BAD ELECTRICAL WIRING INSTALLATIONS KILLS

why bother to take the negativism when even positive things I earned here is already a treasure to me.

But you, you are a teacher so it means you will have many things that you can contribute.

And I feel you because I also taught for 4 years before (although college students) and occasionally, I do lectures back in our country for graduating engineering students. Don't worry, my lectures are not regarding electrical matters. It's more on what they expect on project site when they are deployed.

last comment, NOT FOR ME. For the other readers who pm me and tell me how they felt about distasteful comments. And I think some of them are your friends, precisely they use the pm.

Anyway, YOU ARE THE BEST! Happy now?

To each his own, you see it your way, I see it my way. I do my job, you do yours.

And the famous line that we are invited, that's true, I was. But I did my responsibility as stated in my contract, actually beyond my contract. I win some, lose some suggestions, what can I do, I am a visitor here, not even an executive of my company. I stick to my pay grade.

QL to me is an outlet how to help others. Gauging 1 to 10, even if I contribute 1/2, I am already happy about it. We don't get paid to advise here. Ours are little ideas that may give little impact.

Even if I look fool to others just to raise the goodness of others, fine with me. I have my set of friends here who often times disagree also with my views but we stick to each other because we know, QL is just QL, nothing more nothing less!

Didn't realise you were a civil engineer........is that why you asked me to explain in laymans terms!!!

Thought you'd gone.......pleased your back you cheer me up no end

are you happy now? Idiot!

More from the urban dictionary......highly recommended

1. Muppet

A person who defies explanation with regard to common sense and logic, exhubing an air of confidence that is mutually exclusive to that of their accomplishments or ability

Must be like sesame street in flors office

Good night GOOD guys!

Flor's gone......bring on the dancing girls and put the champagne on ice

What a nob

Flor you are a prize pillick!!!

effing topic!

Good evening Buddy!

flor1212

If you read what I said then you'll understand when I say, life's too short, me and you are done now, i'm not wasting any more time communicating with you.

Your free to say what you want but I'll not be joining in, on any off you comments.

ask them how to solve the problem you think is rampant here? That is how they try to picture the situation here? As if nothing is right here! But of course, they will answer you by making fun of me rather than discuss the issue. tell me Mick, have anyone discuss a solution to what you perceived wrong actions here?

talk to these people, go on, and maybe you'll learn something on the real world of Qatar. And I tell you, they are the haters of Qatar but what do you know, they stick their assess here! Why? Ask them!

old fagots! Next person there, anyone?

Hi Adey,

I take your point, well I have been as fair and as clear as I can with him, its his choice, and when he reads this I hope he counts to 10 before he responds.

If he keeps it up he will just isolate himself.

Mick

do you have anything against me? What have you contributed in this discussion? Just to try to mislead in your understanding of my comments?

HAve you contributed anything worthy about the topic? Problem with you people is you try to discredit the poster by going personal rather than deal with the comments! ANd you think you know all? Disprove my comments and tell your side! If you can't, shut up!

hahahaha....Flor is Smithers...bloody brillant!!!

you kept misunderstanding my comments.

I am not defending the unqualified works but what to do, leave the place. Do you think I don't know that? On my house itself, I could find something wrong but I try to correct it, what do you want me to do, hire my electricians, in whose account? The landlord will just give you a blank stare.

With all your posting, Buddy, what do you want?Do you want all the expats here to go to Kharamaa and what? Do you want all expats to petition to terminate all workers who act as electrician but are not actually electricians? Who to tell who is and who is not?

These people are just mere empolyees. If you are living in a condominium or a villa of your own and you have a problem with the electrical connections, what will you do, call the landlord and ask for repair, will you ask the guy or guys who will do the work if they are real electricians or just learned the trade thru experience? Would you know if they are or not?

LAkeland and Moza is saying what they see, so what's next? Let them go to Kharamaa and complain, right?

If ever you are hired here, say as supervisor, you can do your part, whatever s in your pay grade, but beyond that, you will realize that you're stuck to what you can do by yourself but to ask for more, you are inviting trouble.

All the two are saying are post Kharamaa inspected works meaning after the approval, maybe additional or improvements in a house.

Now as for your repeated question, who is them, the NOC of Qatar has a separate entity who handles the preparation works for 2022. They are now in the process of preparing to awards all the projects that will be for the WC2022. Who are they, of course the Qatari government appointed people. You want names? I'll try to get their website if ever they have a separate one. MAy I ask why are so interested about "them"? You want to contact them?

The longer you are on QL the sooner you will realise that flor is to Qatar what Smithers is to Mr Burns.

It does get nausiatingly predictable after awhile.

flor1212

You never answered my question about your wife's friend, when you used the word 'them'.

In the World Cup Bid you said she worked for them, I asked you who is 'them' were but you never addressed this.

I have had numerous messages, contacts and posts on different forums and facebook and there is overwhelming comments on the dangerous standards of Electrical Installations.

People continually reporting Electrical faults on New/Rented/Leased Residential Property that was carried out by the Property Developer and their Electrical Contractor.

Mozaismyhero and Lakeland to name just two you try to discredit them, why? They are just stating what they have seen and it falls inline with what many other people have voiced their concern about.

This is NOT racial or personal, like them and other I deal in facts, for some reason you are the ONLY person who does not want to recognised or admit their is a problem in Qatar with Residential Electrical Installations. Especially when the people carrying out the work are not qualified Electricians.

I told you about the Indian Teacher walking straight into an Electrician's job with no training, its not his fault, he just wants to work, its the Electrical Contractor who is employing him.

You say all Electrical Contractors are Licensed, if they employ unqualified people to carry out work what value is the license, it must be just for tax purposes, who polices their quality control.

People living in rented or leased property if their is an Electrical Fault the same person come to fix the Electrics that fixes all the other faults like plumbing, you can not keep trying to defend the indefensible, hard fact that speak for themselves.

A word to the wise, if you keep up this sort of attitude people will just ignore you, is that what you really want. There has to be balance and respect for people's views and finally give people the benefit of the doubt.

Not everyone has a hidden agenda, most people just say it as it is, they have nothing to gain to say other wise.

Mick

Electrical company.

The problem lies when the work is after the inspection of Kharamaa, say improvement works such as additional small structures inside the compound, or addtional outlets inside the kitchen or anywhere else. PArtitioning rooms etc etc. That is where the danger of overloading and fire is the worst outcome if unattended.

Hi Mozaismyhero,

Your right of course, the best analogy I can give you that sums up your point is taking a cars body work falling apart. You can do a very quick jobs filling all the holes and damage, by doing a good paint job covers up the true quality of the car.

Hence the saying 'Painting over the cracks'?

In any new building, once in its finished state you have no visual idea of the quality of workmanship that has done on underneath the surface.

In a previous comment made by Lakeland who has an Electrical background he spoke of short cables connected using connector blocks. Bare wires exposed and no proper tests and inspections carried out. This is indefensible, if lakeland has seen this in only one property, it proves there is no proper procedures in place because if there were this could never happen.

What lakeland witnessed is a damning indictment on the Qatari Authorities.No I am not an Qualified Engineer, Qualified Project Manager but I am a Qualified Electrician (tradesman) who is hands on not sitting in an office, looking at Architect Plans, Gantt Charts (project time table), Sitting in Meetings etc.

But I have Supervised other Electricians and Managed Million Pound Electrical Projects and tradespersons CAN NOT hide bad workmanship on an ongoing project from Supervisors/Forman/Project Managers/Quantity Surveyors/Engineers if their doing their job.

One can only assume these people are NOT doing their jobs and it is them that are guilty of bad workmanship not as in one case, an Indian Teacher came from the Airport in Qatar to be given a job working as an Electrician.

Which is in total Contravention of the 'Regulations for the Installation of Electrical Wiring, Electrical Equipment and Air Conditioning Equipment' as issued by The Qatar General Electricity & Water Corporation “KAHRAMAA” Customer Services Department, State of Qatar, based on British Standards, which states in Section 03: Requirements for Safety, page 11.

"All electrical installations works, new and or additions shall only carried out by licensed electrical contractors, as authorised by the Qatar General Electricity & Water Corporation KAHRAMAA'.

There is corruption, neglect and criminal violations at the very top of the Qatar Authorities, working its way down, which should be the focus not from the bottom up.

One reason why you will not see this standard of workmanship in countries outside of the ME is as a deliberate Violation of of any such standards would bring about a criminal investigation and prosecution.

Some may protest this does not happen but the evidence is over whelming of witnessing criminal electrical wiring and unqualified people carrying out Electrical Installations.

This is dangerous, life threatening and there will be fires and deaths until the Qatar Authorities start adhering to their own regulations.

Mick

lakeland, can you not answer the question? What is faulty electrical wiring and how will you explain it in "simple" terms?

Love the PLEB / NUMPTY definition, sums Flor up very nicely there.....well done Lakeland

I am staggered at the ignorance you display

flor1212 said answer the question, ...

explain faulty electrical wiring! ANd how do you explain it in layman's term?

or you just misunderstood it?

explain faulty electrical wiring! ANd how do you explain it in layman's term?

And if you comprehend my comments, they are simple explanation to Moza's comment! And you totally give it another meaning. In short, you did not comprehend my comment as intended.

flor see PLEB / NUMPTY discription

you are the expert, educate in layman's term!

Can you define faulty electrical wiring in a layman's term?

Hi Jimctu

Your 100% right of course but it seems to me there needs to be a change in mind set by those in charge in Qatar which unfortunately seems unlikely.

Regards,

Mick

hmmm...flor ... u can talk so much nonsense when you are not an expert on the subject...I dread to even think of, IF by mistake you claimed to be so!!

Just looked up PLEB in the dictionary, fascinating

1. PLEB

1)one who's inferior intelligence results in them making a complete numpty out of themselves in public

2)one who has had their brain replaced with a small cucumber whilst visiting the doctor for a routine check up

1. Numpty:

a) Someone who (sometimes unwittingly) by speech or action demonstrates a lack of knowledge or misconception of a particular subject or situation to the amusement of others.

flor the difference between you and i is that i know what those certain tests are called and how to conduct them

flor1212 said and BTW, I am not saying you need to demolish ...

so you can check. I said there are certain test you can do to know whether a wire was stripped inside the conduit or not! Do you even comprehend my post?

flor, i have neither the time or the inclination to explain as you plainly do not comprehend what I am refering to.

I can however offer my consulting services and attempt to educate you in the ways of elastic trickery but i fear the cheap company for which you work (your words not mine)will baulk at me fees

so you can check. I said there are certain test you can do to know whether a wire was stripped inside the conduit or not! Do you even comprehend my post?

you said bare wirings. Now if we are talking about exposed wiring (on the ceiling?), it was a long time practiced in residential areas a long time ago. But now everything is inside a conduit.

I will not argue with you lakeland as you are an expert, me as what I have encountered on site and as per walk-thru with the electrical people.

Moza was talking about faulty electrical wiring, tell me, what is considered faulty electrical wirings?

flor, just a few basic rules of thumb to disprove your theory of total demolition.

Ever looked above a ceiling, or inside a distribution board, or at a socket outlet supplying numerous extensions, or at site temporary supplies (have you checked the earth.....does it exist

Ever heard of a visual inspection (the title gives the game away), well its normally carried out where wiring / cabling is exposed and generally followed by cold wire checks to determine conductor integrity....especialy good for the hard to view places like embedded installations and such like, and particularly useful for avoiding total demolition to check wiring

Think you should keep quiet flor, what is left of your tattered reputation is fast disapearing down the toilet!!!!

electrical wiring!

so what did you see about the wiring?

faulty electrical wirings. How would you know? MAybe the tenant use an appliances that is not rated to the local standard? Or maybe abused a single socket and plug too many things?

Somebody I think LAkeland mentioned about bare wirings on ceilings, for sure it's not on buildings because everything is inside conduits and even if inside conduits and not visible to eyes, it can still be tested whether a wire was stripped or become bare, there is a test for it. And if it is bare, then it will not function cause the breaker will keep on tripping if two bare wire touch each other.

I've inspected buildings at various stages of construction so yes I have seen the wiring. The fact that most cannot seem to even put a plub on straight is a feature of most buildings here.

wiring works Moza? They can not be seen unless you break all the concrete and blocks and exposed the conduits and then you'll see the wirings inside

I don't work for the Statiscs bureau here and they would not release such info anywhere, but it seems everytime you open the paper there is a fire and the cause is electrical fault.

Plus I have seen myself such bad workmanship all over Qatar from residential buildings to commerical. Shocking standard.

and if you care to read my comments in other thread, you understand how the system work. So stop speculating and just sit tight.

Here is the paradox here in Qatar. Project Managers and Engineers like Flor always do a good job and bring their projects in under budget and ahead of schedule with safety coming first. So if this is the case who are the people that keep screwing up these jobs with poor workmanship and finishing. The number of fires due to electrical faults is shocking but everyone on here does a great job.

so many GOOD people here.

And for you, your best move is not to get employed but to start a business here. Find a local partner and start your own. As I said in some previous thread, your specialty is too common to other nationalities and getting you here as you are will be very expensive (as a tradesman) and unqualified for an engineer's job. Good luck!

I never supported or even implied that I support the death threat against Moza, I even called it uncalled for. It's an outburst of anger to a "joke" (you call it a joke?). Again, for record, I stand by my view that it was disrespectful of current events regarding fire. Now if you see it the other way, I respect that, but judging me in general, that's what I resent as you don't want also to be judged.

Now simple question, would you teach that to your students that if there's a fire, you can joke about it?

is important to point that this could be useful not only for electric professionals. Lots of other "simples" tasks performed by bad professionals could go terribly wrong.

Hi Raven

Thanks for your advice but do you know of any Electricians from US, UK, AUS, NZ, IRE, Europe etc working in Qatar.

I see your an Engineer, I have run high spec, high quality residential contracts valued at £One Million, 5 or 6 at at time including fire alarm systems, CCTV, Access Control, Intruder Alarms, Street and Security Lighting while supervising 20 Electricians.

I have the experience but my qualifications are not third level Engineer just Electrical Qualifications. I do have a BA (Hons) in Training and Education which is not going to be much good on site.

If you know of any Electricians maybe you could pass on their details or the details of the Contractor their working for so I could contact them direct.

Thanks,

Mick

Hi flor1212,

But they have or are in different professions, which makes a difference, Raven is an Engineer and Adey a Teacher.

I'd fall under the tradesman profession.

Regards,

Mick

Hi Flor1212,

In one of your threads you said,

"The whole 2022 is under one roof created to such but this does not mean that it is totally separated. I know because a close friend of my wife is working with them from the time Qatar is bidding until now."

Where you say "...close friend of my wife is working with them..."

Who is 'them', if you don't know, could your wife ask her friend?

Thanks,

Mick

Hi mozaismyhero,

Thanks for you comments,

"I cannot see them hiring western electricians or plumbers. Cheap and cheerful is the name of the game and the Asians are easier to exploit and control."

Its becoming very clear that's the way it is in Qatar.

Mick

Hi lakeland,

I had seen a similar document but no where near the same amount of detail.

Thanks for forwarding on the link, at a glance there are a few people going to make a tremendous amount of money out of a lot of people.

Anyone thinking about going to Qatar should read this document first.

I know when Qatar got the bid for the World Cup, there were a lot of complaints and allegations of corruption.

One thing that is becoming very clear Qatar Ministers and the establishment have totally different views on how things should be done compared to the west.

There is is definitely a lack of transparency, equality, human rights and no honour.

Thanks again,

Mick

Just taking a lead from your play-book. You know, the one where you continualy comment on moza's joke about abbyas on a thread about a fire in some souk. Did you mention the fire once in that thread? No. You just went after her trying to force her to apologise when she had nothing to apologise for; and you even 'understood' and gave tacit support to the death threats against her.

Did you contribute to the thread about the fire? Again, no.....so don't be a hypocrite and tell me to comment about 'electrical wiring'

"I find flor's posts are always a good ...

barometer of the truth.

On whatever flor topic pontificates on, you can bet your bottom dollar that the truth lies 180 degrees in the opposite direction."

This is what a good teacher said! BTW, Riyal is the currency here, not dollar! Lol!

Hi Lakeland,

Thanks for your reply.

Everything you say makes sense, if you look at a previous thread about a British Agency recruiting trades including sparks for Qatar.

Something does not add up here, there are too many conflicts, maybe this agency is bullshitting and maybe recruiting a few Brits but not as many as their making out.

This is why I wanted to find out for myself what work was available without going through or relying on an agency, after all there in it for themselves there not going to worry about individuals.

Never had to use an agency before and I don't intend to start now.

Thanks,

Mick

are you?

The topic is Electrical wiring, so unless you can contribute about it, your comments are of no worth here.

Create another thread, maybe about me so you do all the bashing there. Ok? Or do you need me to translate it to your language? Huh?

condition they are saying there. Anyway, it's your call.

'you are' and 'you are talking about yourself'

Are you reliving an arguement you had in the school playground when you were five?

All the information I wrote came from the British Agency that is recruiting qualified trades including Electricians for the World Cup Project in Qatar. They said this all up front so not to waste people's time putting applications in.

It would not make sense for them to make this up, why would they! They are carrying out the interviews on behalf of someone in Qatar as they already have sent Electricians to Qatar but I can not find out who the Agency is working on behalf off.

But they mage it clear it would be contracts, 6 months at a time and you would not leave your living accommodation inside a compound with all the other workers.

Regards,

Mick

This smacks of desperation.

You build a strawman so you can knock it down.

Of course this Headteacher readily confesses to you that she often goes to a psyciatric ward for alcoholism.....I do believe she took out a full page ad in the Gulf Times just to make sure no one was left in the dark.

Some people have trouble with alcohol, some with heroin, some with too much ice cream.......but it has nothing to do with nationality; so stop tying to conflate the two and suggest in your snide way that anyone who disagrees with you must be a drunk!

It shows your rather shallow thinking and why your opinions on this board have never carried any weight or significance.

BTW do you know the country with the highest percetage of heroin abusers? Give it a guess without googling.

who would not say that you are bullying me? Well I'm not surprised, teacher like you are good at it!

you are talking about yourself.

Aren't you favorite line, "don't talk about WC, you don't know about it". What you know about it, BOOZE and semi naked women?

you are. Check your comment, the post is about electrical wirings, are we not talking about construction matters here?

Are you lost Adey?

Life is good here Mickav, go through a reputable agency if you can....hopefully you don't meet many muppets like Flor once you arrive....Flor is the QL resident "know it all"...but really knows feck all.

I just made a general comment that covers all eventuallities. You're just a sounding board flor, and your track record speaks for itself.

I deleted the rest of this post as I listed the charecter traits that your online presence exhibits and I didn't want to appear to bully you.

The one trait I will mention I will pose as a question:

flor, why are you so scared?

that agency is BSitting you. You are all very much welcome here. Ask Raven and Adey? They are here, right?

(actually not just a teacher but how do you call it, Headmaster, whatever, female who is very respectable in school when I see HER, but you know, she visits the Hamad Psychiatric ward periodically because of ALCOHOLISM.

Now tell me, would you trust thousand of students , other teachers and employees to this person with alcoholism problem? Of course some (at least I know) of the teachers (either Brits or Aussie and one is New Zealander) have alcohol problem also.

But I think its normal to them so let it be. Let them be happy with their habit.

Hi Mandi,

Yes it just does not sound right, there is some hidden agenda as to why they would not want Irish, British etc to mix freely around Qatar.

I also heard that on your application, if they do not like your photograph your application is turned down regardless of your qualifications or experience.

If you ask too many questions you will also get turned down.

If you have any tattoos (which I have none) you will also be turned down.

And this is all done through an Agency who interviews you and they decide whether to recommend you or not.

I want to by pass this Agency and do my own homework, if I can.

Take Care,

Mick

YOU ARE! Why are you all out now? Bet the others will come out now, can't beat a Filipino?

no one to go one on one regarding construction? Adey, the teacher and dare to comment on a construction related matter? WOW, I'm impressed!

Oh dear Flor, you really are a sad little man!!!

your mind is set only on BOOZE and semi-naked women of the WC!

I have worked with a lot of your kind throughout my life and honestly speaking, you are just good in talking (of course, you are native english speakers) and everything stop there.

That's right Flor, we are all jealous of your obvious talents!!!

just like the others, just to comment against me? All with malice. You are just jealous guys, because you thought you have the monopoly of talent.

FYI, in Manila, there was a time that my former company did a joint venture with PArsons Int'l so we need to put Americans in our JV (about 8 americans and a lot of local guys there working wit Parsons). My project got two senior engineers (Americans) and two locals, senior mechanical and junior structural. I was 32 then, already working as PM. And you got it right, all of them worked under me. Aside from the other engineers who are in our original company.

Adey that is well observed!

barometer of the truth.

On whatever flor topic pontificates on, you can bet your bottom dollar that the truth lies 180 degrees in the opposite direction.

For this fact flor provides a sterling service here on QL.

that I allowed the change in the main electrical cable for one shop as the allocated cable was not sufficient to the load of electrical appliances and equipments as requested by the coffee shop tenant? Of course the leasing department correspondingly increase the rent of the space.

There's just no getting away from it flor

Touché raven

Lakeland, NZ passports look much nicer (Black with the silver fern down the side), just saying mate...LoL, but the Brit ones are not bad!!! Flor who made you the great big "know it all", if you are Project Managing sites here that explains the crap quality!

if a fire in China broke out, every two lives taken, the communist party will execute one corresponding communist party member who they feel is responsible for the fire (government official).

And BTW, Chinese are heavy smokers, but my mall project was cited by the local government of Shanghai for safety as I stopped smoking in the whole project. That's how I value my project.

Flor....British passports are good, they look really nice too.......not as nice as the big black ones of yesteryear though

The electrical wiring on buildings and homes here is probably illegal in India and the phillipinees but they do it anyway and no one says a thing. In europe you would probably get arrested for this sort of sub-standard work. I wouldn't listen to flor, as it would seem even if he had decent engineers working for him he spends most of his time on QL. I wish I could get a list of his projects he is working on in Qatar he thinks are great so I could stay away from them.

As the guy above mentioned I cannot see them hiring western electricians or plumbers. Cheap and cheerful is the name of the game and the Asians are easier to exploit and control.

Shanghai........shopping mall if I'm not mistaken........was a cheap fit out flor ha ha

You did not stop saying "many flors here (not qualified electrically), supervising elctrical engineers...". Too much malice lakeland. Do not compare my work with you, for sure we have different perspective. Those who knew me knows what have I accomplished here. And if you will know my project back home, and the one I finished in Shanghai, just hard to talk.

So please, don't go round the bush. You said it already, it's up there. If you think you're good, don't belittle others. That's precisely our difference, you think you are better because of what, passport or skin color or what? And then you'll get angry when a brown-skin like me speak up.

Mick, some idea of what Qatar is.......long report but very accurate

http://www.hrw.org/embargo/node/107841?signature=98030612146326550c609a5aaf964422&suid=6

Oh and by the way flor........villas like you do in TP, what's that all about??? Don't suppose there are any corners cut there then

Don't do cheap projects my friend...im far too expensive for some two bob outfit. the word mega before project should give some indication of cost

Many floors here.........flor you said yourself You have a basic knowledge of electrical installations, I am saying there are a lot like you here with only a basic knowledge of electrics. It's not really a thing you pick up from exposure........a qualification is essential.

I remember interviewing trades in India 6 years ago. Day one was mechanical and day two electrical. Test number one was to provide a tape measure and ask the applicant to accurately measure the table. More than half failed, but guess what.......they returned the following day for the electrical vacancy with a nice new electrical cv. Pure class.

maybe fit-outs? Interior fit-outs in malls?

Check your comment, "many flors here"? What do you mean? You're good? Don't spread rumours! That's bad.

No false rumours here flor, just telling it as it is

I won't waste my time getting into details with you, sounds as though your pretty content with your team and I wish you well in completing your project...............just remember to check above the ceilings!!!!!!

Mick, Ive personally not heard of a project with the conditions that you mention. The rail works have not started yet, though it will be huge once underway. Stadiums are a long way down the road but lusail city should start cranking up in the near future. The thing about Qatar mick is there is relatively nothing outside of Doha. There are a couple of stadiums planned in the north of the country and an aerospace city in the same area which is roughly an hour and a half from Doha. The main game up there is petrochemical based around the massive ras Laffan terminal but all westerners I know that work up there commute from Doha.

To be perfectly honest I'd be very surprised if any of the projects will utilise western tradesmen, they're just to expensive. Trades are usually from India, some Thai and various African countries with supervision generally being phillipine or Arab. To put it into perspective an Indian spark on the biggest job in the country will pull between 600 and 1000 riyal a month (100 to 180 quid!!!)

about that camp to project site site and vice versa thing. It will never happen here.

The whole 2022 is under one roof created to such but this does not mean that it is totally separated. I know because a close friend of my wife is working with them from the time Qatar is bidding until now.

The new airport have been there for a long time.

The new Rail transit is on the table again for some redesigning but last I heard is now on going awarding to 14 contractors or 14 segments (not sure 100 %).

With or without 2022, these two projects were already in-planned. For the 2022, mostly are the stadiums and the roads connecting these super structures. As for contractors and electrical subcontractors, have no specific ideas as I know they are still on finalizing the awarding of contracts.

Mick, that whole idea sounds dodgy at best. Not allowed to leave, no contact with the rest of Qatar, supervised bussing, not even a trip to the grocery. I'd run like hell if I were offered that opportunity.

Mandi

Do you have any information or knowledge of the project for hosting the world cup. It is supposed to be totally separate from the rest of Qatar.

New Airport, Rail Links, Stadiums, Accommodation etc?

Do you know the name of the project?

Do you know the name/contact details of the main contractor or electrical subcontractors?

I have heard they are using trades from the west on this project but they live in compounds on a six month contract.

They apparently are not allowed to leave the compound except to travel to work, where buses are provided to and from the compound.

If this was true, I would not like this as I would like my freedom to come and go as I pleased, meet new people and see Qatar.

Regarding Lakeland's comments, bare wire, block connectors, no tests and inspections is a very damming state of affairs, even if it was just one property.

Regards,

Mick

false rumours. Substantiate it by exposing these structures you are saying.

The Villaggio incident was very unfortunate but Mick, if you read my analysis in one of the threads, you'll understand the system here and that's where the problem is, not a simple faulty electrical wiring.

For the record, Lakeland. Those working under my team were seasoned Electrical CONSULTANTS and not electrical construction engineers. They are TWO distinct professionals. These senior Electrical Engineers is part of the Consultants team which I lead.

Hi Lakeland,

I'm British but living in Ireland at the moment and whose a economy is way down the toilet and will remain there for years to come.

I attended a jobs fair in Dublin a month ago and there were recruitment agencies pushing Qatar, stating Electricians earning €1200 per week, basic, working in and around the development for the world cup that would be totally/separate from Doha.

Stadiums, Rail Links, Airport and Accommodation. The Agency looking for trades said it would be 6 month contracts, living in compounds, with everything you needed but you could not leave the compound.

You would be bused to and from work and you would list your food that someone else would shop for. This Project is totally new and isolated from the rest of Qatar.

Therefore for your six month contract all you would see and experience of Qatar would be your work place and living accommodation inside the compound.

Are you familiar with this project or any Electricians working on it?

I thought Qatar would be good for work but with what I have read and particularly your reply I could never be involved with any of that kind of workmanship, I couldn't sleep at night's no matter what they paid.

I just don't know, especially with so many expats in Qatar that the media are not picking up on this more, especially after the nineteen people killed in fire at Qatar's Villagio Mall including Children.

I read in the Gulf News:

"The fire prompted a tweeting frenzy that caused widespread panic among Doha’s residents. However, the interior ministry said the fire had been controlled and shoppers evacuated."

"Firefighters and other security personnel are trying to clear the smoke and cool the place. Cooperate with the police and convey only the facts,"

"The Ministry Posted on its Facebook Account earlier in the day. "Everyone is Requested Not To Spread Rumors As It Will Create Panic Among People."

"Be responsible and cooperate with the security personnel"

In other words keep your opinions to yourself and your mouth shut.

Judging on your experience alone, just one property wired to those standards is a DEATH Trap.

Regards,

Mick

a Project Management team so you NO idea how the system go. I am the head of my team which composed of many disciplines. So either you straightened your facts before you even post anything!

You arrogance in insulting a fellow Qler is beyond!

I thought that might be the case but I thought it was worth a try.

Regards,

Mick

The sad thing here is that there are an awful lot of flors in qatar....not qualified electrically but supervising electrical engineers. Now, normally in circumstances like this the supervisor, who remember has only a basic understanding of electrical installations, simply repeats parrot fashion what his engineers have told him. When his engineers have not completed tests or inspections then they lie and say they have. The supervisor then repeats this and informs his client that all is ticketyboo.

Then once the job falls behind (and they allways do) someone picks up the phone and calls the cavalry in the form of western expats to pull the job through. They cost a lot more but guess what, they usually do it right first time. And what do they find when they scratch beneath the surface?? a multitude of non compliant installations, think bare wires above ceilings and behind walls, connector blocks used to join wiring that was too short, and an inept supervisor who can quote the code but wouldnt know a decent electrical installation if his life depended on it.

I`ve been in this electrical game for far too long and I can honestly say the standard in qatar is as bad as it gets. the labour here is 100% unskilled, they are limited to specific tasks and cannot fully complete a single one. Your welcome to qatar, I`m out of here for good this month.....its going to get a whole lot worse before it gets better, and mark my words, if you pay peanuts you get monkeys

reacting to something you even don't know. That posting about teacher turns electrician is somewhat related to recent tragic fire here.

Anyway, Mick, you're British so it means you are expensive. Some company maybe can afford you but not ours. We can get as good as you are in half or even less the price. Lol!

What was the "the Villaggio incident" I assume it was something very bad if people are paranoid.

By the way I do not blame the teacher from India he just wanted to work, its the the people above him are at fault.

So your over Electrical Engineers, so when do I get my job?

a teacher in his country turning into an electrician means it's the general thing here? Some people are getting "paranoid" after the Villaggio incident.

Consumers should be better informed and Kahramaa should play a role here by educating people but at the same time I admit the consumer needs to do there bit and educating themselves.

Electrical Supplies in countries differ, if you go on holiday for two week you would check to see if your electrical appliances were compatible.

Did yo read the following link http://qatarliving.com/node/3074316 it really does explain a lt, I am really stunned just how bad things are.

so they throw out all British electrical practitioner here. Who said there is none western electrical consultant here? You know nothing about Qatar!

Hi Damselindistress,

http://qatarliving.com/node/3074316

Yes this does explain everything, a teacher with no Electrical Training working as an Electrician and as you say to become a qualified Electrician takes years.

That is really really bad, I don't know what to say, no wonder there are no Western Trades working in Qatar.

This has taken away any idea of every coming to Qatar, even as a contracts manager I could not oversee such practices,

Any proper trades person could not live with themselves. Especially as far as Electricity is concerned. We are talking about people's lives.

Please contact me if you have any questions.

But please think of yourself and your family see someone, complain, this is completely wrong.

Qatar are in line for hosting the world cup I will bring this to the attention to the British Institute of Electrical Engineers and NICEIC. When Brish people are informed of these practices they will not go to Qatar.

Take Care of yourself.

Mick

bursting lamp bulb myself. Of course, I consulted my electrical engineers and sending them the lamp itself, do some rewiring, and that's it, problem solved. It seems that a lot of lamp being sold in the market does not conform with local system so the easily-busted bulb is prevalent. Also, some kitchen electrical appliances does not conform to the rating as installed so heating of the wire is also prevalent. It's good that too much fuse-presence on chords and electrical devices are common here so it's usually the fuse that gave before destroying the appliances.

of course they will be working under me as there are Mechanical engineers, piping, HVAC and irrigation engineers as well as architects, it all in the responsibilities.

I did not even said that I know electrical things perfectly but got some basic knowledge learning from experience and exposure.

A lot of good electrical engineers back home still needs to check Kahramaa regulations here because you know, each country has it's own electrical system.

I just don't know if Qatar have the same electrical system as UK, but what I know for sure is that it's right-hand drive in UK as left-hand drive in Qatar. Again nothing to do with Electrical thing! But what do you know? MAybe there is.

Hello kkforever,

Kahramaa are in charge of the supply of Electricity and Water Supplies, this is just the answer I am looking for, "Isn't there any inspection done before a electricity and water is connected to the house?".

It appears everyone is turning a blind eye and no one is taking responsibility.

I would contact Kahramaa if I were you first, there are major issues there with all those leaks.

Kahramaa as I have already mentioned will probably say there responsibility stops at the the supply to you home and everything inside is nothing to do with them. But them faults had to be there at the time of connection and no connection should have been made. Mention this to them, the more these things are brought to their attention, that should help future developments.

But back to you, if your renting your landlord should make things right express your concerns and worries, maybe you already have, what was his reaction.

If you own the property then it is the builder that should put things right. Are there no Independent authorised bodies that builder, landlords, electricians and plumbers have to be members, for the purpose of insurance.

Do you know who the main insurance companies are, they will not want to be insuring building that have defects it means they could be paying out more money than necessary on claims.

Let me know how you get on.

Kind regards,

Mick

Electrical Engineers work under you how arrogant are you so what are you trying to imply you know more about Electrics than them.

I have met many people like you, you sit and look at you time table have you meetings drink your tea but tell me how many buildings did you wire, test or electrically test and sign off?

A lamp is not an appliance?

Someone might bring a light fitting with a lamp attached but there not going to have a suitcase full of replacements. They will go to the local electrical store for a replacement lamp. Lamp fitting can run off off different voltages where as lamps can not. The only thing that can damage a lamp is a change in Voltage which takes us back to the supply.A drop in Voltage will dim the light an overload will burst the lamp.

What you would NOT know because your not an Electrician it is very easy to determine what the problem is with an Electrical Installation based on the circumstances and behaviour.

but as I said, unless you see the problem yourself, hard to speculate. You are not even here!

BTW, a lot of qualified electrical engineers are working under me.

Tell me, how many people do you think even look at the specs of an appliance/s they bought before plugging it?

Look up the meaning of Cynicism and Skepticism?

Are you a Qualified Electrical Engineer?

Who is going to bring different voltage lamps in to another country (bulbs grow in the garden)

Advising people no nothing about what a proper test and inspection initials are just points for people to look out for. Of course I know there is more to a proper Test and Inspection than the Kitchen or Bathroom.

I'm only advising people what they should be doing to protect themselves which was raised in other posts because I am qualified to do so.

Giving advice is not going to get me work in Qatar which is becoming more and more obvious is a dictatorship which you are probably used too. But here in the West that would never happen.

And as regard your comment about the more large expensive projects I know of two where the spec was drawn up to British Standards. At the eleventh hour the specs were changed so now everything comes from China.

even if the plan were done as it is, some equipments nowadays are beyond the specifications not limited to kitchen electrical appliances but tools and small equipments.

As for the melted stove mentioned above, did the poster mentioned the rating of the stove? Does it conformed to the rating as supplied by the line?

for bursting bulbs, were the lighting fixture conforms with the system here in Qatar? Were the bulbs fixed conforms with the electrical supply system of the country?

Hello Molten,

Are you saying that expats are too frightened to complain, are thing really that bad in Qatar.

Is it a question of freedom of speech or if you complain you'll be seen as a trouble maker and may be asked to leave the country?

Best wishes,

Mick

and FYI, electrical inspection here is strictly conformed. Based on designer's specs and calculations, all electrical connections are checked and double checked during installation (for big projects).. As I've said, for individual villa (low-budget), it depends on the owner.

Now as for you, I am not commenting on what I don't know but what you reveal about yourself. Isn't you are the one applying or asking for a position of electrician here or maybe head of an electrical company?

Your topic of electrical things are specifics for those who understand electricity. Now unless you see it yourself the problem being raised, please do not speculate.

Hello Moazaismyhero,

Is there no formal body people can go to for advice or to complain.

Your right it is a developing country, but its not poor so bad workmanship, poor build quality and no recognised standards are no excuse. They should start out as they mean to go on because when will the cycle be broken.

But I agree, your 100% right when you say its no excuse.

Kind regards,

Mick

Please do not make comments about me when you don't know me?

I will always help people and animals if they need it and do what I can. I will form my own opinion about people on there actions and when I meet them.

I don't bad mouth people.

Your Cynicism and Skepticism of my actions are your own sad beliefs, but keep them too yourself from know on.

I could express what I think of you but that be bring myself down to your level.

I'll leave that for others to form their opinion of you.

Hello Mandi,

When I suggested an Independent Electrical Installation Test and Inspection it was meant for the occupants to have done for their own piece of mind, not waiting for landlords to do it. They don't care or they would have made sure everything was correct in the first place.

From what I have read and you can correct me, Kahramaa are responsible for the supply and original connection of your Electricity Supply. At the time of connection either a certificate/form should have been sent to Kahramaa requesting a connection. I don't know where but at this point either the installer (Electrical Contractor/Developer) OR Kahramaa should have been in a position to state the property was fit for connection.

The other Alternative that doesn't bare thinking about, is that neither parties had tested and inspected the Electrical Installation? If this were the case this would account for all the problems to some degree.

Kahramaa are willing supplying properties with Electricity not fit for purpose.

What you describe, bulbs shattering is a supply problem, probably surges in Electricity. The pump is tripping the circuit breakers probably because the circuit it is on is over loaded. The fire from the door bell, can you see a transformer? Can you describe the fire? When you say the stove melted, can you describe in more detail.

Your right when you say the builder was responsible for all the wiring but either Kahramaa or the Landlord should be responsible for putting pressure on them to protect you by putting these things right.

What does you landlord say about all these problems? Do you tell him you are concerned, Electricity Kills?

If you contact Kahramaa do you not think they would be concerned about all the faults, they'll probably say there responsibility stops at the supply to the house, but mention the bulbs, that's a sign of a problem with the supply so ask them to investigate that.

Also ask is there a recognized body that oversees Electrical Contractors and ask them for a list of registered Electrical Contractors? If one exists!

Kind regards,

Mick

unless the villa is one unit and done directly under the supervision of the Owner.

But even high-end villa like we do in TP, is supervised and checked by consultants.

This should explain why (?)

http://qatarliving.com/node/3074316

Fully agree.

Even the quality of new residential construction is poor.

Leaks and similar problems can be spotted easily but electricity is something different.

My villa is one 1 year old and I have had the plumber in my house every 2nd week so far. In the mean time several walls some cracks. I have had two outlets that simply melted. The fire detection system did not work either.

Isn't there any inspection done before a electricity and water is connected to the house ?

Ultra Fearfulness, nothing less - nothing more !!!

It would be good if they worked to some standards here. Yes its a developing country but that can only be used as an excuse for so long.

but anything too much is harmful. The OP is on a promotional campaign to sell himself and hopefully find a job here. I just don't know if he is making a progress. But in case he landed a good job here, then it WORKS!

But it's not Kahrama that's in charge of wiring, it's my landlord. I still don't think he's going to go for/pay for an independent evaluation. He is rather fond of his contract workers even if they did set it up so that the water pump doesn't constantly trip the circuit breaker. The problem came with the construction company that built the house. Let's see, I hd a fire in my doorbell, and the chandelier in the front hall was never connected so the light switch doesn't run it on. The light bulbs last about a week and occasionally shatter all on their own. Oh, and the stove melted one day.

Mandi

Yes I can see how that may be a problem. The only consumer body I can see you could approach for advice is KAHRAMAA, but i don't know how how helpful they would be.

Are there no visibly Registered Electrical Contractors that have offices that you could walk into and discuss your concerns.

What about word of mouth, ideally you want a referral from an Electrical Engineer.

I was think of setting up an Electrical Contracting Business or working as a an Electrical Contracts Manager until I learned just how bad the construction work was and I don't want to be responsible for or have anything to do with bad workmanship which would reflect on me.

What I might do is set up a Consultancy, a Electrical Business where we would work within the British Institute of Electrical Engineers who outline the wiring regulations most countries adhere too.

If i generate enough interest and you have still not found any one I will come back to you with a view to organising an Independent Electrical InstallationTest and Inspection of your property. If we find anything wrong we will make it safe and if there are problems do you up a report that can be presented to KAHRAMAA on your behalf or you can do it.

Kind Regards,

Mick

where can we find a Qualified Electrician in Qatar to hire ?How shall I know that his papers are not fake ? It is not as simple as that . But I agree with the main message .