Is the big dog ever wrong ?
The Pentagon has said an air strike by US forces in the Afghan-Pakistani border region, said to have killed 11 Pakistani soldiers, was legitimate.
It said US forces had acted in self-defence after coming under attack in clashes with pro-Taleban militias.
The US state department described the deaths as regrettable, and said there was a need for better communication.
Pakistan's military said earlier that the soldiers had died as a result of an "unprovoked and cowardly act".
So many cases of friendly fire, yet they always say they are right!
That's a good thought that every one should keep their army at their place.
but the trouble is..... the big, fat wealthy politicians..... then there are the business interests.
Seen the move 'Lord of War'?
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Quidquid latine dictum sit, altum sonatur.
You are right about that aspect. I had a collweague who had served in Vietnam. He never talked about it. When I asked him why, he said that he didn't want to remember what he had seen or to glorify war..
You would agree though that war now is different from war in the 70's. Its more organized and controlled. You have AWACS, Forward spotters, drones, sattelites etc to support you.
The issue here was that given the above scenario, FF should not occur. If it does occur, because we are only human, then at least have the courage to admit your mistake and apologize to the victims.
This is something America does not seem to understand. One reason could be that they are scared of being sued if they admit a mistake.
...when we used to battle with honor. If an opponent has no arms, we should also not fight with arms as it is unfair.
"Everything in this book may be wrong." Illusions: The Adventures of The Reluctant Messiah by Richard Bach
the discussion was about, what I don't understand is how anyone other than the people directly involved can have an opinion of how people feel or what their attitude is. We have a bunch of people whose worst experience in life is a power failure or loss of the internet. I no longer know who to believe but I can guarantee I don't believe half the crap from the news media. We seem to be under some social burden with everyone telling us how we are supposed to feel and how to experience and show it. Then we need to go public and maybe go on the telly and see Dr. Phil and Oprah and cry our eyes out. Get real.
The sign off down below is my spoof of Viet Nam, I can say that we were winning when I left (tongue in cheek). Oh yeah, no offense taken but I wasn't a soldier I was a Marine. Trust me when I say I was on both ends of friendly fire and it is a scary and helpless feeling on both ends, you can't stop the incoming in either direction. I was on a artillery forward observer team.
Participant South East Asia War Games
Second Place
Sorry , but I was confused.. You said War Games.. This is not a conflict.. Which actual conflict were you in? The name of it..
You are right that it is not easy in a war situation.. However, being a soldier, you should know that there are command and control systems in placen to minimize friendly casualties.. Gone are the days of rushing in and shooting wildly..
The discussuin hre was about the "attitude" of the Americans after the killings..
let's see I'll give ya a hint mook mafi, there was a little skirmish in SE Asia a few years back and it lasted a little longer than GW I. Hey Harry what's you claim to fame? First place in Mario Brothers?
Participant South East Asia War Games
Second Place
I think the guy has been playing board games..:)
Is it on a simulator ?
to do? Sit in a circle holding hands and singing Kumbaya?
I can promise you that no one is happy about it happening but there is a war going on and people have a tendency to die. Which conflict? Look below, I kinda thought it says it all.
Participant South East Asia War Games
Second Place
Which conflict were you in? I fought in the first gulf war and believe me the Americans can be very gung ho...
The pouint is that modern technolgy is utilized in warfare to minimize friendly fire.. Obviously it will happen, but the point is that it happens with the Americans a "bit too much"..
And after it has occured , they take a blase attitude.
have ever been in a battle or firefight? Keep in mind that the people involved in these situations are no different then the same people you see every day. Of course they have a little training but mistakes and errors happen especially in the heat of battle. I don't think anyone here is privy to what goes on behind closed doors and as usual the media needs to whip everyone up in a frenzy. Gypsy what do you mean by "quite a few"? You don't think the Canucks haven't mistakenly killed a few allies? I have been on both ends of friendly fire and believe me they both suk. But life goes on. As far as war goes they will never end, man is an animal just like the rest and our eyes are not on the side of our heads, we are predators and books and rules will never stop that. If we were all docile we would still be sitting in caves.
Participant South East Asia War Games
Second Place
I agree that everyone needs to fight against terrorism.. Not just terrorism by Muslims..
By the way, if you brought all the troops home, how would the defense industry survive, and how will you support such a big army..
What should we do About the radical Americans, itching for a world war?
Who are over all, against Islam itself and other religions?
Unfortunately, We got both sides of the coin in this world.
And let's dedicate ourselves to what the Greeks wrote so many years ago: to tame the savageness of man and make gentle the life of this world. Let us dedicate ourselves to that, and say a prayer for our country and for our people.
BUT, sorry folks, the entire world is, or at least should be, involved in a war against radical muslim terrorists. I say "bring all the troops back to the US" and let you idiots fight it out. Believe me, America will cope just fine. Then, when you realize that you need our support, we can come back in and bale your sorry asses out. Go Hoosiers.
Instead they thought they'd done a good deed..
Amazing what drives people to carry out these acts..
Sishtiaq : They did not enter Pakistan.. The deaths were from air strikes on the border..
regret killin is not a gud idea.. how can u just kill and then say sorry..
no doubt it is a cowardly act that should be condemned by all.
nevertheless, i must say the president Mushharaff should be held equally responsible for such deaths as he allowed them in!
the problem with your idea is that bigger or more powerful will always have "power" over the little ones..
Loose coalitions are neccesary..
The UN is just a toothless body, which can be manipulated by the big boys..
the problem with your idea is that bigger or more powerful will always have "power" over the little ones..
Loose coalitions are neccesary..
The UN is just a toothless body, which can be manipulated by the big boys..
Your hired! When can you start?
America is the Big Dog, but it has become a mongrel. The old values that America imbued are no longer there. Now they onl;y have their own agenda and ride rough shod over those who disagree.
This is Now. Time for Europe to stand on its own, with its own "coalition".
America needs to go back to doing its thing in its own sphere - North America.
And wait for WWIII do happen while America slumbers? You all should be a lot wiser than that. The problem is we are bound to repeat the mistakes of the past (if we forget, and since all the 'Great War' veterans are almost gone and all of the leading politicians can't even remember the last one, we are on shaky ground) and Europe tore itself apart twice last century and at least that many times the century before and . . .
Somebody buy a vowel!
Agree with you totally..
NATO was used to keep any possble war with "Russia" as far away from North America.
Now its is being "misused" in Afghanistan.
Don't worry, that is why the UN FORCES OCCUPIED germany for over 50 years.....
And let's dedicate ourselves to what the Greeks wrote so many years ago: to tame the savageness of man and make gentle the life of this world. Let us dedicate ourselves to that, and say a prayer for our country and for our people.
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No more NATO too?
By ROBERT BURNS, AP Military Writer 34 minutes ago
BRUSSELS, Belgium - Defense Secretary Robert Gates said Thursday he has invited Afghanistan and Pakistan to be part of a U.S. investigation into an airstrike that Pakistani officials say killed 11 of their troops.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080612/ap_on_go_ca_st_pe/us_pakistan_21
There are two rules when you are the boss:
1. The boss is always right, if not, see rule #2
2. See rule #1
;)
Friendly fire is an unfortunate result of combat. However, I do have to say that the US is quite arrogant in it's refusal to take responsibility for it. We've had quite a few Canadians killed by the Americans in Afghanistan, with not so much as an apology.
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This was my point...The USA is immune to prosecution..In this case, they didn;t even have the decency to apologize..
and the world does nothing.
Or sometimes the US says "we'll investigage don't worry" and then everything is forgotten.
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citizens ,,, we criticize the Politicians or the BAD guys whether Americans/ British/ Pakistani etc....
I don't think so it is fair to put all the blame on the citizen of any Country who are not involved in political or to do with the wars!
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because if I did, ppl will start blaming me that I hate the american (arrogance)...so I'll keep my mouth shut
No matter who takes the blame it will not bring the boys back.
nice one brandy!
the big, fat wealthy politicians who sit back in their comfortable offices while men are fighting and dying under terrible circumstances. They should let them go and experience the front line for themselves!!!
I wish if Govt allow Media to show the real picture !
They will not even allow them to approach their families just to hide the facts....
we don't only blame US we also blame our dirty politicians who are part of manslaughter in Pakistan and Afghanistan.
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Who will console the families of those soldiers and who will pay for the loss of their income to their families. Lost lives and as usual nothing achieved apart from a great deal of grief.
Pakistan payed heavily and is still suffering for their part in the the so called "War on Terror" as she allied with the Uncle Sam....and as usual, now we are hearing all kind of anti-Pakistan statements from US polticians and ex-service men......
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If you look at what you do not have in life;
You don't have anything.
If you look at what you have in life;
You have everything.
10 FRIENDLY MISSILES into their nearby base everyday and then simply apologizes to them saying it was Friendly Fire as usual ;-)
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that mistakes are made, for this always happens in battle situations. The thing i find irritating is that they never are held accountable.
the desert is just too big to have that kind of coincidence.
they will not admit mistake of course, it's just because they always say "we just fired something and they got in the way who's fault was that?"
how they can call such incidents 'friendly fire' does such a thing exist? I mean, any fire could not be friendly right? You are right though, they will never admit to making mistakes no matter how many casualties as a result of their actions.
it's like "somebody died? oooops! sorry!"