Marry more than one, Islam is unjust to women
POLYGAMY
Question:
Why is a man allowed to have more than one wife in Islam? i.e. why is polygamy allowed in Islam?
Answer:
Definition of Polygamy
1. Polygamy means a system of marriage whereby one person has more than one spouse. Polygamy can be of two types. One is polygamy where a man marries more than one woman, and the other is polyandry, where a woman marries more than one man. In Islam, limited polygamy is permitted; whereas polyandry is completely prohibited.
Now coming to the original question, why is a man allowed to have more than one wife?
2. The Qur’an is the only religious scripture in the world that says,"marry only one".
The Qur’an is the only religious book, on the face of this earth, that contains the phrase ‘marry only one’. There is no other religious book that instructs men to have only one wife. In none of the other religious scriptures, whether it be the Vedas, the Ramayana, the Mahabharata, the Geeta, the Talmud or the Bible does one find a restriction on the number of wives. According to these scriptures one can marry as many as one wishes. It was only later, that the Hindu priests and the Christian Church restricted the number of wives to one.
Many Hindu religious personalities, according to their scriptures, had multiple wives. King Dashrat, the father of Rama, had more than one wife. Krishna had several wives.
In earlier times, Christian men were permitted as many wives as they wished, since the Bible puts no restriction on the number of wives. It was only a few centuries ago that the Church restricted the number of wives to one.
Polygamy is permitted in Judaism. According to Talmudic law, Abraham had three wives, and Solomon had hundreds of wives. The practice of polygamy continued till Rabbi Gershom ben Yehudah (95% C.E to 1030 C.E) issued an edict against it. The Jewish Sephardic communities living in Muslim countries continued the practice till as late as 1950, until an Act of the Chief Rabbinate of Israel extended the ban on marrying more than one wife.
3. Hindus are more polygamous than Muslims
The report of the ‘Committee of The Status of Woman in Islam’, published in 1975 mentions on page numbers 66 and 67 that the percentage of polygamous marriages between the years 1951 and 1961 was 5.06% among the Hindus and only 4.31% among the Muslims. According to Indian law only Muslim men are permitted to have more than one wife. It is illegal for any non-Muslim in India to have more than one wife. Despite it being illegal, Hindus have more multiple wives as compared to Muslims. Earlier, there was no restriction even on Hindu men with respect to the number of wives allowed. It was only in 1954, when the Hindu Marriage Act was passed that it became illegal for a Hindu to have more than one wife. At present it is the Indian Law that restricts a Hindu man from having more than one wife and not the Hindu scriptures.
Let us now analyze why Islam allows a man to have more than one wife.
4. Qur’an permits limited polygamy
As I mentioned earlier, Qur’an is the only religious book on the face of the earth that says ‘marry only one’. The context of this phrase is the following verse from Surah Nisa of the Glorious Qur’an:
"Marry women of your choice, two, or three, or four; but if ye fear that ye shall not be able to deal justly (with them), then only one."
[Al-Qur’an 4:3]
Before the Qur’an was revealed, there was no upper limit for polygamy and many men had scores of wives, some even hundreds. Islam put an upper limit of four wives. Islam gives a man permission to marry two, three or four women, only on the condition that he deals justly with them.
In the same chapter i.e. Surah Nisa verse 129 says:
"Ye are never able to be fair and just as between women...."
[Al-Qur’an 4:129]
Therefore polygamy is not a rule but an exception. Many people are under the misconception that it is compulsory for a Muslim man to have more than one wife.
Broadly, Islam has five categories of Do’s and Don’ts:
i. ‘Fard’ i.e. compulsory or obligatory
ii. ‘Mustahab’ i.e. recommended or encouraged
iii. ‘Mubah’ i.e. permissible or allowed
iv. ‘Makruh’ i.e. not recommended or discouraged
v. ‘Haraam’ i.e. prohibited or forbidden
Polygamy falls in the middle category of things that are permissible. It cannot be said that a Muslim who has two, three or four wives is a better Muslim as compared to a Muslim who has only one wife.
5. Average life span of females is more than that of males
By nature males and females are born in approximately the same ratio. A female child has more immunity than a male child. A female child can fight the germs and diseases better than the male child. For this reason, during the pediatric age itself there are more deaths among males as compared to the females.
During wars, there are more men killed as compared to women. More men die due to accidents and diseases than women. The average life span of females is more than that of males, and at any given time one finds more widows in the world than widowers.
6. India has more male population than female due to female feticide and infanticide
India is one of the few countries, along with the other neighboring countries, in which the female population is less than the male population. The reason lies in the high rate of female infanticide in India, and the fact that more than one million female foetuses are aborted every year in this country, after they are identified as females. If this evil practice is stopped, then India too will have more females as compared to males.
7. World female population is more than male population
In the USA, women outnumber men by 7.8 million. New York alone has one million more females as compared to the number of males, and of the male population of New York one-third are gays i.e. sodomites. The U.S.A as a whole has more than twenty-five million gays. This means that these people do not wish to marry women. Great Britain has four million more females as compared to males. Germany has five million more females as compared to males. Russia has nine million more females than males. God alone knows how many million more females there are in the whole world as compared to males.
8. Restricting each and every man to have only one wife is not practical
Even if every man got married to one woman, there would still be more than thirty million females in U.S.A who would not be able to get husbands (considering that America has twenty five million gays). There would be more than four million females in Great Britain, 5 million females in Germany and nine million females in Russia alone who would not be able to find a husband.
Suppose my sister happens to be one of the unmarried women living in USA, or suppose your sister happens to be one of the unmarried women in USA. The only two options remaining for her are that she either marries a man who already has a wife or becomes public property. There is no other option. All those who are modest will opt for the first.
In Western society, it is common for a man to have mistresses and/or multiple extra-marital affairs, in which case, the woman leads a disgraceful, unprotected life. The same society, however, cannot accept a man having more than one wife, in which women retain their honorable, dignified position in society and lead a protected life.
Thus the only two options before a woman who cannot find a husband is to marry a married man or to become public property. Islam prefers giving women the honorable position by permitting the first option and disallowing the second.
There are several other reasons, why Islam has permitted limited polygamy, but it is mainly to protect the modesty of women. In Islam its not necessary to have more than one wife or you get more rewards if u have more wife. But Rather ISlam regulated Polygamy and a muslim can marry more then only one wife if he can be just in all the affairs and activities of life irrespect to the wives.
We pray because we are ordered; we fast because we are ordered; we convey Islam to non-muslims (dawa) because we are ordered.
We make extra prayer because it is recommended; we use Miswak becuase it is recommended etc
We may prefer to take more than 1 wife because it is permitted or we prefer to exercise 5 times a week because it is permitted;
we might divorce even though this is disliked; or grow our nails even though this is disliked
We avoid certain foods because they are forbidden; we do not disrepect our parents because it is forbidden or partake in intimate relations with the opposite sex outside marriage because it is forbidden.
These are all rules in Islam just like the taking of more than 1 wife.
It is not a rational discussion; we just need to understand the rules and implement them accordingly.
sorry man! still am not convinced. marriage should be to a one woman forever, for the good and for the bad. Only one woman! u feel the load of saying YES.
it's not two different things, it's two different status:
1- if you can be just with polygamy and you (or your community) need to have more than one wife, it's allowed for you (maximum 4) but only if you can be just & fair.
2- if you cannot be just with more than a wife: it's not allowed to marry more than on wife.
* PLease have a more comprihensive look at Islam before thinking that's it's unjust... you'll realise how Islam considered the high level for women
Regards
Our prophet Mohammed (peace be upon him) did not have 22 women in his lives.. He had just 11 wives.. No mistresses or slaves or whatever..
Secondly, I don't agree that all single women are public properties.. I am a 34 year old single, Muslim, Pakistani woman staying with my parents.. None has ever tried to treat me like a public property.. I lead a respectable and honorable life..
did i miss this recent news
Worst part of permitted polygamy is when father gets a proposal for marriage for his son but he decides that this girl will be more suited to himself.
There was one true incident recently where father rapes his daughter-in-law and the court decides that son should start calling his wife mother.
in the first page of this thread i wanted to know the source of this message, I had a doubt if this is speech of Dr. Naik? finally I found out indeed these are words of him
Lets make it very clear "We do not debate with Ayah's or authentic Hadith, those who deny are disbelievers.
Dr. Naik gave wrong example calling women as public property. I have attended his Peace Conference in Mumbai in 2007.This year 2009 I will be there insha allah with
this question
You have got a real problem in arguments. Can't u just sit some nice day and read only :)
Saif: I know what you are trying to say and is right, but these people won't understand. They are here to create their own Islam.
We have a saying at Portugal about this: Asking never ofends :)
Only God Can Judge Me
الله فقط يمكنه محاكمتي
I am you and you are me, if you love i love, if you suffer i suffer
أنا أنت, و أنت أنا, إذا أحببت نفسك أحببت نفسي, إذا عانيتَ عانيتُ
Only through such forums/discussions, we muslims could clarify our stand and clear misunderstandings.
i AGREE WITH pm, JUST BECAUSE WE ARE MUSLIM DOESN'T MEAN WE CAN'T DISCUSS MATTERS ON A CIVILIZED WAY, sorry caps :)
Only God Can Judge Me
الله فقط يمكنه محاكمتي
I am you and you are me, if you love i love, if you suffer i suffer
أنا أنت, و أنت أنا, إذا أحببت نفسك أحببت نفسي, إذا عانيتَ عانيتُ
i request all of you to just shut up and see the videos that i sent and i hope they have the answers. please do not blame each other. more questions will lead to false arguments. which shouldn't be the way for the muslims to deal with and also the other people.
may Allah give us all the hidaya.
words and clarifications; so I can conclude that there are a very few numbers or small % of muslims, who opts for second marriages.
While Islam has given the options to both men and women to stay in a marriage as long as they are happy otherwise divorce or take KHULA as the case may be.
Practising polygamy only when there is a real necessity (as conditions applied), one is to understand why Prophet Mohammed (peace be upon him) didn't marry till his first wife Hazrat Khadija (ra) passed away and Why He stopped Hazrat Ali (RA) not to marry again till Bibi Fatima (ra) was alive. This shows that one is required to provide due honor and great respect to His First wife and re-marry only when there is a real need or under severe circumstances.
This should make it crystal clear in the mind of all that Islam is a complete religion, where there is no oppression on anybody, especially females. In short Islam has provided females with more respect and honor in the Islamic society vis-a-vis to other religions / communities.
Allah know the Best and HE may lead us to the straight path.
Do the courts support this honouring though, and when the man dies does the wife get all the money house etc? When there is a divorce the women also get half?
This is corect even I have read is versus in Holy Quran
some people nderstand but just want to create confusion in the mind of the peoplethey blame islam , Islam is complete corect way of life but few follows and enjoy the blessings of Allah
Yes, but not in the context you mentioned penny. you asked "Do you honestly think that all the women Muslim men marry are virgins?" What does this have to do with my use of the word virgin?
VB, just do your research as to how Prophet's wifes coped with such situation. For me I think polygamy was a norm in those times and hence there was no emotional breakdown attached with such a situation. Nowadays, however, it is not the norm and women(first wifes) feel deprived of everything the moment other woman enters her man's life. It is obvious that what was norm then can not be restored now as the same Islam doesn't remain anymore.
Islam's stand on polygamy is clear. Now its upto followers to live with their choice.
As PM observed above there is only limited polygamy practiced now. When believers themselves are not happy practicing it why others go on to abuse the faith.
"In this day and age I think polygyny is sought out by selfish men who are often unhappy in their marriages but don't want to make the effort to work out their problems or don't want to divorce because of the social and family pressures. "
I am glad that you atleast understood muslim men go for polygamy for a reason..
Then, PM you see divorce more practical than second wife in this case? Why cann't it be that the man is struggling to save the honor of his wife? Otherwise is divorce so hard for men these days?
PM,
"Having your husband take a 2nd wife is about the greatest dishonor you can do a woman..."
This is what is not expected from a muslim woman and the reason for my participation in this discussion. Don't ever think that those women in polygamous relationship are dishonored which is an insult to those who by choice are in such a relationship. For example, middle eastern women consider it a God given right to men to have more wives. They treat such women with equal honor. There are instances where these wifes live together in the same premise by choice. And there are instances where a younger wife nurses the ailing elder wife in bed. It is her choice, perhaps driven by faith....
No doubt about polygamy, which is permitted and legal in Islam, with great respect to Shria'a.
How one could manage with First Wife's emotional breakdown/dilemma, possesiveness, children's attitude, long-term relationship through thick and thin, etc, etc....
It doesn't open a long series of problems/issues..
yes at one point you did. I think it was along the lines of us women staying virgins for life and why can't we do that after marriage again (can't remember the exact words). I don't know if copying and pasting is allowed or I would have done so.
I still stand by my thoughts, that if ALL are ok with agreement then who are we to alter tradition?
I don't know enough about Islam to argue that side of the debate as to who in Quran did or did not have a number of wives.
Is it pertinent in todays world. I don't know and to be honest it is none of my business. I feel very sorry for any woman that is forced into such an arrangement.
And without wishing to fan the flames of yet another debate, I feel just as sorry for women are forced to be a 2nd, 3rd, 4th wife when they dont want to be as those that are forced into an arranged mariage.
My thoughts are my own, but I doubt my Mum would agree with some of them.
polygamy is not my interest lol... Wonder why my legs been pulled up above??
Denet: I understood the bible story just didn't fix the names, yes it was Lot.
Only God Can Judge Me
الله فقط يمكنه محاكمتي
I am you and you are me, if you love i love, if you suffer i suffer
أنا أنت, و أنت أنا, إذا أحببت نفسك أحببت نفسي, إذا عانيتَ عانيتُ
pennypitstop, I couldn't get your point please..
I think I am not discussing virgins. am I?
"In Western society, it is common for a man to have mistresses and/or multiple extra-marital affairs, in which case, the woman leads a disgraceful, unprotected life." Defenitely unheard of in 'eastern' and 'middle-eastern' societies"
Seriously go to bahrain ANY weekend, qataris, dubai, saudis, all come and its not for the new city centre :P
So do the women get equal property rights, ie when man dies wives get same amount each? Can someone clarify what happens when husband dies - does wife get all money, property etc?
ROFLing, Gypsy Racist HAHAHAHAHAA.
Crazy fish, what you can't link polygamy to zionism?
Why is polygamy allowed and bigamy not?
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HE WHO DARES WINS
Voice of reason :)
Polygamy is having more than one wife or husband (The Concise Oxford Dictionary). If one can afford physicaly, financialy & mentaly to the satisfaction of all then why not.
How one could manage with the first wife's emotional breakdown, her possesiveness, children's attitude, etc, etc....it open series of problems/issues
Gypsy_racist what ever you efecking ID is and what ever your disguise you are in..
If you cant take the heat get of the kitchen , rather than making rediculious/cowardly little comments about other QLers..
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HE WHO DARES WINS
Gypsy!!! Public Property
sometimes silent is the best answer..
'see this video you will understand why:
By Dr.Zakir Naik
By Dr. Zakir Naik
By Dr. Ahmed Deedat
&feature=related
watch this video about covering you body and wearing a veil
uhmm platao, i am not telling you to stop talking about... i am merely asking you, that's why i said please! And the fact that youre not really sure who it was that you speak of proves my point...
Again, its all about Respect! But if you dont get that, i wont argue anymore...
islam is not at all unjust to women.polygamy is in da favour of those widows and orphan girls who have nobody to look after dem,derez nobody behind dem.such women,like others also have da right to live dere life happily,n so to gve dem a better life,men have been granted wid dis gift
You misunderstood PM. I was the one mistaken about Noah having daughters when in fact he had sons, hence oops. =)
But I still think he was talking about Abraham. (something to do with the infertility statement).
Anyhow, have a good night.
sorry, Noah had three sons not daughters. ooops! =)
Why do you think that any woman would want 'seconds' from you men? Do they not deserve a 'virgin' also?
Why should it be that men can sow their seed and women can't?
Is it because we can get pregnant and you can't?
In 2009 we can control that.
So the tide is changing, even over here.
Do you honestly think that all the women Muslim men marry are virgins?
I very much doubt it.
My thoughts are my own, but I doubt my Mum would agree with some of them.
'you'll find several references to poligamy, even better, they refer how a poor old guy had sex with his daughters and a younger maid, because "God couldn't make his old wife to be fertile".'
PM Noah did not have sexual relationship with his daughters and neither with a servant, he had none (servants) and his daughters were married. On the other hand, Abraham did sleep with his wife's maidservant at the suggestion of his wife, because his wife thought of herself as infertile, but in the end God gave them a son despite their old age.
Penny, as for the Bible, the New testament can be applied to the present age. And even some of the old testament books (proverbs to name a few).
PM, how come you took it personally? Its not meant to be so. It was just to make a point.
Anyway, I too understand that you cann't debate further.
Good night!
Polygamy is NOT practiced by overwhelming majority of Muslims. Only here in GCC you see all these Oil & Gas Sheiks with tons of women and piles of gold and way too many poorly raised children..... These people are living abnormal lives and Hollywood sterotypical...
Of course it is also practiced by some extremely backward country boys who are living in tribal areas in some countries with no education at all.
Thanks PM.
Denet: Who are you to tell me to stop talking about the bible or any other religious book?
I can't really say who did this but it wasn't Abraham or Noah, i'll give a look and later will post it here.
Only God Can Judge Me
الله فقط يمكنه محاكمتي
I am you and you are me, if you love i love, if you suffer i suffer
أنا أنت, و أنت أنا, إذا أحببت نفسك أحببت نفسي, إذا عانيتَ عانيتُ
The offensive idiot who created this thread is an idiot who intentionally offended Christians and Western people and accused Western women of being "public Property"
Shame on this idiot!
Magic Dragon is using Offensive Language and stupid tired old accusation against Prophet Muhammad that he was a womanizer even though all women he married except one were for specific reason and in those days Polygamy was practiced worldwide and actually it was unlimited until Islam created the limit of 4.
Shame on MD!
PM going polygamous or not is something personal and depends but unlike you I cann't hate polygamy and belittle the honor of those great women of Islamic history who were in such relationships.
When you women can remain virgins for lifes then why cann't you remain so after your man gets second? You may actually be doing some good..
if we can, Koran or Bible. Those books as great; they are for a benchmark for lots of people.
Do they however, really reflect where we are in the 21st Century?
We have our own ideas about these great 'books' and the 'Prophets etc, but we are 2009, do they stand a chance in this society today?
My thoughts are my own, but I doubt my Mum would agree with some of them.
PM,
"...his marital relationships helped to forge alliances and establish the ummah. ..."
PM, that is only your wishful thinking, doesn't follow from Islam. The admonition you are talking about has a different face. Just put that verse back and I will give you proper explanation. Polygamy has been there in Islam and will remain for the benifit of women if they understand. If they don't understand that let them not give in to men. No man is marrying second forcefully and he shouldn't...
Correct me if Im wrong, but the one I think you're referring to is Abraham right?He slept with his wife's servant at the insistence of his wife in order to have a child. And no he did not sleep with his daughters, because he had no children at that time!I dont think your living up to your QL name platao!=p
And please stop referring to the Bible, ( or any other 'holy' book) unless you totally understand its context!!!
Btw, isnt Abraham mentioned in Islam also, but just with a different name? I dont really know,but some muslim friends of mine told me so, unless I misunderstood. (No offense intended)
And one more thing, the Old testament takes into account circumstantial events that happened in the past thousands of years ago, when pillaging cities, and other barbaric trends such as slavery were actually practiced!
Monogamy was only encouraged during the New testament as opposed to the old testament where polygamy is acceptable mainly for the purpose of procreation because at that (Abraham's)period the population was so scarce that the land within your eyesight is considered to be your own.
there is anything wrong with it. If all are happy and KNEW exactly what they were getting into to, who are we to judge?
However, if young girls or vulnerable women are duped that is a different story.
In England we have a Earl (I think) who has 'wifelets', he has not married any of them but they are happy with what goes on.
Lets just say, we all see things in a different way and we all have different traditions.
What an enlightning thread! Before reading this I thought all Arab men with less than 3 wives are "khalli balli!"
How wrong I was!
I think he means, well I hope he does, that sometimes a womans hymen may be broken due to accident etc. Therefore maybe he thinks that means she is no longer a virgin.
Where we recognise, sexual intercourse has to have taken place.
how can a human being be considered "public property"?
this is a four-dimensional forum....
Then PM having pronounced this aayah with his lips the Prophet(May Allah have mercy on his Ummah) went on to marry more!
Ok, lets talk a litle bite regarding poligamy. I used to go to a peace communitty where it was very common to exist poligamic relations, but it worked both sides, if a man wanted to have more than 1 woman, than his wife could have more than 1 husband.
About Bible, i advise you all to read the Old testament, you'll find several references to poligamy, even better, they refer how a poor old guy had sex with his daughters and a younger maid, because "God couldn't make his old wife to be fertile".
PM: GO! PM GO! ;)
Only God Can Judge Me
الله فقط يمكنه محاكمتي
I am you and you are me, if you love i love, if you suffer i suffer
أنا أنت, و أنت أنا, إذا أحببت نفسك أحببت نفسي, إذا عانيتَ عانيتُ
well, gypsy those words are uncalled for. In fact this article is poorly written just in love of one's faith. There are many ignorants out there.
For the other part I think there are different views by different women in different regions on this. Your view and a dependant woman's views may differ. You need to ask those women who chose to be second to know that.
do parents display their daughters in Musuem? are there markets for single girls, is there any auction? common MCP answer me
Why? So blablabla do you think unmarried women are "public property" and that it's better to be a second wife then single?
Then just ignore. leave it for those who hate.
Two sides to every story... it depends how it get interpreted.
But prefer if we can keep religion out of this. So there wannt be any racism in QL. PLZ!!!
I didn't say I hate polygamy.
Obviously those in polygamy. Otherwise why hate polygamy?
Who do I think is oppressed?
Gypsy, perseption on marriage, family and raising kids is different among different women. All women have their own comfort zones. Then why think they are oppressed when they happily choose..
Actaully blablabla I could be very happy with one man, just not with marriage.
You are right penny. Guys just don't jump onto making fun of everything. You could be hurting people for your own pleasure.
For ex. some Qler is not willing to marry because she is not satisfied with one man, but such a life style is condemned in muslim culture.
I don't think it is up to me to comment on if it is fair or square. This is their tradition, it may be wrong in some eyes.
However, we 'Westerners' took insult to what he said about our (supposed) chosen lifestyle.
Perhaps we too could border on being insulting if we don't just respect that is the way of some people.
"IF a man takes up to 4 wives and he looks after them very well and the women are all happy and accept it, then that is up to them. I would hate it but then I am not in their mindset of tradition"
Do you honestly believe it's fair and square?
"dgoodrebel will always be the rebellious good one"
well not all four can be equally charming. So no justice possible and hence no polygomy men. get it right.
Interesting topic.
First all of all; not all Nuns and Priests are virgins. I have known Nuns and Priests who have been married, become widowed and then taken the cloth.
At one time Priests were allowed to be married. I don't know which Pope it was; some google head may tell us, but he stopped Priests getting married as obviously any money the Priest had would go to his family and not into the Vaticans greedy pockets.
Certainly in Christianity it is frowned upon if (a) one has an affair (b) gets divorced.
Our marriage vows state 'until death do us part'.
A very long time ago as the lady who gave us the historical slant said, men all over the world, for many reasons were allowed to take other wives. In those days it was even considered OK to marry a very young girl (by todays reckoning) as life spans were so short and a woman in her mid 20's was considered old.
It seems to me that in Islam, they are very steeped in tradition and perhaps they will reamain that way for some time to come.
IF a man takes up to 4 wives and he looks after them very well and the women are all happy and accept it, then that is up to them. I would hate it but then I am not in their mindset of tradition.
on the other way around,im wondrin'how would a man feel if his wife married 1,2 or more men other than him...(sick)
One man cannot represent a religion or any institution for that matter. After all, he is only a man (or woman). And as we all know man (or woman =)) is weak and fallible. unless of course your not a man (or woman)!?! LOL
"In earlier times, Christian men were permitted as many wives as they wished, since the Bible puts no restriction on the number of wives. It was only a few centuries ago that the Church restricted the number of wives to one."
Bullsh*t! Only a few centuries? During the time of Jesus, monogamy is already in placed which make it more than 2000 years already.
http://www.buhayqatar.com
mo lang!
I lived in Utah for a few years. Polygamy was outlawed by the Mormons over 100 years ago. Anyone practicing it is automatically excommunicated. Yes there are still a few people out there who practice it, but they are about as Mormon as you.
aha...he wasn't a polygamist though although he was an adulterer......and a paedophile if you class sleeping with a 12 year old when he was in his 40's......
I still can't understand why King Henry married seven times?
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HE WHO DARES WINS
Yeah, I did wonder about the Bible....I'm sure there was no mention of it being acceptable to have more than one wife!
In the bible, the word wife is mentioned in singular form, and a married man or woman can only marry again if he or she is widowed. Nothing was ever mentioned that enables anyone to have more than one wife, at least in the new testament. Reconciliation for a husband and wife and celibacy were also encouraged (not forced) to live a life of service for the Lord. Almost all Christians base their faith on the new testament btw.
Please refrain from mentioning any religious book, if you do not fully understand ( emphasis on understand, not just having read or heard of) the full context of it.
It's all about respect!
May you live forever... =)
LooL UkEng ......
they are called Private property goin alone on private places ...:)
If women are Public property then what do you call man with four wives and ligering around Ramada hotel looking for a quickie?
No I am not refering to BritExpat or Da..lol
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HE WHO DARES WINS
i just can't imagine my husband sleeping and having intimate relation with other women much more in the same roof...I'd rather divorce or leave him completely...
polygamy causes jealousy and a lot more...
Amen ummjake. I personally have no real desire to get married (beyond the pretty party) I guess that means I'm "public property"
In the immortal words of Groucho Marx, "Marriage is a wonderful institution...but who wants to live in an institution?"
Islam - your intension is clear , but you will soon reaslise you are on a rock trying to dig a well.
There is no other religion where men has many wives like in Islam. THey just use that first half of the statement regarding marriage. lol . I pity the women.
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Listen to Many..Speak to a few.
Islaam4u
'Public property' here its used instead of bad words, it mean is like mistressess, concubines, sometimes get used by lot of men, some are harrased,some even get morally deprived by mixing with other men etc..do dont misinterpret the word here.
Thanks
Im into blondes too miscat!
Without imagination their is nothing!
rofling!! man this guy is some piece of work! Women have NO other option but to marry a married man or become public proptery? hahhahaha
A funny thing the Book that says your only allowed to have one wife, but its still ok to have 2 or 3 or 4? and the other books that dont really say anything about this are not allowed to have more than one wife? why not :(
Dude Allah Created Adam and Eve, he didnt create Adam and Eve, Sunita, Sophie and Fatima and said go forth and multiply! Get a life
Good Fortune always comes knocking at your door...when you are sh*tting in the toilet!! :)
_[]~SMoKE~[]_
what a load of 100% CACA ,all of this is Caca especially QL
Without imagination their is nothing!
You are just one of those guys who tries to impose their ideas on others where as you never act on them.
that really not a proper to describe or explain or define like you are doing you are one %(&*^( piece of shit tryin to present something in a shitty way of yours. no you cant so you better stop and get back to your madrasa and get more and proper knowledge to how to introduce.
It would appear that it is defiantly a society where "what is good for the goose is good for the gander" does not apply.....
If everyone cared and nobody cried
If everyone loved and nobody lied
If everyone shared and swallowed their pride
Then we'd see the day when nobody died....Chad Kroeger
I now I am really turning this into something of a circus with my blatant hijacking but on a serious note the topic on debate, will never end.
If everyone cared and nobody cried
If everyone loved and nobody lied
If everyone shared and swallowed their pride
Then we'd see the day when nobody died....Chad Kroeger
I actually can't get over how blatent Arabic (especially Muslim Arabic men) are about their mistresses and girlfriends.
That's good because I I have had this thing for Spike, for like ages and there is something about the massive age difference and the fact that he is a Billy Idol wanna be that I just can't shake and knowing his into blondes I thought I might go there and try my luck...:P
If everyone cared and nobody cried
If everyone loved and nobody lied
If everyone shared and swallowed their pride
Then we'd see the day when nobody died....Chad Kroeger
ROFLing, no MisCat, that's true.
Islaam4u - yet again, another 'thought provoking' (some might say s**t stirring) topic.
FYI, there are many women who die as virgins - contrary to what you seem to believe, we're not all sex-obsessed wanton hussies. In my opinion, it's more natural and not such a big deal for women to be celibate than men.
And how did you work out that a female child has more immunity than a male child???? Back that up with medical facts if you can, coz it's simply not true.
As for women becoming 'public property' - I've never heard anything so ludicrous or insulting.
Four million more women than men in UK - again total rubbish. UK population is approx 60 million, and there is roughly 1% more female babies than male babies born, so by my reckoning, that's 600 000 - just over half a million. Bit of a difference.
'In Western society it is far more common for a man to have affairs or mistresses' - again, simply not true. I've lived in the west for most of my life, and I can assure you, I've been propositioned WAAAAY more times by guys here in Qatar. Minding my own business sitting in my car at traffic lights, guys in cars trying to give me their phone number, sitting in coffee shops, followed home from the supermarket, when out walking dogs, been tailed by landcruiser, etc, etc. It's virtually an everyday occurence here.
And my (admittedly limited) understanding of your prophet's life is that he married his first very wealthy older wife Khadija when he was a poor young man. It was not until she died, that he married all the other ones. Hmmmmm - maybe she was a strong independent woman and would have given him hell at the very suggestion that he get another woman, and he would have again been a penniliess homeless man??!!!!! Just a thought.........
OK - you can shoot me down in flames now
is that there is no such place as Sunnydale thats been built on a Hell mouth and is protected by a very cute blonde named Buffy?? and all this time I thought I was watching Documentaries about American culture....
If everyone cared and nobody cried
If everyone loved and nobody lied
If everyone shared and swallowed their pride
Then we'd see the day when nobody died....Chad Kroeger
LOL. Well Mis-Cat I'm sure that is a case with a minority of Mormon polygamous families as it is with a minority of Islamic polygamous families.
haven't you watched "Big Love"....it's all a bed of roses where all the women and children get along and are happy too play "one big Happy Family".....;P
If everyone cared and nobody cried
If everyone loved and nobody lied
If everyone shared and swallowed their pride
Then we'd see the day when nobody died....Chad Kroeger
beardless guys then they become public property how dare.
Dont they have mahrams to take care of them. For what reason sons inherit more than daughters, isnt that bcos they have to shoulder their sisters responsibility.
When we have our Mehrams how do we become public property
YOU BETTER ANSWER ME NOW
MY SISTERS/DAUGHTERS DONT LIVE IN GUTTER
Precisely MisCat. Polygamy is common amongst Mormons as well. Of course it's very abused there too. In these "God given rights" are just used as a way to abuse women.
but you bet me to it. It might also be helpful too know that this practice is not only limited to Islam.
I also don't have a problem with it for the same reasons as Gypsy, I do however have a problem with men who think that it should only be limited to men.
If everyone cared and nobody cried
If everyone loved and nobody lied
If everyone shared and swallowed their pride
Then we'd see the day when nobody died....Chad Kroeger
islaam4u..
quote"of the male population of New York one-third are gays i.e. sodomites." unquote
Can you tell us the source of this great statitics??
" Hatred is the coward's revenge for being intimidated"
....G.B. Shaw
Woohoo Tell him Eco!
Just a suggestion:
Maybe you should keep Islaam FOR you.
Polygamy was allowed by the Prophet in Islam (or so I've been led to understand by more intelligent people then Isaam4u) because there were a great deal of widows, and the brothers in laws etc, married them to take care of them, because at the time it was difficult for a women to take care of herself and her children (ie work, earn her own money, etc) and marriage was the only way to ensure that these women were taken care of.
And I honestly have nothing against polygamy now if every member of the relatioship, including the first wife, is willing (which is rarely the case).
Personally now I think polygamy has been perverted by some greedy men, who just want to keep "trading in" their wives for a new model and it's easier to keep up two then divorce one. Frankly I think there's no more honour in being a second wife then there is in being a mistress.
oh oh,it seems there is hypocrisy here...
http://www.buhayqatar.com
mo lang!
are you committed to raise all the sensitive threads at QL.....?
See this as well interesting topic on POLYGAMY
'Polygamy is secret to longevity'
21 Aug 2008, 0132 hrs IST,ANI
LONDON: Forget long walks and calorie-controlled diets, the sure shot way to live a longer life is: get a second wife.
That's the conclusion of a new research, which has suggested that men from polygamous cultures outlive those from monogamous ones.
After accounting for socioeconomic differences, men aged over 60 from 140 countries that practice polygamy to varying degrees lived on average 12% longer than men from 49 mostly monogamous nations, says Virpi Lummaa, an ecologist at the University of Sheffield, UK.
The latest research might solve a long-standing puzzle in human biology: Why do men live so long? This question only makes sense after asking the same for women, who - unlike nearly all other animals - live long past the menopause.
One answer seems to be a phenomenon called the grandmother effect. For every 10 years a woman survives past the menopause, she gains two additional grandchildren, Lummaa says.
It seems that doting on and spoiling grandchildren aids their survival, as well as furthering some of their grandmother's genes. Men, by contrast, can reproduce well into their 60s and even 70s and 80s, and most researchers assumed this explained their longevity.
But Lummaa and colleague Andy Russell wondered whether other factors explained the long lifespan of men, such as a grandfather effect. To test this possibility, the team analysed church-gathered records for 25,000 Finns from the 18th and 19th centuries.
But the grandfather effect was soon ruled out. Lummaa and Russell next wondered whether the constraints of human physiology explain male longevity. If female survival is the main explanation for male longevity, then monogamous and polygamous men would live for about the same length of time. Instead, it seems that fathering more kids with more wives leads to increased male longevity. Men, then, live long because they're fertile well into their grey years.
marry up to four, "public property", etc etc. Wow, nice words there Islam4u!
"dgoodrebel will always be the rebellious good one"
FALSE INFORMATION :)
Islaam4u
as if you knew anything about why polygamy used to be accept you would realize what a crock of S(*T your talking about.
In short in years gone by polygamy was used to ensure bloodline. It's why when you spout your so called facts the Rulers you mention come up as having more than one wife. People tend to forget that in bygone eras that it was once the duty of the ruler to lead their men in battle, in other words when their country went to war the rulers would be there in the thick of it and due to this there was always the probability that they could end up dead, saying this when there sons became of age it was also expected that they would too follow their fathers into battle. Now given this it was almost impossible to be assured (given the lack of any medical advances to ascertain sex of the baby before birth)that one women could keep giving birth to a male heir in case the king and his eldest sons were killed in battle, so it was common sense to have more than one wife as this increased the chances of more male heirs, this theory spilled over into the higher class citizen (the wealthier men of society) populations as well. It was also used to boost populations in some countries as one man can impregnate as many women as he can manage were a woman can only give birth at the rate of about one child per year, interestingly enough this was the theory behind the Vikings, by killing the men and raping the women of the lands they traveled too, they tried to ensure that they not only took a village and country by force but also by the breeding out of the existing male bloodlines and thus ensuring the survival of the viking bloodline and civilization.(unfortunately this came to an end for them when they reached the America's).
In short he reason why polygamy became so abhorrent to most societies as the need for it became less as the world to a point grew smaller and became more diplomatic in it's conflict resolution, by acquiring lands through marriages and alliances, rather than blood shed and that some of these new countries were not indifferent to be rules by a woman the need for more than one wife to conceive multiple male heirs became redundant. So polygamy as most knew it became a dirty word.
If everyone cared and nobody cried
If everyone loved and nobody lied
If everyone shared and swallowed their pride
Then we'd see the day when nobody died....Chad Kroeger
Muhammad’s 22 Women:
Muhammad’s 16 Wives:
1. Khadija
2. Sawda
3. Aesha
4. Omm Salama
5. Halsa
6. Zaynab (of Jahsh)
7. Jowayriyi
8. Omm Habiba
9. Safiya
10. Maymuna (of Hareth)
11. Fatema
12. Hend
13. Asma (of Saba)
14. Zaynab (of Khozayma)
15. Habla
16. Asma (of Noman)
Muhammad’s 2 concubines/slaves:
Mary (the Christian)
Rayhana
Muhammad’s 4 devoted followers who who "gave" themselves to satisfy Muhammad's sexual desires.
Omm Sharik
Maymuna
Zaynab (a third one)
Khawla
Lemme jus conclude it this way islaam4u: If your intention was to promote/portray Islam in a positive manner you are doing a very poor job of it. In fact you are going somewhere in the opposite direction.
Islaam4u
We didnt use women as public property , we said thats what the world is treating her And islam encourages to protect her. IT seems you are just arguing for the sake of arguing or do you have any enemity to ISlam. I respect u and i am sorry if i hurted u in any ways. Do not misinterpret and label words differently. Thanks n PEace and the arguement from my side ends here. :)
And you don't think that being a homewrecking second wife will "deprive her soul, degrade her body, dishonour her chastity." ?
Eco: So-called Islamic Scholars use terms for women like "public property" and then wonder why women are seen as being subjucated by Islam. Jeesh.
Islaam4u
I didnt mention Qatar in ma statistics, did I? And u are trying to say 8 countries are to be considered as majority when the rest of the countries of the world proves what i said is right?
gentleman! Are you?
"dgoodrebel will always be the rebellious good one"
Islaam4u
Come on dont take it so negatively. Its not that you will be a prostiute. ISlam encourages to protect the modesty, chastity of women rather she herself deceiving and getting into those things which will deprive her soul, degrade her body, dishonour her chastity.
Peace
I can read myself, islam. But for Qatar your statistics are wrong!
he used this term women are public property, Typical slum mentality
Ahh great again a WAR thread ......:(
Peace n Cheerz Everyone ...:(
Islaam4u
It says the same Qatar only one of 8 countries :)
“This makes Qatar one of only eight countries in the WHO survey of 194 countries with such a pattern, as the predominant global trend is for women to live longer than men,” Dr Hammoud explained.
I need to clarify what he means by this quote
The only two options remaining for her are that she either marries a man who already has a wife or becomes public property. There is no other option. All those who are modest will opt for the first.
UnQuote
I find it hilarious that if you don't marry your only other option is to be a prostitute. Um, I'm not married, not sure I will ever get married and I'm not a prostitute.
Rey Aurelio, if you want people to respect your religion don't refer to women as "property" and don't post it on a public forum.
Furthermore what has been said about the rules of Christianity is bullshit: marriage is a sacrileg. Even divorce is not allowed.
yourself understand. Are you generalizing that if women who don't get married become "public properties" as you understand it? You better stay away from all my unmarried sisters. I could imagine what they can do to you!
"dgoodrebel will always be the rebellious good one"
RESPECT RESPECT RESPECT..DON'T ARGUE WITH ANYONES' BELIEFS and RELIGIONS..........
WORLD PEACE!
At least for Qatar the statistics mentioned are wrong: Qatari women live three years less than the males.
http://www.gulf-times.com/site/topics/article.asp?cu_no=2&item_no=277556&version=1&template_id=36&parent_id=16
I know what you are referring to, and those women are not "public property" they are nobodies property but there own. If they choose to be mistresses, prostitutes, etc, that's their choice.
ISLAAM4U...Please explain your quote "And u can ask any doctor no woman can remain a virgin through out her life"... what evidence have you for this?
Nuns remain celebate throughout their lives, as do monks.
islam4u: I checked out the link, it doesnt support ur story. In fact what it says is, " In 2003, 32% of men and 25% of women above the age of 15 had never married"
(page 12 of http://www.census.gov/prod/2004pubs/p20-553.pdf) which means there are more unmarried men than women, considering that the percentage distribution is 51:49.
Also 23% of women between 30-34 were unmarried compared to 33% of men in the same age group.
So...there goes ur numbers!!
You spend a lot of time talking to nuns islaam4u? It is perfectly possible for someone to remain a virgin for their entire life. In fact it's not even that rare. And I would rather be a virgin my entire life then someones "property"
It takes a woman to destroy another woman "home"... Unless ur hubby or boyfriend turns out to be gay... well that's is totaly another story...
******************************************************
"An eye for an eye, and soon the whole world is blind." - Mahatma Gandhi
Nuns, you need to really sit with them and talk. I said it very clearly go and check with any doctor. Come on u r a women u knw very well. For the sake of arguement you wanna win over , FINE I LOOSE. but TRUTH PREVAILS. PEACE
http://www.bishop-accountability.org/news2004_07_12/2004_10_14_Makuni_DoNuns.htm
and search more info
Islaam4u
marry only one and in another verse, it permits to marry up to four? Is 1 = 2 = 3 = 4? And you want to accept it simultaneously?
And everybody is asking you and you should answer properly" What do you mean by "PUBLIC PROPERTY?"
"dgoodrebel will always be the rebellious good one"
I have seen the women's "rights" in Islam and they are far less then the rights I receive as an athiest, so you'll excuse me if I steer clear of religions that refer to me as public or private property.
You are being hypothetical, what if the sky fall down, what if we die now so lets go and lie down the grave now itself. This law is brought to us by The Almight God who knows His Creation better than us and HE alone knows the future. So tomorrow what happens if if if.. that you can ask when it happens.At present this is the case. ISlam is perfect and a religion , a way of life which can be implemented till the Day of resurrection for entire humanity.
Islaam4u
was exactly gonna tell that then I thought he may not know who a Nun is..lol
ROFL @ your ignorance...
Actaully there are women who remain virgins there entire life (think nuns). There are men who do to.
You have seen the things happening in the world but Islam never teaches to treat women as u say. You need to really see the womens rights in ISlam
Islaam4u
there would be no "public property" females. What if after all males marries 4 women and there still excess women, will they be entitled to find a man with already four wives already?
"dgoodrebel will always be the rebellious good one"
Islaam4u
You may view the US statistics here
http://www.census.gov/prod/www/abs/popula.html#pop
or
http://www.census.gov/prod/2003pubs/p20-544.pdf
And u can ask any doctor no woman can remain a virgin through out her life. God has created us like that. Not just sex any woman or man requires even companionship. You cant remain without being in touch with any men, you will be hunting down for friends who are guys and choose one or two among them as best friends to share all ur feelings, happiness and sadness. This is nature and how we created. What Islam teaches is to regulate these relations in a morale and correct way so that it doesnt affect the individual nor the society.
"dgoodrebel will always be the rebellious good one"
Ok seriously, you need to stop getting your statistics of the West from Soap Operas. Extra Marital affairs are not "common" or even socially acceptable in the West, There are such thing as LESBIANS as well, and the very idea of referring to a woman as public or private property is DISGUSTING.
I am nobodies property, I belong to me, and I am in charge of who I sleep with, who I talk to, where I go and what I do. If I choose to not marry, then that is my choice, if and when I choose to marry that is my choice and I will NOT be my husbands PROPERTY.
Also, whether you become a second wife or a mistress the bottom line is your a home wrecker, you will always be viewed as secondary and women (and many men) will look down on your for your desicion. So you're a whore if you do or a whore if you don't I guess.
"Thus the only two options before a woman who cannot find a husband is to marry a married man or to become public property. "
WTF do you mean by 'public property'? Ever heard about staying single? That too is an option, Mr.Einstein! Would you say the same about a single man?
and who told you ramayana or mahabharat are religious texts? They are epics that spun out of folklore and they are not religious guidelines or root texts, as far as my limited knowledge abt the whole thing goes.
Also could you quote the source for all that statistics that you have given? (I am not sure whether even the US govt knew the exact number of gays in NY).
"In Western society, it is common for a man to have mistresses and/or multiple extra-marital affairs, in which case, the woman leads a disgraceful, unprotected life." Defenitely unheard of in 'eastern' and 'middle-eastern' societies, yeah? riiiight!
The author, whoever it is, is talking as if all the 'excess' women are commodities that HAVE TO be shared among the men...what a load of bull to start the day!
I think the guidance is clear. You are only allowed to marry more than one (up to four at any given time), if you can guarantee that you will treat them all equally and fairly.
If you cannot guarantee this, then you should stick with one.
TI significa el Islam ha puesto un límite para los que te hace justicia = ONE, y que puede ser máxima = CUATRO. Las otras escrituras que no puede encontrar límites aún no se puede encontrar que usted debe casarse con uno.
IF you read it completely you would be able to understand/ If you still cannot, i am sorry thats the best i can make u understand.
Peace
Islaam4u
I have been both in my time!
no, its not clarified, I'm still thinking its saying two different things....
Are you married or "public property" ?
Islaam4u
Sis, pls read it completely ... What Quran says is
"Marry women of your choice, two, or three, or four; but if ye fear that ye shall not be able to deal justly (with them),then only one ."
[Al-Qur’an 4:3]
IT means ISlam has put a limit for some who cant do justice ONE, and who can be just Maximum FOUR. The other scriptures you cannot find any limits even you cannot find that you should marry ONE.
Hope its clarified.
So the book says 'marry only one' but at the same time it says that Islam permits polygamy.......seems a bit confused to me!
Ofcourse the 'Ways of the dirty West' gets a mention....funnily enough....