Birth Control : A Matter of MEANs or BELIEF?
By azilana7037 •
The Roman Catholic Church is saying that people should do the normal birth control methods. Abortion or any other artificial means of family control is against the teachings of GOD.
If more and more people are using artificial means of birth control,
- is it because the means are widely available?
Or
- is it because the Church has failed to bring out the message that it is wrong to use these methods?
What do you think?
They wouldn't proclaim celibacy in priesthood nor the nuns if it's the best way to 'promote' birth control...
"Everything in this book may be wrong." Illusions: The Adventures of The Reluctant Messiah by Richard Bach
Mine's a latte with decaf and a hint of cinammon :)
"dgoodrebel will always be the rebellious good one"
but we differ in where we stand...so let's keep it that way.
But this topic would be a nice head on discussion over one of QLSG's coffee meet up. what do you think?
on your positions of "choice". When you entered or accepted a religion, then you have to abide by its doctrine. Whatever they instruct, well-studied and well-explained to members, it's the duty of the members to follow.
If you will choose what you want and leave what you don't want, then the church failed in its function.
All religions (except ours) are like this. No expulsion, how can it be a true religion if the members could not even follow its basic doctrine? They can choose what they want and discard what they don't want? Serving God is following what He wants and not what we want. Its the same thing with Atheist and Deist, they just do what they want and not what God wants. They depend on their "perception" of what is right and what is wrong.
"dgoodrebel will always be the rebellious good one"
decipher it to your liking...baiting me to REACT to your POST.
HONESTLY, I don't THINK you're a CATHOLIC nor if you were raised as one. Or else you wouldn't be asking these questions. Am I right?
So, for your READING COMPREHENSION (gee...this is getting to be tiresome), what I am trying to say IS:
I LOVE MY FAITH, I QUESTION what I think/deem WRONG in what I see...example:
- the clergy vowed on CHASTITY... self explanatory
- the clergy vowed on POVERTY...
- and so on and so forth
Look around you, does the clergy still practice these? I hope you're not THAT BLIND?
My brother. I will not comment further on this topic..:)
bRITEXPAT
Sometimes my friend, I find it very awkward and duress, to accept your leadership and guidance on QL.
Lots of chivalries and contraptions from the Brits to be spoken loudly all the times.
So, we basically pick and choose bits that suit us and throw out the bits that are bothersome.
The Pope is the spritual leader of the Catholics. Surely, by accepting the faith, we also accept his leadership and his guidance.
Or am I simplifying it too much ?
should LEAD BY EXAMPLE.
How can they preach what they themselves don't practice what they teach?
Nowadays, members of the flock do not follow blindly, "we" question things that we deemed wrong.
I love my FAITH, but I won't be shackled by THE RELIGION when the teachers don't even comprehend what they teach.
the church failed ...
...Because many of its priests and bishops people have ceased to be leaders 'followers' by example. Many of them do not practice or understand what they preach believe.
"Everything in this book may be wrong." Illusions: The Adventures of The Reluctant Messiah by Richard Bach
how many kids did you drown my poor gypsy into the holy water of the sink...? be cursed for ever and ever child !!!Throw your semen into the rihgt sink and we should reconsider your behaviour..Bosnian serbs during the war was having posters -We will defeat you with our dicks...That was an a birth explosion do get the teritory wich they like ,for wich one they was very well prepared..Let God mastermind your semen ..poor gypsy
To your eyes, every sperm is sacred.
To your mind, Every sperm is great.
If a sperm is wasted, you will cry.
Gypsy gets quite stressful with every load of sperm lost!
You are more than welcome to come over and discuss sperms loads inside my Confession Booth.
Good old Monty...
So the Papa is right!
There are Jews in the world.
There are Buddhists.
There are Hindus and Mormons, and then
There are those that follow Mohammed, but
I've never been one of them.
I'm a Roman Catholic,
And have been since before I was born,
And the one thing they say about Catholics is:
They'll take you as soon as you're warm.
You don't have to be a six-footer.
You don't have to have a great brain.
You don't have to have any clothes on. You're
A Catholic the moment Dad came,
Because
Every sperm is sacred.
Every sperm is great.
If a sperm is wasted,
God gets quite irate.
Every sperm is sacred.
Every sperm is great.
If a sperm is wasted,
God gets quite irate.
Let the heathen spill theirs
On the dusty ground.
God shall make them pay for
Each sperm that can't be found.
Every sperm is wanted.
Every sperm is good.
Every sperm is needed
In your neighbourhood.
Hindu, Taoist, Mormon,
Spill theirs just anywhere,
But God loves those who treat their
Semen with more care.
Every sperm is sacred.
Every sperm is great.
If a sperm is wasted,
God gets quite irate.
Every sperm is sacred.
Every sperm is good.
Every sperm is needed
In your neighbourhood!
Every sperm is useful.
Every sperm is fine.
God needs everybody's.
Mine! And mine! And mine!
Let the Pagan spill theirs
O'er mountain, hill, and plain.
God shall strike them down for
Each sperm that's spilt in vain.
Every sperm is sacred.
Every sperm is good.
Every sperm is needed
In your neighbourhood.
Every sperm is sacred.
Every sperm is great.
If a sperm is wasted,
God gets quite iraaaaate!
Well, If youare talking about birth control within wedlock then I would say it should be couples choice because they are the ones who are responsible for everything that goes into giving birth and raising the kids. It cabe a financial problem or health problem,etc..that can prompt birth control..
Azilana, you said illicit affairs, out of wedlock, church and government etc etc.. my post was in response to that not birth control..
Merry Christamass anyway..
You have hit the nail on the head. Religion provides a framework and guidelines". We as followers "chose" whether to follow the guidelines / edicts fully or as we please. We can make all types of logical excuses as to why not etc, but at the end of the day, the choice is ours.
at least you understood what I am trying to discuss here. Some folks do think otherwise or try to be make a wisecrack out of this.
But then again, don't get me wrong. I'm a Catholic and still go to church to hear mass, pray my rosary and try to be a good person...but it doesn't mean I'm a member of the flock who follows everything my faith/church says blindly.
I'm going to recommend the Catholic church to canonize you Saint Aziliana 7037 of Qatar Living.
I'll have to dig out your miracles in Qatar Living, too support your canonization.
Saint Aziliana 7037 of Qatar Living.
But people do not listen...
The Church isn't contradicting condoms or other contraceptives. Only the abortion stuff due to 'ethical debates'.
Now I understand why I missed your point by a kilometer...or more than that...
"Everything in this book may be wrong." Illusions: The Adventures of The Reluctant Messiah by Richard Bach
Intelligent - "Do you mean if some girl willfully wanted to be your Girlfriend not just friend."
Eh, excuse me! "Girlfriend" doesn't mean "lover" in all cases, ok?
Agree with Azi. And agree with britexpat insofar as the people are the ones who do not follow - those priests with feet of clay who have damaged the credibility of the church and the followers who decide not to follow in this regard because they feel the church is not moving with the times - dangers of AIDS, current cost of living very high, difficult for both parties not to work, cannot afford to bring up children and pay for their education, etc, etc.
*****************************************
Don't want no drama,
No, no drama, no, no, no, no drama
Priests and bishops are not using any artificial birth control coz they are having sex with young boys. lolzzz... So they are right in there teaching. Dont use artificial birth control. Now I understand what you were trying to shout from so long.
MOTO:
Enjoy Merry Christmiss with artificial birth control (use what ever you like).
it would only mean ABORTION.
so we're DEFINITELY talking about birth control BEFORE SEX...in it's GENERAL TERM.
Got the idea now?
Since it's Christmas (and I'm bored at the office right now), I'll expound the main thought of my topic. Just read carefully so your brain won't hurt, k?
The Roman Catholic Church says Abortion or any other artificial means of family control is a immoral and an unethical issue. But in the first place, this issue should be resolved first within the church before it is brought somewhere else, like the arena of politics.
The government as a whole, can go door to door with their promotions for all artificial means of Birth control, but if there are no believers, there are no takers.
In other words, if more and more people are using artificial means of birth control, is it because the ARTIFICIAL means are widely available? Or Is it Church has failed in its job inculcate to their members that it is wrong to use these methods?
And why has the church failed? Because many of its priests and bishops have ceased to be leaders by example.
For example, how can the church credibly teach people about the morality of sex in marriage when many priests and bishops, who are not supposed to marry and must be celibate, are themselves involved in more sordid sex scandals...including young boys. >:(
Already, two popes in recent times have extended public apologies for the sex abuses committed by priests and bishops. Now, what can be more damning than that?
Now, if only the priests/bishops take that unassailable fact in its proper context, they would realize that people now are actually more “ pro-life “ than they get credit for. They are having their babies, despite the aggressiveness of government to promote birth control.
using condoms doesn't fall under natural method of birth control..anything with the use of something artificial are contraceptives that aint natural, e.g.pills, condom, ligation, IUD etc..
Rythm and withdrawal are natural though..
I believe that the Message of Catholic church is a simple one.
I will translate.
Quit Fu&&ing irresponsibly, If you want to F#$k do it in a responsible manner, if you are having children out of wedlock or infected with HIV or any other kind of crap is your butt and don't blame God for it.
You got Confessions today
Or maybe because I got the message right?
"Everything in this book may be wrong." Illusions: The Adventures of The Reluctant Messiah by Richard Bach
Please stay away from my topics as THEY seemed to be WAY, WAY, VERY FAR AWAY from your league...more than your brain cells can decipher...PLEASE DON'T HURT YOURSELF THIS WAY...
and KNOWING HOW STUPID YOUR COMMENTS CAN BE...I'll ignore YOU just this once...honestly, I don't find you FUNNY, at all. :-/
MERRY CHRISTMAS...AND PLEASE...try to IMPROVE YOUR READING COMPREHENSION...
:-(
It's you who misinterpret what the Church says.
When they say 'birth control' it means before having sex.
On the abortion side, if you mistakenly get preggy, it's not good to abort, the Church will let you continue bearing the child because it's 'inhumane' to abort it and irresponsible...that's why you have to do birth control before you have sex if both of you doesn't want a child yet.
Do not blame the Church. Blame your mistakes of not planning.
"Everything in this book may be wrong." Illusions: The Adventures of The Reluctant Messiah by Richard Bach
and since you're a MAN, kindly educate us on the manly instincts....per se?
Genral warning to chaste women? huh? :-/
what's that got to do with BIRTH CONTROL? :-/
Do you mean if some girl willfully wanted to be your Girlfriend not just friend.
Peace.
Well, you must know that.. ok It was a general warning to chaste ladies...
Follow your instincts? such as?
Well I think I would go with my instincts. If some girl willfully agrees to befriend with me out of wedlock, I might agree...
Don't call me moron,etc..
if you EVER HAVE ONE about this topic...
We do like your topics and keep on posting topics that do need people to talk on even they sound taboo and confused.
Peace.
DMS: I guess I'm still bored...or maybe that's just my Christmas gloomy mood....heheheh
ONEMAKI: No comment ;-P
Good day, Azi!!!!!
"dgoodrebel will always be the rebellious good one"
better than the clash of countries on the other thread.,LOL., im gettin sick and tired of that cr@p.,
_________________
call me ONE.
you tickle one's mind with your topics! Are you still bored?
"dgoodrebel will always be the rebellious good one"
What do you think azilana personally? Should you go with the church or follow your instinct?
I'm BORED...NOT....lmao
It's been a while since I've been posting actively...so, I'm just doing what I enjoy doing...QL'ing :-)
Don't tell me you don't like my topics? :-(
The Territory of Christmas Island is a territory of Australia in the Indian Ocean. It is located 2600 kilometres (1600 mi) northwest of the Western Australian city of Perth, 500 kilometres (300 mi) south of the Indonesian capital, Jakarta, and 975 km (600 mi) ENE of the Cocos (Keeling) Islands.
It has a population of approximately 1,600 residents who live in a number of "settlement areas" on the northern tip of the island: Flying Fish Cove (also known as Kampong), Silver City, Poon Saan, and Drumsite.
-With our population, I don't think we are in need of birth control.
_________________
call me ONE.
You noted well Mr. Onemakikomoto. Azi from strippers to birth control and on to .......
Just wondering what could be the next topic. Good with coming up with all the hot topics. lolz...... But one thing is that both the topics are very confusing.
Peace.
where is Christmas Island? Is birth control practice there? Just asking! Good observation about Azi's two latest posts! She makes me think! I love her thinking moods!
"dgoodrebel will always be the rebellious good one"
from strippers to birth control... hmmm azi, you're becoming consistent huh., LOL., happy christmas!
As what brit said:
Church Guidelines are set. The decision is upon us.
practice sexuality in a healthy manner.
procreate responsibly.
LIVE AND LET LIVE.
_________________
call me ONE.
it's how you view it or how you want to run your life, mine is just for my own view or opinion. I still regard marriage as a sacred one.
"dgoodrebel will always be the rebellious good one"
if the church says it's sinful on both accounts (illicit affairs and out-of-wedlock)...
yet the government PROMOTE safe SEX....
hello?
on legitimate partners, then there is nothing sinful there, but if use in illicit affairs and out-of-wedlock, then the church perceived it as sinful (which IMHO, I agree).
"dgoodrebel will always be the rebellious good one"
There is no 'natural' birthcontrol. Every single cell in a human's body wants to reproduce. Any control, religious or by moral is man-made.
FYI.. Condom is considered an artificial method. only Rhythm and abstinence are the natural methods of family planning...
Not Church or Government, but the PEOPLE.
The women with their bumpy bits and men with their urges. Both sexes have to take responsibility.
For my own opinion the reason why these methods are widely used is because of individual's choice. I am a Family Planning Counselor but I never force clients to use these methods. I presented each method and I'll let the client together with his/her significant other to decide. So it is a free choice on their own free will.. Just to add up Catholic Church advocacy against these so called "artificial Methods of family planning" is somehow going beyond the line. If one uses one of these methods does not mean that he/she is a sinner just because the church said so that the mere use of artificial birth control is against GOD. No, definitely not against God but it is just a mean to survive and to give his/her family a better life and for me that is a wise decision..
For my own opinion the reason why these methods are widely used is because of individual's choice. I am a Family Planning Counselor but I never force clients to use these methods. I presented each method and I'll let the client together with his/her significant other to decide. So it is a free choice on their own free will.. Just to add up Catholic Church advocacy against these so called "artificial Methods of family planning" is somehow going beyond the line. If one uses one of these methods does not mean that he/she is a sinner just because the church said so that the mere use of artificial birth control is against GOD. No, definitely not against God but it is just a mean to survive and to give his/her family a better life and for me that is a wise decision..
People (single or married) use birth control for whatever reasons...
- they don't want to get pregnant or get someone pregnant
- they feel protected(?) in cases of STDs (for those who have mutiple partners), et al
But still commit sin for having SEX OUT OF WEDLOCK.
Who to blame? Church ot Government?
Is it confusing?....
you're adressing your comments to me...lol
JOKE...
May be the natural way is self control and dont have sex with your partner (wife). Any other way comes under artificial.
Peace.
hehehehehehehehe!!!!!!!!!!!!
"dgoodrebel will always be the rebellious good one"
making it with your spouse/partner anytime you want it or agreed upon is the natural thing. It's a right of both partners to have sex as they pleases. So controlling your desire thru Rhytmn method is unnatural. Doing it even on those unsafe period using artificial means is the natural ways.
"dgoodrebel will always be the rebellious good one"
The answers are not straight forward.
For a start , both religions discourage sexual relations out of wedlock.
Also, within the religions one reason for "sexual relations" is procreation.
The Catholic Church is stating its position clearly. It's up to us / you to decide whether we feel strongly enough about our religion to adhere to its guidelines.
Use of condoms fall under artificial birth control for sure but what falls under natural is even not clear to me.
But the question is...is birth control a matter of means...coz it's there or is it because we believe it's the right thing to do?
Salam,
no.. use of that does n't fall.. its only control yourself. there is lot of ways there except few.. contact with Islamic scholars or pls visit good Islamic sites for details.. Thanks..
what is natural as perceived in Catholic instruction? Isn't it natural for couple to have sex as part of their relation? So, for me, it's unnatural to use the "perceived" natural birth control that the Catholic Church says! The natural way is the artificial ways!
"dgoodrebel will always be the rebellious good one"
would be the Rhytmn method or Abstinence (I think).
I think use of the condoms fall under the natural method...but I'm not so sure :-)
Even Islam says that we are not supposed to practice any birth control method except the natural ones, which I am not sure what it means exactly.
...Because many of its priests and bishops have ceased to be leaders by example. Many of them do not practice what they preach.
Meaning: they have lost the credibility to tell and teach the difference between right and wrong.
only my opinion...