Hamilton deposed of win, given to Massa...
Hamilton penalised, Massa handed win
Sunday, 07 September 2008 17:22
Lewis Hamilton has had his Belgian Grand Prix victory overturned by the stewards, handing the win to title rival Felipe Massa, who finished second on the road.
Hamilton was given a 25-second penalty for cutting the Bus Stop chicane during his wheel-to-wheel battle for the lead with Kimi Raikkonen during the closing laps.
Although the McLaren driver appeared to lift off and was repassed by Raikkonen on the exit of the corner, the stewards ruled that he had gained an advantage by short-cutting the circuit.
"The stewards, having received a report from the race director and having met with the drivers and team managers involved, have...determine a breach of the regulations has been committed by the competitor and impose the penalty referred to," said an FIA statement.
Hamilton was deemed to have "cut the chicane and gained an advantage", thereby breaching Article 30.3(a) of the sporting regulations and Appendix L chapter 4 Article 2 (g) of the International Sporting Code.
With 25 seconds added to his race time, Hamilton has dropped to third in the classification behind BMW Sauber’s Nick Heidfeld.
The decision brings about a six-point swing in Massa's favour in the championship standings, reducing Hamilton's lead from eight to two points.
Raikkonen crashed out of the race on the penultimate lap and is now 19 points behind Hamilton with five rounds remaining.
Revised Belgian Grand Prix result
1. MASSA Ferrari
2. HEIDFELD BMW
3. HAMILTON McLaren*
4. ALONSO Renault
5. VETTEL Toro Rosso
6. KUBICA BMW
7. BOURDAIS Toro Rosso
8. WEBBER Red Bull
9. GLOCK Toyota*
10. KOVALAINEN McLaren
11. COULTHARD Red Bull
12. ROSBERG Williams
13. SUTIL Force India
14. NAKAJIMA Williams
15. BUTTON Honda
16. TRULLI Toyota
17. FISICHELLA Force India
R. RAIKKONEN Ferrari
R. BARRICHELLO Honda
R. PIQUET Renault
*25-second time penalty
:)
&feature=related
I had not watched the video, just watched it.
I don't understand shi*t about racing, I admit to that, but from what I could see, Hamilton's move was not cool at all! And he didn't really "let" Raikonnen in front of him, letting someone in means giving the guy space and he never did that, he was right there on his tail!
I think if it were a Ferrari driver doing that everyone wouldn't even be talking about it, they'd take the penalty for granted.
I say well done to the FIA.
Ooops! My bad. Lauda is Austrian indeed. My idea of him being a German came from the fact that I kept seeing him on RTL channel in good old days when Al Jazeera didn't broadcast F1 nor I had Star Sports :)
Yes quite true about the stewards. I've been following F1 since 1992 and don't even know how they're appointed or come from. LOL. Perhaps never bothered to look into it.
Britexpat: You know, I was reading an article on F1 Live website and came across this one. Really interesting and makes you think. Is it really worth racing hard and risking that one manoeuver which could get you just 2 extra points? Especially now, after Hamilton has been docked 6 points. : http://en.f1-live.com/f1/en/headlines/news/detail/080908114903.shtml
One also needs to check out this video being talked about :
Just imagine if someone makes so many moves in today's times. He's sure to get a ban in the next race. LOL. There's something that needs to be done to improve overtaking. We don't need more races like Monaco. Two boring races in a year were enough already (Hungary as well). Now we gotta put up with Valencia and Singapore. Dang!
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3000 QL Points
Way to go Ray!
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now works with German TV and is very pro Mercedes, so he's bound to say that.
I don't see the fuss. The "Stewards" penalized Hamilton.. He should suck it up and move on to the enxt race.
True, Lauda is a long-time Ferrari devotee, however his points have been echoed by Sir Jackie Stewart as well, calling for full-time stewards, not part-timers that however qualified (just how does one become one?) provide inconsistencies from race to race.
The amount of money in the sport has to call for professionalism at ALL levels.
Whether you support Ferrari or any other team, Hamilton or any other driver, surely you must agree that the stewards issue needs to be resolved.
There is even doubt as to whether Ron can make a legitimate appeal....
Torque
Points as of Today...
1 Lewis Hamilton British McLaren-Mercedes 76
2 Felipe Massa Brazilian Ferrari 74
3 Robert Kubica Polish BMW Sauber 58
4 Kimi Räikkönen Finnish Ferrari 57
5 Nick Heidfeld German BMW Sauber 49
6 Heikki Kovalainen Finnish McLaren-Mercedes 43
Slim chance for BMW....to get max 50 points to win...
Maybe two horse race now..... Ferrari & McLaren...
What makes you think BMW stands a chance in either of two championships? Constructors or Drivers.
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2900 QL Points
Way to go Ray!
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After Belgium, The Title Race is still open for Ferrari, McLaren & BMW Drivers.
The next 5 races will be very interesting.
Bravo! Bravo! Bravo! BMW....
Lauda has freaked out eversince Schumacher retired. He's been making such comments when Schumi was in (then ofcourse in favor of Ferrari), now that his compatriot has left F1, Lauda pretends to be more neutral.
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2900 QL Points
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Lauda: Lewis penalty will harm F1
Monday, 08 September 2008 14:43
Former world champion Niki Lauda has blasted the Belgian Grand Prix stewards' decision to penalise Lewis Hamilton as a 'stupid' verdict that will make fans turn away from the sport.
Hamilton won the Spa race on the road after a frantic late dice with Kimi Raikkonen, but was given a 25 second penalty for cutting the Bus Stop chicane during their battle - even though he immediately let the Ferrari back through.
Lauda, who won titles for both Ferrari and McLaren, admitted that the officials' actions left him baffled and frustrated.
"I do not understand this completely wrong decision," he told BBC Radio Five Live.
"Everything was explained perfectly: Lewis had an advantage, but then he let him go by, then he simply out-braked him into the corner.
"There was no slipstreaming involved, nothing.
"Just think about it: If Lewis had stayed behind Kimi through the chicane, he would have passed him in front of the pits, because Lewis and the McLaren, at that time in the race in the wet, were so much quicker.
"So I do not understand this decision, and it's really bad for the sport because people watching will not watch any more because of this stupid decision."
The Austrian legend said that Hamilton's penalty made him start to believe suggestions that the authorities favoured Ferrari.
"In the past, there have always been rumours and stories - and I've always been completely against them because they've never been proven - that Ferrari, because of its past and history, was always against McLaren with the stewards and the FIA, who if there was a decision, were in favour of Ferrari," said Lauda.
"I've always said this is bulls**t, that this is a sport and you have to be neutral, but the decision yesterday makes me believe that everyone is watching Ferrari in a positive way and McLaren in a very negative way.
"What developed yesterday is the biggest mess the sport has ever done."
Lauda reckons that the events of Spa underline the need for permanent race stewards who attend every GP.
"I think the first thing that should happen is to try to train stewards of the meeting to understand the sport and the issues that drivers need to know," he said.
"If you change them all the time, then new people are coming in who don't seem to have a clue."
He believes the stewards misinterpreted Hamilton's actions and thought he had placed his McLaren advantageously when letting Raikkonen back through.
"They understood the rules, but they thought that the slipstream was the advantage and that Lewis did not lift enough," said Lauda.
"This is completely wrong: there was no slipstream involved.
"He tried to pass on the left but Kimi moved over, then he passed on the right because he braked later - without any slipstream.
"It's unbelievable how the best driver in yesterday's race makes no mistakes and only gets six points."
...from the UK Speed Hill Climbing Championship where she competed in another friends' immaculate Lotus 23B & a rare HMW Alta-Jaguar, the latter very similar to my fathers once pride & joy!
She is & was a great racer & very knowledgeable about motorsport full stop.
Sponsorship was I believe the problem, NOT the talent.
Appreciate there are many opinions on here, but I have to say that I'm a Lewis Hamilton fan, only wish I had time to actually watch the races...
Torque
I guess it's more to do with physical thing.
F1 is pinnacle of motorsport and you can't allow a slow driver there for sure. I'd imagine that having a female driver would make F1 attractive and make it more lively, which obviously would bring in more sponsors. That takes care of the costing part.
No doubt, women are competing with men at almost everything, but there certainly is different between performances in sports between the two sexes. Be it a 100 meter dash, high jump, tennis or car racing.
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2900 QL Points
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You are right though. I wonder why women haven't made it into Formula 1. Is it because of the cost or the physical aspect ?
Nopes either! I just read that she was best ever women's rally driver.
But I do know Tera Patrick very well! :) Hehehehe
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2900 QL Points
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You obviously don't remember Michelle Mouton , who drove for Audi a few years ago...
Oooooi.
I had to look up who Danica Patrick was. LOL. Not too aware on American racing scene.
If she is recruited, I guess Force India stands a chance to come 18th and 19th. Racing isn't a women's game :)
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2900 QL Points
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Piquet was put in at the deep end.. However, he brings in a lot of sponsorship and also widens the appeal of F1.
I wonder if Danica Patrick will try her luck in Formula 1.. Red Bull should give her a try out.. Will help sell the product in the US of A..
Yes, rayyz, Barrichello does not have a great reputation in Brazil either.
I just can't support any Piquet. Once a Senna supporter, it's blasphemy to support a Piquet! LOL
Well Barichello is one Brazilian who I'm not too proud of. He sucks!
That reminds me of a comment on radio by Nelson Piquet Jr.. After spinning and hitting the wall much much before the rains, he goes on the radio and says, "I'm okay but I am out (of the race)". If I was in Renault Engineer's seat at the other end of the radio, I'd rather tell him to be NOT OKAY but still be IN THE RACE. LOL. Man this guy has a season full of debacles.
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2900 QL Points
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I'm a Ferrari fan but I feel things have been biased to Ferrari for a long time.
Look back even as far as Schumi's days and they have gotten away with murder, just one example being the use of a sneaky traction control after such things were banned. Penalty imposed...none
just eat another pie
I think Mclaren is lucky to be racing this year after the spy scandal!
At times I feel for Ron Dennis, he seriously survived a difficult last year.
1. Spy scandal
2. Dealing with media questions about spy-gate
3. Embarrassing situations in court
4. Alonso - Lewis tiff
5. Taking crap from both the drivers
6. Handling media pressure again about the drivers breakaway
7. Losing the both world championship after almost getting 'there' with 3 races to go.
8. Personal problems with his wife
I'm shocked he didn't have a stroke!
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2900 QL Points
Way to go Ray!
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rayyz, for the record, I'm not a Ferrari fan. I'll support any team that has a Brazilian in it (as long as it's not a Piquet) ;)
Wow I can't believe there are so many Ferrari fans on QL! :)
I kinda like Alonso now after what he went thru at Mclaren last year. I'd like to term him as 'miskeen' as said in the Gulf. LOL
More on Hamilton, rewind to Hungarian GP last year and Hamilton lost a qualifying lap stuck behind Alonso and on radio he went used the F-word to Ron. Of course, later Mclaren issued releases stating that Hamilton didn't do that.
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2900 QL Points
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I agree with you, britexpat. If anything, I think the FIA is harsher on Ferrari.
Ever since the scandal, the teams have been saying that the FIA is biased towards Ferrari.
I personally don't believe that to be the case..I think its more jealousy than anything else..
I mean look at Toyota and Honda. They've ploughed millions into their F1 effort and still got nothing to show.
Fatcat: Exactly my thoughts regarding Hamilton..
Unsurprisingly, McLaren are appealing.
Tell more Fatcat!
I was so pissed off to hear Hamilton on radio after he won the race. He went something like, 'Yeeeehaaw! NOW THIS IS WHAT I AM TALKING ABOUT!". Arrogance all the way.
Btw, other teams have slammed the decision and renamed FIA from Fédération Internationale de l'Automobile to FERRARI Internationale de l'Automobile. LOL
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2900 QL Points
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I used to like Hamilton until late last year, when I realised he was playing games with Alonso. And I never used to like Alonso because I always thought he complained waaay too much. Now I like Alonso (I think he has matured a lot) and dislike Hamilton.
Massa is cool. But of course I'm biased ;) I hope he wins the championship this year :D
Justice prevails. It was very easy for everyone to see that he gained illegal advantage by cutting short thru the chicane.
I'm glad he got stripped of the win. Massa deserves his bit of luck after such a miserable last year.
Anybody but Hamilton to win 2008 championship. I just hope its Massa, Kimi's title hopes seem to be over. 19 points adrift with 5 races to go :(
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2900 QL Points
Way to go Ray!
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...but at least I don't hear another word of Schumi anymore...
"Everything in this book may be wrong." Illusions: The Adventures of The Reluctant Messiah by Richard Bach
...excited at such prospects!
Don't forget who gave Senna his break into F1 or Schumi, although their relationship's weren't as long-lived as that of the Hamilton/Denis one, but did still break...!
In one week is another race in Ferrari Land.
You're right. Kimi has been a disappointment.. I think Ferrari made a bad mistake letting Ross Brawn go.. His tactics used to win them a lot more races..
I fancy Ferrari, too, britexpat. But Hamilton did not make mistakes where Kimi made them. He is cool for his age. And he drives the other nuts. I must honor this without prejudice.
It'll never happen.. McLaren have groomed him since his early teens.. Can't see him going anywhere else..
, HE'S BEEN THROWING HIS TOYS OUT OF THE PRAM EVERY SINCE HE'S HAD A TEAM-MATE THAT'S BEEN QUICKER!!
HE PLAYED MIND GAMES WITH LEWIS & DESPITE HIS INEXPERIENCE HE LET HIS DRIVING DO THE TALKING & WHEN HE TALKED HE WAS & IS MATURE & SUPREMELY CONFIDENT.
LET'S GET BEHIND LEWIS, NOT KICK HIM IN THE BALLS WHENEVER AN OPPORTUNITY ARISES!!
Sorry for the CAPS, but that's JUST my opinion.
Lewis has done an amazing job under immense pressure yet has made very few mistakes in such an embrionic F1 career, albeit those mistakes have been costly in the extreme, but let's not knock the guy.
How would you feel if he were signed to Ferrari for 2009...???!!!!
You'd be celebrating a dream pairing, as would most F1 fans, not to mention die hard Ferrari ones....
Sorry. I just think that Hamilton is sneaky. Last year he played politics and made Alonso look the bad guy..
Also, I'm a diehard Ferrari fan and want them to win:o)
why you're angry, brit?
hahaa... if topgear were running now, clarkson would have spent the whole hour dissing hamilton..
Serves him right.. He's getting too big for his boots. Hope Massa wins the championship..uight