the case..

nations as individual sovereign entities. But when you couple that with a religious mantra that purports one Islamic nation and Arab unity, the cracks starts to show.

I refuse to drink the kool-aid! -- PM

I refuse to drink the kool-aid! -- PM

Arabs dwell in complexity... the West uses this to its advantage.

From what I have surmised, the Gulf Arabs are wary of the Palestinians , as are the Jordanians to some extent.

They want to help the Palestinians financially and moraly, but not allow them to settle on their lands..

To be honest, I see nothing wrong with this attitude..

It's a very interesting and complex issue. Arabs can say that the reason they don't allow Palestinians to immigrate into their countries is because they don't want to have them give up the right of return. And yet generations die in exile, without even the benefit of having a freaking passport! It's shameful.

I refuse to drink the kool-aid! -- PM

But shhhhhh! Don't tell anybody. They like to pretend they took a stand against it.

I refuse to drink the kool-aid! -- PM

True, Palestinians are indeed not very popular.

It is funny how some CAN and some CAN NOT have nuclear power. Who gets to decide?

Didn't they do the same with saddam and Iraq ???

one want the Palestinians.They are paid to stay where they are now as cannon fodder for Israel.

Forget the problems between Saudi and Iran there are so many problems between the Arab's themselves that America and Israel will continue to make merry in this region for years to come by playing one against another.

The way I see it is that the Arab countries are just as worried about Iran getting too big for their britches, but in order to "save face" and not get tagged with the "betraying the ummah" card they would rather have someone else do their dirty work.

I refuse to drink the kool-aid! -- PM

Of course we know about this information and it is being taken seriously. Consequently the USA/Isreal/allies are planning according to the information that they have been able to get.

We don't know specifics because intelligence is not able to spy on Iran effectively.

Former intelligence agents have stated this fact.

It's what we don't know that is going to hurt us.

I still would never under estimate the capabilities of Ahmadinejad.

Western intelligence agencies have warned USA and Israel and there ally's several times that their strategic interest are already under Iran's target.This caused extra pissing problem in white house and pentagon's staff while on work and even in their desks.

Brit,

these are the same geniuses that swore Iraq had MWA's?

The CIA and the Israelis intelligence services have repeatedly said that Iran is a few years away from having nuclear capability. The ability to enrich is just the first step.

the hardest part is the delivery systems.

Yeah yeah! like breaking walnut from ass whole.

This is a very real threat. All the middle eastern countries look at iran with fear. 1 .because they are shia 2. they are not arabs 3. they support terroist groups in lebenon, palestine, syria and ofcourse iraq.

Iran has the potential to destabilze any country in the middle east and the US is the only counter weight to this in this region. There are fears that iran obtaining a bomb can spark off a nuclear arms race in this region where the saudis , UAE and egypt has express some sort of desire to have that capability.

This option should israel were to use it could send oil price shooting up and destabilse the whole region. we already have a 'plate full' at the moment

A single nuclear bomb over Natanz will solve the problem in minutes. Just like Hiroshima, this would wipe it off the surface of Iran. Sounds aggressive huh? Peace brother!

Oh ! from now am imagining Israel's jets being destroyed even b4 entering Iran's airspace and felling into lap of their lovers.

they've done it twice already (iraq&syria) their only problem is geography, but they can do it the third time, with a little help from their "friends" and with ahmedinejad "winning" the iranian elections, only time will tell when the israelis will strike.

'SO DARK THE CON OF MAN'

I hope so Brit....

How do we know that Iran is at the novice stage, when, in fact, our knowledge about Iran is very limited.

They pride themeselves in being cut-off from the rest of the world and the intelligence information is limited.

I would not under estimate the psychotic mind of Ahmadinejad. He's scary!

i can see that!!! Rizks but this topic is moving so i thought someone out of u all might be interested in playing...:) anyways carry on:)

Let's be realistic.. Iran is at a novice stage when it comes to nuclear weapons and deployment..

Israel, the US and its neighbours have probably studies the possible scenarios a thousand times. they know that the risks of retaliation are low.

The only possible response from Iran is to use its power to mobilize terrorist attackes against the perpertreators. I am sure these eventualities will also have been taken care of..

At the end of the day.. The Big Dog is hard to mess with..

Saudi and Isreal have been in talks since February and March since 2002 about land swapping for peace and other areas of interest. Their political relationship is nothing new and yes, they, indeed make strange bedfellows.

Interesting.

lol zsabri...

cant u see we have a serious discussion goin on over here ?? :)

Any one interested to playsnooker today evening?!!

Brit,

Forget it.

You think Iran will sit back and let it happen? Ow sure, bomb us, no problem???

You still believe the bull-shit they sell you on CNN?

Of course any attack on Iran will have consequence for the whole region.

I say, give 1 year notice to Israel & Palestine to evacuate the country than freaking nuke the shit out of Israel/Palestine. Destroy the holy land by turning it into Tjernobil.

1 - no casualties

2 - no reason to fight over holy land.

3 - America/Australia/Canada can absorb the Jews

4 - Middle East can absorb the Palestinians

Problem solved.

It will not be a large scale war.. it'll be a surgical strike by the Israelis using US sattelite and intel guidance.

The strike will be limited, but will no doubt incur "collateral damage"..

It ism soooooo good to see how much the Arabs/Persians love each other.

Israel will attack Iran, on behalf of the United States. In case this economic crisis does not recover properly they NEED a war-economy. For instance a large scale war would in part revive the automotive industry.

Plus, Iraq of course was Phase - 1 of a much larger evil plan to 'colonize' that region. You think they are looking for Osama? Nah, their presence is just required,

mintus, israel does not dare, they do it and they don't need a US approval to bomb that iranian nuclear facility if they want to.

'SO DARK THE CON OF MAN'

I am sure that Israel actions are endorsed by te US. The Americans cannot be seen to be acting directly, so its in their interest to use Israel as a proxy..

Lusitano: Nothing will happen. The Arabs will make noises to please the masses, but the furore will soon die down.. It is in all their interests to have a wekened Iran in the region..

That would be a huge mistake and would probably affect Qatar as well!

strange bedfellows...

Isreal would not dare without the US and I can not see them approving such a move.