King David committed adultery!
King David who is considered a prophet in Islam committed adultery with Bathsheba,the wife of a soldier Uriah. He eventually had Uriah killed in battle and married Bathsheba. And Bathsheba was his favorite wife. And Solomon the son of Bathsheba succeeded David.
Not only that
David was a peeping Tom too! It is said that David first saw Bathsheba from the roof while she was having a bath and fell in love with her!
If the prophets could commit sins like adultery and then lead a successful life why is it that adultery is considered a serious crime in our society?
http://www.cord.edu/faculty/andersod/rembrandt_bathsheb.jpg
anything but it doesn't mean everybody has to agree with you. if anything wrong is being posted,anybody has the right to correct you. any way your post is absolutely wrong.
I am cool buddy!
so wats the point??
--If you can't CONVINCE them, CONFUSE them!!!
how can u accuse a prophet?did u witness?
its me
your reply to ntq is absolutely wrong. Allah has said in Qur'an in chapter 1:33 that Allah taught Adam everything. So if Adam(PBUH) ate or didn't eat the fruit,it would not affect any walks of Adam's(PBUH) life.
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its me
ntq, What I meant is if Adam and Eve hadn't eaten that apple, Adam wouldn't know how to make Eve Pregnant!
edifis's hypothesis -
'Ofcourse the Jew is the baddie! Now guess who is the good one. But the good one remained innocent forever and never had any worldly knowledge! So he could not procreate! So I guess all the muslims are descendants of that sinful jew!'
The above 'Theory of Procreation' concludes no procreation without adultery.
What do ppl think? agree or disagree?
The other one, MD, was a virtual one who lived in the 'nothing' phase! So obviously his sin was hypothetical! Does this sound more 'real' to your twisted logic?
MD, this time you started!
ok so you think the only way to procreate is by committing adultery.
So what does everyone think of the edifis's Theory of Procreation?
ntq, I am actually quite annoyed! It's so confusing. Yet what MD says is correct too. If all 3 religions start towing in the same prophets with different stories there is bound to be a conflict. And the muslims always claim that their prophets are perfect. I actually poked a bit of fun on that claim, and I am not making fun of the prophets!
keep going edifis...let it all out mate :)
Edifis said - 'Yes, must be so, MD, because Allah wouldn't let a prophet commit a sin, and he would never have touch the forbidden fruit, were he the same person!'
I see Edifis you are clearly showing 'respect for all religions'. What a great guy you are!
Ofcourse the Jew is the baddie! Now guess who is the good one. But the good one remained innocent forever and never had any worldly knowledge! So he could not procreate! So I guess all the muslims are descendants of that sinful jew!
Edifis said "...some people choose to feel insulted and quell my desire for knowledge about other religions! I have respect for all the religions. I even like many aspects of other religion better than Hinduism. But I never thought of converting until now because I need a valid reason for that, and secondly I don't want to be an apostate."
Hi Eddifis - ok apologies, maybe I misunderstood your above post in particular the last sentence. I dont want to 'quell' your 'desire for knowledge' but I suggest you read less about adultery/peeping toms and more about the nature of God to have a better understanding of other religions. Even if we assume that the bible version is correct, you can not conclude that because a prophet commited a sin it is acceptable for us to commit the same sin. We are not answerable to a prophet but to our Creater Who has made that act a sin.
Just to clear up any misconceptions, pls note that Muslims do not subscribe to the jewish/christian version of the story of Prophet Sulaiman (Solomon). In Islam, the Prophets hold a very high status and were far removed from such major sins as adultery. They came to warn ppl against wrongdoings not to promote them.
It's very clear, edifis, one was a Muslim and the other was a Jew. Guess who was the 'good' one?
Yes, must be so, MD, because Allah wouldn't let a prophet commit a sin, and he would never have touch the forbidden fruit, were he the same person!
There are also two Adams: one is the blessed prophet (Peace be upon him), and the other one fu8888 up everything and was kicked out of paradise.
Thanks Ajinpt,thats more like it. Your argument is quite logical.
U know The Bible too shares the same story , but it calls David as a king instead of a prophet.. And now, who told he got away without getting harmed??.. He lost his first born with Bathsheba... He had his daughter raped by his OWN Son from another wife.. And he was not quiet happy for all these. And he Was a King who was supposed to be leading and being an exemplar to the common people. Now think about the shame and humiliation he and his family had gone through when all these bad things happened to him and he knew that every single men under him knew exactly that this was a punishment of his own deeds!!! yes , he was indeed well punished.
----If you can't CONVINCE them, CONFUSE them!!!
FU, nice story about the Kings Genitals hanging from a Tree. I think the story is inspired by the Mahabharat's Hanuman tail episode!
profiles each time s/he gets banned and then carries on discussions agreeing with himself/herself. Now that would make a GREAT psych case study! :-P
I didn't drink the kool-aid! -- PM
Someone said somewhere 'PM is a case study'. How true is that.
Source:
- A study Conducted by FriedUnicorn - Vol I (September,1999)
suerly ther r mor than 1 King David.
my answer to ur question why every 1 is accusing u is u might not feel the degree of mistake u hav done. r u sure that the source u gave is a reliable 1. jews write many false things about islam in order to give a wrong picture about islam. so it is better to keep away from such unreliable sources.
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its me
In 8342 BCE, there was a king on neptune. He had a strange hobby. He used to sit high on a tree and hang his privates. The passerbys used to get irritated by his hooby and they complained to the queen. The queen suggested that from now on, whenever anyone passes through the tree and the king's privates come in the way; the person would be entitled to chop off a portion and take home for good luck.
That's the reason we don't see any more Kings on Trees these days!
Source:
- A study Conducted by FriedUnicorn - Vol I (September,1999)
So were ther more than one prophet named King David?
u r absolutely wrong.it might be some other king David and not Allah's messenger David(Daud PBUH).so ur post is utter nonsense.
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its me
Why is everybody accusing me? as if I made up these stories! I just posted some well known historical facts about King David and Solomon. This is not to insult anybody. What you believe may differ from what I believe. I never thrust my belief on others.
abdullahks, I don't agree it is a mistake. You are free to believe anything but it doesn't mean everybody has to agree with you.
u said ur religion isn't holding u bak nor creating problems to u. in that case u should not post such fake topics to insult other religion.
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i am cool buddy!
may be some other king david might have adultered with someone. why the hell do you have to accuse a muslim prophet. allah has sent down prophets by protecting them from all kinds of sins.
one thing is sure that this post is to insult islam.but remember one thing,islam will never lose anywhere. so never try to insult islam.
ok.hop you understood your mistake...........don't repeat it again.
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i am cool buddy!
Because I trust God, edifis. He wouldn't send an adulterer to teach ppl morality.
no prophet will commit such a mistake as they are protected from all kind of sin(past,present and future).so this post is completely wrong and the website given is a fake address.
i am cool buddy!
How can you be so sure QL?
edifis..
This story was made up by the jews who have quite a history in killing and lying about prophets.
Let me clarify, I never said that I am thinking about converting. Why should I? My religion isn't holding me back or creating any problem for me!
PM dear, You are throwing very big names around carelessly. I on the otherhand came to Qatar in peace & when my contract is over I wish to leave in peace.
I think it's a good idea to print this thread and share with your psychiatrist how you accumilate your views about people you have only just met. Godspeed
What happened to being Qatari and the cousin of the Emir? rofl
I didn't drink the kool-aid! -- PM
1- Who is 'WE' when you refer to yourself in the plural?
2-Only a few posts above at 4:50 you said - you had such high hopes for me elevating the level of dialogue here -
I don't know or care for what game are you playing at.
Maybe you are racist toward Americans of Arab decent,which is why you kept going on about me not getting the all American joke. America is a melting pot of cultures and we are just as American as you are.
Thankfully you don't & will never represent the majority of the American people and you certainly haven't adopted the friendly demeanor of the country you are in.
It was interesting talking to you, But I will not allow you to waste anymore of my time with your rudeness.
I joined QL to to meet nice people, preferably ones without multiple personalites: Thank ALLAH besides you i haven't been dissapointed yet.
lol
It's only a matter of time before you are deleted from your most recent QL history and we can wait for your next incarnation. In the meantime, enjoy your newest game. :-)
I didn't drink the kool-aid! -- PM
PM, Is that what your nickname stands for Prime Minister? of Qatar Living no less!
LOL why would I post something negative about the hosts whose country I reside in?
Yes I do admire them greatly, why don't you?
Thankfully a lot of friendly QLers have advised me to ignore Jackfrost.
When it comes to the paranoid PM, no warning was needed! I've chuckled at the many QLers who have called you paranoid over and over.
Being at the brunt of one of your manic outburst is quite a different experience, shall I look forward to more every time I express an opinion? lol
News flash honey, I'm not the only one who speaks about 9/11 conspiracies here in QL or off. Maybe you don't with your trouser leg rolled up lol, but you ought to know alota Arab Americans do.
Pull up a search on QL it's been done & from the looks of things, maybe you need to be done too ;)
:-P
I didn't drink the kool-aid! -- PM
what wrong in these theories Pm
i like them too much , better than watching a movie , i think it is amusing reality show :D :D
by the way did you hear about the conspiracy of American moon laning?, and Armstrong?
they nominated this as the most conspiracy theory provided by clues , then 9/11 theory.
For the free masons , are you afraid of them???? LOL
one shot" not my name" is enough for them .
joking ;)
---------------------------------
"It could be a picture
It could be a medicine
it could be a bullet
depends on how you see it"
Just waiting for you to start posting things about HRH Sheikha Moza and the Prime Minister who you admire so much! :-P
Here's a hint for you: If you really want to pretend you are a new QLer, you might want to avoid diving right into the freemasons and the 911 conspiracy theories! lol
I didn't drink the kool-aid! -- PM
nice dali i never knew that the US money created a time line, im very impressed
PM, are you on medication because you're not making sense?
Samia08, thanks dear, I'm upset too and baffled why they would delete it. Do you have any idea why?
It's just footage of images shown when folding the new 1996 federal reserve dollar bills.
One makes from it what one wants. This isn't censoring it's mind control. You have the ones with power deleting working side by side with the smokescreens who says its all a silly conspiracy.
Let us see and judge!
HERE IS THE youtube LINK samia
dali , about your thread titled 9/11 New World posted this morning I was watching the video when it was deleted ,I was sooo mad
That was an obvious joke. But maybe you don't get American humor, being from the US by way of Qatar :-)
In fact don't have the power to hush ANYBODY up. :-/
BTW, why did you launch a new account with a new nickname? I didn't think your 2nd (and most recent) one had been banned, had it?
I didn't drink the kool-aid! -- PM
You won't mind if I wish them peace instead! A more useful thing at any rate... power brings envy, then confrontation and abuse. There's nothing worse than a person hell-bent to remaining in power.
Although the starting point of this thread was subject to controversy, I really learned a great deal about religious people and their believes. Although an atheist myself, I'm interested in religions and people practicing them. I don't think I hold the truth and my view is that atheism can behave very much like an established religion: it evolved from somewhere to somewhere else, and has its own prophets. These could have even been part of pre-dating religions (think of Darwin, 200 years ago, who was I think a practicing Christian).
I also think that whether or not you have faith, especially in our parts of the world (western countries and Middle-east), to understand anything and make educated judgements on the world we live in, one must know about the monotheist cultures. So knowing their Books is important to a great degree. I am ashamed to say that I do not know them that well.
I shall follow other debates of that nature with interests, hoping that not too many people will say incendiary and hurting things (but that's not possible with the anonymity web forums offer).
edifis, to answer your question on why adultery is serious mistake, i guess its because adultery does not only hurt the person committing it but also the partner and their children. its a mistake that a lot will suffer. and for whta? for a few minutes of guilty pleasure?
and as for king david, he may had led a successful life but definitely he was in the dark for a while and only because of his sincere atonement and by the grace of God that he had raisen from the pit he had fallen.
usapa na...
as a christian, i sooooooo knew that king david had committed adultery. not news definitely. and not only did he committed adultery, he had executed a plan that would put the husband of bathsheba in the front line during a war so that he was killed. and that is why prophet daniel castigated him in his evil ways. when king david realized what he did, he wrote Psalm 51 with the lines, "create in me a clean heart o God and renew a right spirit within me"", in atoning for his sins.
usapa na...
Ahhhhh yes, here's one of them taken from the yemeni child bride debacle
exiledsaint said I blame the west. In the ...
I blame the west. In the west they arrest and imprison pedeophilies and this just publicses their actions and makes people in other countries think its normal..... I can't help thinking W Bush actually arranged this marriage to make Arabs looking bad with the help of Mossad..
Sun, 13/09/2009 - 11:02pm New! reply
PM said Indeed ES, but let's don't tell people here because then they ...
will KNOW it is all America's fault :-)
Ooooooh thats posiviley saucy, you little trickster :) But lets not blame the US for this, maybe people higher up?
The artwork is spine chillingly accurate, even depicting the points of impact.
Please feel free to dive in the link ought to be here http://www.qatarliving.com/node/719647
Ought to is the operative word as my thread keeps dissapearing.
Give it a try for me dear
Pm, sorry to dissapoint you love. I doubt it's just a Muslim conspiracy theorist, since I have been reading for sometime i've noticed that many non muslims see eye to eye aswell.
Exiledsaint also shared some similar views, in different posts no less and if i'm not mistaken I think everytime you hushed him up ;-)
Not another Muslim conspiracy theorist.... And I had such high hopes for you elevating the level of dialogue here... :-P
I didn't drink the kool-aid! -- PM
Power to the brave women and men of Israel....
Dali, Topic appears in search but upon clicking it takes to no where. I think it does not exist anymore.
Shylock you are still here?
Power to the non believers, it’s a great feeling to have and hold
Twinkle it's titled 9/11 New World Order MUST SEE
Its about the folding of the $ 5 , 20, 50 & 100 dollar bills to show you the plan of 9/11 with clear pictures of the towers when the bills are folded as they go down.
Why would the mods delete that post?
It's not like theyre behind 9/11 now is it?
Twinkle.twinkle you are so smart and funny,shylock Very suitable for JackA*s.
Mr.shylock you have humiliated yourself and your people enough ,so stop or leave ASAP.
What is the title of your post?
Dali, The link leads to "Ooooops..." no post appears.
Its not deleted, here is the link, please see for yourself http://www.qatarliving.com/node/718633
question is why can't i search it and why doesn't it show up in my track record?
Twinkle, try opening it and let me know, thnks
Hard to answer your question.
Ok, but why was it deleted????
Its only about how Dollar bills looks when its folded, you can see the twin towers fall step by step.
Again why is that deleteted when other sensetive issues are being discussed on QL?
One thread today had the words ...I cant write it, it was fellatio, so thats ok?
And looking at a Dollar bill is bad?
Dali, Shylock is right. It is deleted.
Power to the non believers, it’s a great feeling to have and hold.
Your right Mandi, as we read further on that Chapter we will come to know that he suffered the consequences of his actions. God punished him for what he did but then because of his wholehearted repentance he was forgiven.
I posted this topic
I'm a new user and i'm still getting the hang of QL, but can someone tell me why you can't find it in the forum, and since I have already commented on it , shouldnt it be in my 'track' record, because it isn't, only my comments in other ppls threads are listed.
Yesterday I couldn't even search for it.
Is it being censored? Why would it be it's not contraversy.
In fact it's all over youtube and many may (or may not) have seen it before, I just want to hear opinions about it, because it's crazy shocking!!
It shows you the new dollar bills printed in 1996 by the federal reserve , shockingly when you fold the notes , $5 $20 $50 $100 you find it depict in great detail the accurate images of 9/11 ...It's something you can try yourself
Sorry to hijack your thread Edifis, Jackfrost sort of derailed it. I just want to know why the Post can't be found on QL, maybe I didn't post it properly?
You are a JackA not frost! I will call you Shylock from now onwards.
Power to the non believers, it’s a great feeling to have and hold.
Campaign to ignore jackfrost
eddifis - although your original post was not a question but more of a statement, you later on clarified that your aim is to learn about other religions as you are thinking of converting.
I suggest in that case that you start with the fundamentals of each religion (status/nature of the creator, hereafter, etc) and then take it from there. There are many good sources around and more scholarly than QL forums.
I can't see how 'king solomon an islamic prophet committed adultery' kind of posts help in aquiring beneficial knowledge...unless you have already decided adultery is ok and have a problem with those who say it isnt.
Messymiss...thanks for the advice, this time i'll make a better effort ;)
Dali ignore jackfrost!
Pay peanuts & you get Monkeys
Jackfrost....aha
"The difference between the Jewish soul, in all its independence, inner desires, longings, character and standing, and the soul of all the Gentiles, on all of their levels, is greater and deeper than the difference between the soul of a man and the soul of an animal, for the difference in the latter case is one of quantity, while the difference in the first case is one of essential quality." - Rabbi Kook.
Interesting ideology from a Rabbi no less!
I guess there must be a special place in hell for all of those who find mirth or arrogantly hold such little regard for any human life, regardless of gender, race or religon....We can all read, experience or befriend types from all walks of life. Perhaps it's advisable you choose more wisely & try not to subscribe to negative influences for the betterment of all.
Dali.. i received the phrase, she would be too second hand for my liking from the Arab men I work with here in the middle east, it is a well know fact the middle eastern man say this. How bad are my teachers of the arab slang
Power to the non believers, it’s a great feeling to have and hold.
I would love a Qr for all the middle eastern men that I have seen attending college that have cheated their way thru, I have seen papers from 20 class mate on 25 questions all the same. I have seen your type going to the USA for short courses only to attend the first day, maybe attend the next days,, get the certificate and all the time they spent in strip bars paying US20 for a lap dance. So to all the highly educated middle eastern that holds qualifications. I smile with you.. as we all know what you did to obtain that degree or certificate. Best of luck on your positions ahead.. god help us all.
Power to the non believers, it’s a great feeling to have and hold.
Jackfrost isn't deranged. Jackfrost isn't depressed. Jackfrost is plain evil.
Jackfrost doesn't know how to argue logically (Wonder how you earned those degrees), so he resorts to irrationality that always implies the same thing:
"You're poor, so you're wrong. You don't have 1001 degrees, so you're wrong. You're not pro-USA, so you're dumb and eww and barf-worthy."
My conclusion is, Jackfrost couldn't be dumber, despite his degrees. And no one gets degrees for attending classes alone. Exams have to written eventually, which earns you either that A-grade certificate or that lowly certificate. Apparently, he's too dumb to even think! How did he get his degrees? Clearly, he's bluffing.
My advice is, avoid him and DO NOT respond to him. He just wants people to respond to him. All he's after is annoying people. So, if he's ignored, he'll call it quits. Hereafter, even I'll ignore him. I wrote this to draw attention of fellow QLers to the purpose of his meaningless writings. He obviously celebrates every time someone gets exasperated. So for the love of God, DO NOT GIVE HIM THE OPPORTUNITY TO BLOW HIS TRUMPETS.
"Recession is when your neighbour loses their job; depression is when you lose your job."
Yeah, they should be able to choose other partners, only after they break-up and divorce their spouses. Or after agreeing that the marriage be coverted into an open marriage.
"Recession is when your neighbour loses their job; depression is when you lose your job."
According to me adultery is not such a serious crime. If there is mutual consent between man & woman it is just fine. Human minds are subject to change. When some one marries it doesn't mean he/she will like his partner for the rest of their life. If she is not satisfied with her partner she should be able to go out with other men so that she can choose another partner.
as a muslim we must respect all religions and all god messengers so we belive that moses and Jesus are messengers from god,for example the name of my father is moses and the name of my son is ISSA "jesus in arabic" personaly i like jesus so much so i have called my son in his name.
jackforst i think you so rude when you said that "It beats me why a man would want another man’s wife.. she would be too second hand for my liking"
remeber that women is your mother,sister and doughter..
she is not a car ,if she Widowed or Divorced she still human and have the right to life and marriage again.
"Heaven lies at the feet of mothers." prophet Muhammed
I am not a scholar in Christanity or Islam but my personal veiw is that no one is born as a prophet or saint.. and it is by his deeds and the way he lived his life, we(humans) proclaim him to be a saint or prophet.. And we, humans have free minds to have opinons and thoughts which is why we contradict and discuss but can never have full concurrance of everyone on any subject, theory or religions thoughts. We are free to express our thoughts but to impose or state others are incorrect especially on reglious believes would be inappropriate as it would be lead to nothing but confrontation.
Life is too short to be lived in hate and anger .. Live a simple life ...try not to complicate issues.. key secret to happiness
Thanks for giving me the lowdown on the lowdown ;)
who is jackfrost !!!!!!?
I just ignore jackfrost, that's the best way. Just giving him ammunition so to speak is the worst thing you can do
and for being an islamic prophet , yes for sure and we believe in him as a prophet ,
if we don't we are not muslims :D
---------------------------------
"It could be a picture
It could be a medicine
it could be a bullet
depends on how you see it"
back again to see that many chats has opened
Pm i tihnk jackfrost is testing the red lines of the Mods , or he pride them LOL
exil
maimoona said that king david made the sin "it is only mentioned in the old testaments , and they are the same one
---------------------------------
"It could be a picture
It could be a medicine
it could be a bullet
depends on how you see it"
I try my bets to ignore him because to do as you and others have done by challenging only eggs him on. He's disgusting and will sink lower and lower as long as he has an audience.
I didn't drink the kool-aid! -- PM
Dear All,
I strongly belive that we should never get into an arguement over religion. It is a very sensitive matter. We should all respect each others Religion and live in peace.
luv,
Kavkish.
He was the king of Israel!!
another one
You guys are nuts! Yes he committed adultery but not when he was a prophet of Islam! He was one person not two, so yeah maybe he repents his sins but that does not mean he did not commit them.
let alone barking dogs u can never make their tails straight
no you can`t
Jackfrost said about the Prophet David "welcome to the real world.. he was a sinner.. weep on ..."
I do find it such a double standard how many people here are enraged when it comes to their beliefs and when someone says something as crude and derrogatory about a Prophet no less, obviiously hurting many who believe in the contrary this Jackfrost is not only excused by the owners of this site but he is suspiciously tollerated by readers who would jump should the comment come from a Muslim?
To add insult to injury he goes on to insult women by rudley saying "It beats me why a man would want another man’s wife.. she would be too second hand for my liking"
I've met arrogant chauvanists but you my Jewish friend take the grand prize.
This type of behavior is against QL community guidelines is it not?
However judging by the Moderators level of tollerance here, it appears that like the country of the flag you bear, you too appear to be immune to the repercussions of your hurtful words.
I can "mock" whenever I feel like. Just for your information, samia.
magicdragon plz no mocking remark.
very silly joke
Daewood, made in Korea.
Dawood
Do you?
your not ready to play with the big boys and girls
Power to the non believers, it’s a great feeling to have and hold.
oh my gosh!
Edifis: u forgot to discus saitanism!!that is another controversial topic u could drag on & on !
Pay peanuts & you get Monkeys
Edifis, when you mentioned King David, a prophet in Islam, was adulterous, you were wrong. Because King David, the Islamic Prophet, wasn't adulterous. King David, the Jewish King in the old testament was adulterous. I know, they're the same, but since there are different versions of his life, you can't say the Islamic David was adulterous. You used something from the Old Testament to say that the "Islamic Prophet" was adulterous. Instead you could've said that King David, according to the Old Testament was adulterous. Couldn't you have paraphrased? Clearly, you wanted to draw attention.
And, as I mentioned before, adultery is a sin in Abrahamic faiths, and God wasn't particularly pleased with David's deeds. Again, this is from the Old Testament.
Oh, and by the way, why would any one want to cheat his wife and sleep with some one else's and then expect the society to celebrate? Isn't cheating a sin?
Talking of pre-marital sex and adultery are different. Adultery involves cheating a spouse. Just divorce the spouse and express virility!
"Recession is when your neighbour loses their job; depression is when you lose your job."
Because their physical beauty is wrapped inside the clothes, which the girls would not remove. If you want to eat a candy, you do remove the wrapper first don't you?
and tease the girls?
Hindus believe that Lord Krishna is an Avatar of Vishnu, one of the Holy trinity. So he is part of God. So if God wants to enjoy the beauty of his own creation it isn't that bad. Is it? It's the same as a painter painting on a large canvas and then staring at it to admire his own work!
Krishna was peeping Tom too.
Krishna ran across the gopis bathing in the river Yamuna, bewitched by Krishna's celestial beauty they were calling out his name while bathing Krishan stole their clothes and climbed up a tall Kadamba tree. The gopis, trying to hide their naked bodies in the water prayed and pleaded with Krishna, but he did not relent and asked them to come out one by one to the tree to receive their garments back.
http://www.whereincity.com/articles/religion/1667.html
Christainity, Judaism, Islam, Hindhuism...... what else?
I bet the atheists are having their last laugh here..!!
Pajju troll
Easy way to Relax:
Make two Ice packs
Put one one your head and
Put the other on your balls
Then Lie down and have a glass of cool coconut water or Pina Colada.
pajju,
Think of good things Think of how happy it makes you to feel to be loved, how wonderful your life is , a great vacation you went on, how pretty a beach is. Simple pleasures produce a simple smile.
PM, I was never disturbed when Hinduism is discussed. I won't even mind if you criticize the ugly aspects of Hinduism. You will find that most Hindus are very tolerant towards people criticizing some bad aspects of Hinduism. In India the government even passes laws which can change age old traditions pertaining to Hinduism. For example the ritual of animal sacrifice was stopped by the Supreme Court in India, and most temples willingly followed the court directives.
But there are some staunch Hindu organizations who spread hatred among the uneducated masses and lead them to riot against other religions. And in some cases the Hindus are supported by the local Police Force and Fundamentalist Chief Minister of that particular state. But thats not the true spirit of India. India can't be India unless 100% of the people receive secular education.
Yes, I was a bit disturbed when people spread false rumours about casteism being omnipresent in Indian society.
getout twinkle
Slay Jackfrost
samia how can i ? i cannot .. tell me how can i relax ?
Oh well i have to go. time to slay some more liones that have been thrown in to the pit..if you have time to come out from under your sisters dress come and look..but knowing Hamas supports.. you would not ... instead send your little sister to do the looking..
Power to the non believers, it’s a great feeling to have and hold.
relax pajju
i want to sleep really .. am tired :)
I do remember you getting a bit disturbed when Hinduism or aspects of Indian culture were being discussed. So I am sure you can understand how some people here feel, as you seem to share their sensitivities.
I didn't drink the kool-aid! -- PM
JF???
it is weird
why you are mixing between juadism and zionist????
don't make that mistake again.
respect your age old man , and we are here in a clean conversation , please keep it like them , and give a good picture of the group you are thinking that you are supporting
mmmmmmm
---------------------------------
"It could be a picture
It could be a medicine
it could be a bullet
depends on how you see it"
discuss other religions but not by criticising them!!!!!!!
Pay peanuts & you get Monkeys
Pay peanuts & you get Monkeys
not because of that man , jews are people a man could feel sorry about them because of what they did to themselves and what they did to other people.
My declaration :
I am one shot , a muslim arabic syriannnn don't hate Judaism,and i think it is the closet religion to ours.
But i also declare any kind of terror from any human to his brother "Palestine , or Germany"
---------------------------------
"It could be a picture
It could be a medicine
it could be a bullet
depends on how you see it"
edifis,
it is shame on you to accuse and spread lies on dignified, well respected & loved figures like King David just shame on you.
i think becouse they are recist and think that they are above all peoples they think they are
"God's chosen people "
&feature=related
No one is entitled to be arrogant and to think that he is above all other peoples
jews hate hitler and they do with the palestinian the same what hitler did in them.
"Does not enter Paradise in whose heart is a mustard seed of arrogance" prophet MOHAMMED
OneShot said, being a Hindu I shouldn't have started a topic like this.
Here I would like to say I wouldn't mind if a non-Hindu starts a thread about Hinduism.
And I would like to ask, being a Hindu, Have I no right to discuss about religions other than Hinduism?
From his logic,It seems that if you want to talk about a particular religion you have to convert to that religion first and then talk!
start controversial topics but this wasn't the right one to chose. By no means have i ever seen someone wanting to learn abt somethin by supportin the myths abt a religuion instead of finding out the truth!!!!!
this getting more annoyin by the minute!
Pay peanuts & you get Monkeys
They don’t have a brain to work out their own minds.. so it is easier to just follow history and hate us Jews, weak spinled people with no brains but to follow like sheep. I hope that answers your question ABCD
Power to the non believers, it’s a great feeling to have and hold.
doodlebugs, you are right I sit back and enjoy the conversational topics. But I don't see why I should be ashamed. It's a good place to learn about different religion and, not only religion the sensibilities of different people and how people look at different aspects of religion and social life and also how they react. It's a total learning experiance.
edifis: why did you start this thread? you remind me of another ql member whose sole aim used to be nothing but start controversial topics.
do you not have friends who could answer your 'questions' in real life? you start a touchy topic here, sit back and enjoy the show? shame on you!!!
edifis,
if someone is sincerely pursuing the truth by examining the truthfulness of Quran then it is fine with me and should not offend me. Yes i believe Quran came from GOD though!
Quran itself is explicitly stating no compulsion in religion so why should i be obsessed with someone who has other beliefs!
CBD, you want me to question the verity of the bible?
Would you like it better if someone questions the truthfulness of Quran or for that matter any Holy book?
Instead I chose to question the ways of our modern society, what is the problem with that?
edifis, we understand you from your words. You said you asked a question. You need to read your original post ]to find out whether it was a question that you asked.
LOL, look how you get angry when i just mentioned the name of your religion hahahaha
i didn't say anything except writing the name and you started to explain and attack.
My friend , you can't call the other believes blind , let them decide that,not you.
- and according to what you mentioned , and i didn't want to go through it and i don't But:
According to your description to Hinduism , i can say it is not a religion , it is a way of thinking depends on what people wants . for example : for examples some people think that getting married is forbidden , the others could find having sex with sisters is acceptable, and others will forbid having sex with the human race and accept it with ***.
the example have just come due to sexuality in the topic
title
According to that(With a BIGGG LAUGH) you can't judge on any other religion especially the topic you just made about King David (PBUH)
---------------------------------
"It could be a picture
It could be a medicine
it could be a bullet
depends on how you see it"
Why all people hate the Jews?
CBD, I referred to civilized Human society in General. I never said muslim society. And when I mentioned David as a prophet in Islam, was I wrong?
I could have said judaism or christianity, would it have made my post any better or any worse. Why are you so picky with how I put my words?
edifis,
that is not right..if you were questiong that would have been fine. If you were questiong you would have questioned whther David actually commit adultery or not before you jump and ask why is it banned on society at all.
No, ofcourse Not, Twinkle. If you read my original post, you will find that I never passed any judgement about any other religion or badmouthed them. The post is of a questioning nature. I only asked a question about why it is like that? The facts were not concocted by me. I only posted well know facts or myths from other sources.
But instead of discussing in good spirit, like Mandy, Maimoona and Dali, some people choose to feel insulted and quell my desire for knowledge about other religions!
I have respect for all the religions. I even like many aspects of other religion better than Hinduism. But I never thought of converting until now because I need a valid reason for that, and secondly I don't want to be an apostate.
edifis,
i was not really looking for answers as much as i tried to subject you to questions.
You still have not answered why did you reference only Islam though David is known by all abrahamic faiths!
in the last sentence in your thread, you ask why is it banned in our society! I believe you are referring to your society, whatever it is, not our muslim society coz we believe none of this crap you wrote down.
http://www.articlesbase.com/religion-articles/in-the-bible-but-not-in-the-quran-49-king-davids-adulterytrue-or-forged-storye-348504.html
Is there any Hindu scripture which asks to insult great men of history?
CBD, it's not a question of what Hinduism acknowledges. The Hindu scriptures predates the Biblical scriptures by many centuries. So there is no question of cross references between them. Hinduism is another kind of religion, a sort of religion that the people of the books will describe as Pagan beliefs! Most Hindus never claim that they have the best religion. There have been faults with our religion all along. Most Hindu texts were written by men(Great sages of that time). Others are believed to be words of God, handed down to great sages and jotted down by them. Some were passed down by word of mouth(shruti) from generation to generation. So there may have been considerable alterations from the original! That is how the errors crept in. But that is why Hindus do not follow blindly whatever is written in the holy scriptures. There is a lot of tailoring done and different sects choose their own guidelines. And for each of the sects the aim is to be a better human being and do our worldly duties.
Completely agree with you messymiss.
ughhhhhhhhhhhhh
fortunately or unfortunately we all beleive what we want to & disbelieve what we don't like. likewise we are not knowledgeable enough to pass judgements on other scriptures without properly studying all of them.
i think some1 should delete this post. Individual theories (that to of dead man) with no proves what so ever is crap i wouldn't dare feed even to my worst enemy!
Pay peanuts & you get Monkeys
How people got it wrong , not for being a hindu mannnnnnnnn
but for trolling with other religions , and if i want to start with Hinduasm , i will not end , but actually i respect the way of people thinking , and what they believe , you can find here many kinds of believes even agnostics or atheists but everybody know his limits , and he don't attack the others , and only is trying to have a good debate and knowing what the other thinks
this is what i meant
R E - R E A D I T T T T T T
---------------------------------
"It could be a picture
It could be a medicine
it could be a bullet
depends on how you see it"
and polyandry
edifis and Jackfrost are not worth a word.
edifis,
Does hinduism acknowledge King David? Does Hinduim allow adultery? why did you quote only Islam in your thread?
One Shot, shame on me,for not being a muslim, jew or Christian! Thats the funniest thing I ever heard.
Why should I be ashamed of my religion?
I was born in a Hindu Family and I am not ashamed to say that I am a Hindu!
"
edifis said The same is true of our ...
The same is true of our Hindu Holy Texts. I don't even know Sanskrit. So I can't read the Hindu scriptures too.
Fri, 25/09/2009 - 2:08pm reply
"
i thought that you are jew or christian or even muslim , how you started a topic like this accusing a noble prophet which is respected in all religions ,and added an ugly photo with no resource .
if you didn't experience one of these religions or at least know them ,then you can't judge on them
But thank God that this topic ended with a good debate between the people here , and didn't serve your purposes like i think.
thank you other people for all these good chattings.
i wonder how MOD didn't remove this topic , are they sleep or what .(sorry mods don't delete my account , i am just One shot , i can't be two shots LOL)
---------------------------------
"It could be a picture
It could be a medicine
it could be a bullet
depends on how you see it"
Jackfrost, the Grass always looks greener on the other side of the fence!
It beats me why a man would want another man’s wife.. she would be too second hand for my liking.
Power to the non believers, it’s a great feeling to have and hold.
The same is true of the Hindu Holy Texts. I don't even know Sanskrit. So I can't read the Hindu scriptures too.
i agree with you 100% in the first part
you can read what God mentioned in his book about some people they changed the word of his Goriness by Samia
and what about other Muslims, the arab muslims are only 20 to 30 % of all muslims around the world (as i think)
and no one have any problem in reading it in its own language.
and i told you , if Quran was in hindu or hibrw or english i will the first one to learn this language to apply my religion in the right way.
for the second part , i can't argue with you in arabic language , because you will not understand it(not because of you) but because this conversation should be done between 2 people speaking arabic.
but all i can tell that it is really known that in some phrases if you remove a letter(and what is a letter) the whole meaning could change or the time of happening could change ) so how about translate it to another language??
i understand that translation will give you a general idea of what is written in Quran but (due to the understanding of the translator "a human factor")
---------------------------------
"It could be a picture
It could be a medicine
it could be a bullet
depends on how you see it"
You should not accuse a noble prophet like David just like that. you have only posted a painted foto without assuring the integrity of your sources! This is too bad for a prophet that is respected in all beliefs!!
Are you having a hard time keeping faithful by the way?
When I was in Palestine at Christmas time a few years ago, we studied the stories of the birth of Jesus in the Qu'ran and in the Bible. They are very different and it was an eye-opener to compare and contrast these stories. I do recommend this kind of study.
Mandi
Thanks Mandy! I really like the biblical history, especially the Old Testament. It's a pity I don't know the languages to read the original.
waw SAMIA ,
Game over
you closed this topic
thank you , no one could say better than what you did
---------------------------------
"It could be a picture
It could be a medicine
it could be a bullet
depends on how you see it"
Why, nicobqatar? These are part of the Judeo-Christian scripture. You are perfectly free to disagree with them. Would talking about Greek gods be equally offensive? I believe that the more we know about each others' faith the better we are.
Mandi
Yes I understand that translations from one language to another cannot amd are not 100% correct but that is my point. Faith cannot be based on one exact literal intepretation of one language if the message if for all humankind. The most logical solution would be that God's message can be the interpretation of his words laid down in any language. The message should not be lost just because their is no direct translation of an arabic phrase or word into another language.
However I see the problems some people have with that. Their opinion is that the Quran is only perfect in the original arabic and that is the only text that can be considered sacred. THis is the problem I am wrestling with.
God, surely did not write the Bible. It was the chronicles from the life of the Prophets and other holy figures penned down by some humans. Some chapter even had their names on it!
MOD should remove these kind of myths!!!
Yes, the story of Solomon and his wives and his meeting with the Queen of Sheba is part of what we call the Old Testament or Hebrew scripture. Multiple marriage, especially for the wealthy, was common in 900 BCE.
Mandi
I just have a question for you. How does it feel to be completely blinded by hatred to the truth????!!!!!
1. Among jews there is a group which claims that Allaah has a son, as Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):
“And the Jews say: ‘Uzair (Ezra) is the son of Allaah, and the Christians say: Messiah is the son of Allaah. That is their saying with their mouths, resembling the saying of those who disbelieved aforetime. Allaah’s Curse be on them, how they are deluded away from the truth!”
[al-Tawbah 9:30]
2. They described Allaah as having shortcomings, and they killed the Prophets and Messengers of Allaah, as Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):
“The Jews say: ‘Allaah’s Hand is tied up (i.e. He does not give and spend of His Bounty).’ Be their hands tied up and be they accursed for what they uttered. Nay, both His Hands are widely outstretched. He spends (of His Bounty) as He wills”
[al-Maa’idah 5:64]
“Indeed, Allaah has heard the statement of those (Jews) who say: ‘Truly, Allaah is poor and we are rich!’ We shall record what they have said and their killing of the Prophets unjustly, and We shall say: ‘Taste you the torment of the burning (Fire).’”
[Aal ‘Imraan 3:181]
3. They distorted the word of Allaah, i.e., the Tawraat (Torah). Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):
“So, because of their breach of their covenant, We cursed them and made their hearts grow hard. They change the words from their (right) places”
[al-Maa’idah 5:13]
“Then woe to those who write the Book with their own hands and then say, “This is from Allaah,” to purchase with it a little price! Woe to them for what their hands have written and woe to them for that they earn thereby”
[al-Baqarah 2:79]
4. They deserved the curse of Allaah, because of what Allaah has said about them. Allaah says:
“Those among the Children of Israel who disbelieved were cursed by the tongue of Dawood (David) and ‘Eesa (Jesus), son of Maryam (Mary). That was because they disobeyed (Allaah and the Messengers) and were ever transgressing beyond bounds.
They used not to forbid one another from Al-Munkar (wrong, evildoing, sins, polytheism, disbelief) which they committed. Vile indeed was what they used to do”
[al-Maa’idah 5:78-79]
The lies that they have fabricated against their Prophets are many, such as the following:
1. The Jews claimed that the Prophet of Allaah Sulayman (Solomon) was an apostate and that he worshipped idols, as mentioned in I Kings 11:5.
2. The Jews claimed that Loot (Lot) – peace be upon him – drank wine and committed incest with his two daughters, as mentioned in Genesis 19:30ff.
3. The Jews claimed that the Prophet of Allaah Ya’qoob (Jacob) committed theft, as mentioned in Genesis 31:12.
4. The Jews claim that the Prophet of Allaah Dawood (David) committed adultery, as a result of which Sulaymaan (Solomon) was born to him, as mentioned in II Samuel 11:4.
-- and so on, may Allaah curse them and put them to shame.
Allaah and His Messenger cursed them in numerous places in the Qur’aan and Sunnah because of their shameless actions. For example, Allaah says (interpretation of the meanings):
“And they say, ‘Our hearts are wrapped (i.e. do not hear or understand Allaah’s Word).’ Nay, Allaah has cursed them for their disbelief, so little is that which they believe.
And when there came to them (the Jews), a Book (this Qur’aan) from Allaah confirming what is with them [the Tawraat (Torah) and the Injeel (Gospel)], although aforetime they had invoked Allaah (for coming of Muhammad) in order to gain victory over those who disbelieved, then when there came to them that which they had recognized, they disbelieved in it. So let the Curse of Allaah be on the disbelievers”
[al-Baqarah 2:88-89]
“Among those who are Jews, there are some who displace words from (their) right places and say: ‘We hear your word (O Muhammad) and disobey,’ and ‘Hear and let you (O Muhammad) hear nothing.’ And Raa‘ina [in Arabic, this means ‘Be careful, listen to us, and we listen to you’, whereas in Hebrew, it means ‘an insult’] with a twist of their tongues and as a mockery of the religion (Islam). And if only they had said: ‘We hear and obey’, and ‘Do make us understand,’ it would have been better for them, and more proper; but Allaah has cursed them for their disbelief, so they believe not except a few.
O you who have been given the Scripture (Jews and Christians)! Believe in what We have revealed (to Muhammad) confirming what is (already) with you, before We efface faces (by making them like the back of necks; without nose, mouth and eyes) and turn them hindwards, or curse them as We cursed the Sabbath-breakers. And the Commandment of Allaah is always executed.”
[al-Nisaa’ 4:46-47]
“So, because of their breach of their covenant, We cursed them and made their hearts grow hard. They change the words from their (right) places and have abandoned a good part of the Message that was sent to them. And you will not cease to discover deceit in them, except a few of them”
[al-Maa’idah 5:13]
“Say (O Muhammad to the people of the Scripture): ‘Shall I inform you of something worse than that, regarding the recompense from Allaah: those (Jews) who incurred the Curse of Allaah and His Wrath, and those of whom (some) He transformed into monkeys and swines, and those who worshipped Taaghoot (false deities); such are worse in rank (on the Day of Resurrection in the Hell-fire), and far more astray from the Right Path (in the life of this world).”
[al-Maa’idah 5:60]
“The Jews say: ‘Allaah’s Hand is tied up (i.e. He does not give and spend of His Bounty).’ Be their hands tied up and be they accursed for what they uttered. Nay, both His Hands are widely outstretched. He spends (of His Bounty) as He wills. Verily, the Revelation that has come to you from your Lord (Allaah) increases in most of them (their) obstinate rebellion and disbelief. We have put enmity and hatred amongst them till the Day of Resurrection. Every time they kindled the fire of war, Allaah extinguished it; and they (ever) strive to make mischief on the earth. And Allaah does not like the Mufsidoon (mischief-makers).
[al-Maa’idah 5:64]
And the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said:
“May Allaah curse the Jews, for they have taken the graves of their Prophets as places of worship.”
“May Allaah curse the Jews: fat was forbidden for them, but they melted it down and sold it”
Like Father Like Son:
We are talking about David & adultery, but King Solomon took it a step farther! Inspite having 100's of wives and a big harem full of concubines he still courted the Queen of Sheba. The "Song of Songs" Shir Ha' Shirim may have been written by King Solomon as an ode to the Queen of Sheba!
Exiledsaint, Indeed what Whitefeather has said is true. There were thousands of Prophets in Islam. Those revealed in the divine Quran are just the few names of the ones that are relevant to convey the message in the Quran.
I suspect that the other Prophets same message of worship only one God became even more lost in human translation and therefore were not mentioned.
I find it intriguing that is also mentioned that we are not the only creations, all of whom must worship the one & only creator.
Funny that you mentioned China, from his teachings, that some speculate that Confucius may have been one of these Prophets. Allah is all knowing.
Being worthy really has nothing to do with why certain people are chosen, the Arabs prior to Islam were nothing short of barbarians before Islam cultivated them. Bani Israel were always the chosen ones but unfortunately they wouldn't adhere regardless of all the miracles they had witnessed!
Prophets Mohammed's ummah although barbaric did believe in the last miracle...the Holy Quran revealed to an illiterate Mohammed (PBUH) the last Prophet.
Since then, 1400 years the core message hasn't been changed, One book unadulterated regardless of human/political intervention. And no Prophets will come to preach after him
Pajju...What's a troll? I hope you're not asking if I live under a bridge? :) The answer would be no
Twinkle, One really can't call anyone a 'so-called Muslim' It is only Allah that knows and will judge what the heart hides.
Having said that, you do strike an excellent point saying "it is fine for Christians and Jews to attack Muslim's faith (that a prophet committed adultery) but pointing out to a fact that Bible is human-written, is a gross act"
I'm inclined to side with you
Good morning, Dali! (I'm in the US, so it is early.) Thank you for your civil and reasonable addition to this interesting topic. Let me ask another question - how would a Muslim historian approach this conundrum?
Mandi
/// If its only Arabic then that seems a rather arbitary decision by God but I don't believe that. I think any translation into any language should be equally valid.///
i can see exil from many of your posts here that you are a well educated person with sense , so i wonder how it came from you like the term above , and i am sure if it came from another one then you will keep mocking him for 3 days . :D, everybody knows the mistakes in translations and the differences between languages
/// I'm sure when we get to heaven the entrance exam will not be in arabic....///
there is no entrance exam there , actually
, we are doing it now .
---------------------------------
"It could be a picture
It could be a medicine
it could be a bullet
depends on how you see it"
Don’t believe everything =you see or read in the media. Just like all Israel solders are women and baby killers, they said the same thing about the US Marines in the Vietnam war. Goes to prove.. you can’t believe everything you hear or read
Power to the non believers, it’s a great feeling to have and hold.
once it is created.
If it is so inappropriate, then ask the MOD's to remove it. It is a masterpiece by Rembrandt! I never thought it was so offensive!
PM, Yes I have noticed & naturally I respect and understand where you're coming from, tolerance, diplomacy and tact are beginning to be lost in Muslims form of reasoning and approach just as they are often non-existant when non muslims criticism of Islamic beliefs. What I would love to see is rather than just state opinions is Muslims learning to back up their debate with substantial research & facts, like Naik or Deedat when tackling other scripture, hopefully with the educational reform especially taking place in Qatar, a new generation will be able to do just that :)
In an ideal world agreeing to disagree in debate is a healthy thing. No harm when one can states ones opinion and maintain political correctness as you have.
As a muslim myself I don't believe that the Prophet/king David committed adultery for many reasons, there you see? Reasons aside, surely you as a Muslim yourself can also share your view regarding weather one of your Muslim prophets committed adultery or not?
but it was unappropriate to put a photo like this on a public forums, they is some minor could enter this website
if you can please remove it.
---------------------------------
"It could be a picture
It could be a medicine
it could be a bullet
depends on how you see it"
And that piece of art is on display at Louvre which is a public museum. And that museum has a viewership much wider and larger than this forum. You should close that museum first Eco.
agree with samia , you are hijacking the thread and not making any useful conversation
---------------------------------
"It could be a picture
It could be a medicine
it could be a bullet
depends on how you see it"
Eco Savvy She is the mom of King Solomon the wise.
jackfrost @ keep showing your hate .
Power to the non believers, it’s a great feeling to have and hold.
Islam thought us to love all the prophets of Allah among them are David we love him so much as we love all the other prophets and it grieve me to hear from some of you he was a sinner !!!!
http://www.reciteislam.com/index.php?%20%20option=com_content&view=article&id=509&Itemid=112
more than 100,000 prophet you never heard of them , because they were sent to their own people , and no need to mention each one of them by name.
---------------------------------
"It could be a picture
It could be a medicine
it could be a bullet
depends on how you see it"
i will try to answer this question .
why bible at the first place wasn't in arabic?
or torat ?
God choose many languages to tell the people to worship him
and the choice was the arabic for quran because Mohammad (PBUH) was arabic , not like jesus , or moses or Ibraham . so God send the holy books by the prophet language.
And the interesting thing that arabs those days were very powerful in arabic language "if they want to courage ,they say poem with a very powerful words, if they want to humilate some one they will say poem....etc"
so it was a miracle by itself and you can see many people at that time converted to islam because the magical power of these words.
just like the wizards at the time of moses , when they saw the steak turning to a snake , they immediately knew that wasn't a magic and a trick they could do(and they were the experts ;) ) but it is something above their silly powers
---------------------------------
"It could be a picture
It could be a medicine
it could be a bullet
depends on how you see it"
Power to the non believers, it’s a great feeling to have and hold.
David recited melodiously Zabur, glorified Allah and the mountains joined him with praise, birds rallied around him
Most beloved prayer to Allah was the the Prayer of David
(peace be upon him) most beloved fasting to Allah was
David's (Peace be Upon him)
I wasn't trying to be funny I was trying to ask a serious question. If its only Arabic then that seems a rather arbitary decision by God but I don't believe that. I think any translation into any language should be equally valid.
I'm sure when we get to heaven the entrance exam will not be in arabic....
the diffrent between messenger and prophet
prophet(Nabi): is the one who ordered from god to worship him (like prophets of israel childs)
Messenger(rasoul): is the one who ordered to spread the message (like noah , mohamad)
and there is another tafseer (studies):
a prophet is the one who took a messege from a prophet before and he continued it
a messenger: is the one who ordered to spread the new message from God
and this what happened with the prophet Mohammad(PBUH)
he was a prophet because it was continuous message from jesus, moses and other prophets before .
and he was a messenger, because he was ordered to tell the word of God to the arab people(which was new there) and order them to follow it
correct me if i am wrong , i am only a human and a bad translator LOL
---------------------------------
"It could be a picture
It could be a medicine
it could be a bullet
depends on how you see it"
exiled saint..good one..guess adam n eve spoke in arabic too..
j3375, First of all I would not favour someone just because he/she is Muslim. I will not hate someone just because he/she is non-Muslim.
You have totally missed what we are talking here. You can't understand this unless you know what is Islam. If someone claims to be a Muslim, he/she has to follow those centuries-old rules.. there are no exceptions to this.
By the way the member I criticized is not proponent of 'free thoughts'. You missed that too.
Shouldnt you be ashamed to display her pic in open forum
wow 10000 + prophets and I've never heard of any of them.
I have another question. If God is for all of mankind then why say that the Quran in Arabic is the only authentic text? I#m sure God will not mind what language his people speak or was this a good bit of propaganda by the Arabs to spread their language?
twinkle t,the lack of tolerance you are exhibiting here in your replies to a member of your own faith is what is wrong with followers of islam today..its easy for you to denounce such free thought,but it takes courage to speak from within your fold(given the obvious backlash it generates among the followers of islam most of whom are content with just burying their heads in the sand and refusing to see any flaws in the way they follow the faith.. you urself dont understand that the goal of any religion is to be good and do good,rather than just following rules that were set centuries ago(by a human being)..as all the prophets were..
yes , White
and this is the different between messenger and prophet
( as i can translated from arabic)
---------------------------------
"It could be a picture
It could be a medicine
it could be a bullet
depends on how you see it"
exciledsaint There are about 100,000+ Prophets and they all went to different areas. Only about 20-30 are mention in the Quran and other scriptures. And the last Prophet Mohammed (ASWS) is meant to be for all of mankind that comes after him not just the Arab/Middle Easterners.
i thought that mormons are chritians ? correct me if i am wrong!!!
---------------------------------
"It could be a picture
It could be a medicine
it could be a bullet
depends on how you see it"
Pajju? TROLL ? ...
heero yes I know the mormons and other missonaries went around the world spreading various faiths, but why did they not get their own Mohammed, Jesus, David et al? Are they not worthy?
According to some so-called Muslims it is fine for Christians and Jews to attack Muslim's faith (that a prophet committed adultery) but pointing out to a fact that Bible is human-written, is a gross act.
People like PM are the worst example of Muslims that other good Muslims are ashamed off.
Dali is right.. there are people who have subscribed to a customized Islam and ]they "don't care to participate in that discussion" when questioned.
...to give you a dose of other prophets plenty of people are not familiar with after Saul biblical history context.
God I do remember those days when the Mormon missionaries visits our house and does a 'Bible' study. They also gave me a copy of that book after days of welcoming studies.
"Everything in this book may be wrong." Illusions: The Adventures of The Reluctant Messiah by Richard Bach
yes exil , it is really a good question
if you ask most of muslims around the world to bring the english version of quran , they will tell :
"this is an english copy of the meaning of quran ,i.e. it is not quran or a version of quran .
and to read quran and understand it really you have to learn arabic.
a point for arabic language ;)
but believe me , if quran was in hebraw or aramic , you will see aslo muslims rushing to learn these languages
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"It could be a picture
It could be a medicine
it could be a bullet
depends on how you see it"
I have another question. If God is for all of mankind why did all the prophets turn up in the same place? Why not one in China say or somewhere in South America to spread the word? It seems a bit unfair to say the people in the Middle East are the only chosen ones.
Its been while since i last posted but it seems the same 'themes' are being 'discussed'. Back to original post, i find it strange eddifis is using the text of the Jewish/Christian bible to cast judgement on the 'Islamic' Prophet Solomon's character and then concluding what he/she has concluded.
And the portrait...it is a wild imagination of a 16th century renaissance artist. what is its purpose exactly?
I wonder why there is such infatuation with islam?
I have a question. If the Quran is the literal word of God is his first language Arabic or did he have to translate from his own langugae to be understood?
you still out of reliable resources , ;)
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"It could be a picture
It could be a medicine
it could be a bullet
depends on how you see it"
lol, yaaah , they traveled to makkah and told the arabs this your divine book .
- My friend , even the prophet Mohammad (peace be upon him) didn't receive any kind of mercy when he told "his people" your religion is nothing and "shirk" , and you have to follow the orders of the only one God who created everything , and i am only his messenger like all the prophets before which they are my brothers.
- i will not tell you read more history at that time because you will think that i am attacking you and call you ignorant , but no ,i am just happy to share knowledge and opinions
peeeeace
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"It could be a picture
It could be a medicine
it could be a bullet
depends on how you see it"
We are talking about David & adultery, but King Solomon took it a step farther! Inspite having 100's of wives and a big harem full of concubines he still courted the Queen of Sheba. The "Song of Songs" Shir Ha' Shirim may have been written by King Solomon as an ode to the Queen of Sheba!
...the more things evidently realized that the Vatican may had been involved in writing the Islam's holy scriptures to come up with the same similarities. It's obvious from which religious scriptures came first in history.
Or better yet, who got to the Bible first to come up with his own version for the new religion.
I'm only saying these analyses in relation to historical context. If you feel religiously offended, put it elsewhere and not here. We're not talking proud faith in this discussion.
"Everything in this book may be wrong." Illusions: The Adventures of The Reluctant Messiah by Richard Bach
i never really got the opportunity to try it out!
Pay peanuts & you get Monkeys
i Paid peanuts but i got Donkeys :(
i totally agree with u..i mean we shouldn't be pinpointing any religion
Pay peanuts & you get Monkeys
dali ? TROLL ?
Because I really did not feel it a useful discussion (until Mandi added some very interesting points). I simply pointed out to some Muslims here that we should tread lightly as far as the way we discuss the Bible and Christianity. That was the issue that most interested me as I was reading the thread and I still do not want to add to the issue of the OP, for my own personal reasons.
As for the rest of your remarks, I don't intend to answer them. You, like twinkle, have tried to make this thread about me and the strength of my eman. I don't care to participate in that discussion.
I didn't drink the kool-aid! -- PM
Nope. He didn't period.
Allah knows best.
Besides I think it's a valid question
Hey Mandi Good Mornin :) I was just joining the debate...Did i miss an initiation or something?
edifis yalla wakeup :)
@ maimoona:way to go!i mean i love it the way u said it.
@ Edifis:men folk from bangladesh are perverts not because they are muslims but they have very little knowledge of islam-i mean most are non practicing.
I heard that the church in scotland actually authorised removing a biblical scripture stating the birth of Jesus from Virgin Mary!is it true?
Good Morning Pajju. But it's still night here in my bedroom.
morning edifis :)
Very good reasoning Maimoona! I wish the menfolks from your country were as intelligent and tolerant as you are. I am soory to say htis, but they all seem perverts these days. It's no wonder why your country has been ruled by women in the past decade or so.
Helloooo, Dali! Isn't that getting a little personal for someone so new to QL?
Mandi
Interesting debate especially observing how different the reasoning and approach three Muslim women took.
Although I understand where Twinkle is coming from and respect Maimoonas rationale, what I didn't understand or rather it intrigues me to ask if may, why PM didn't voice or share the disdain (whether brash or polite) displayed by the former muslimahs in regards to the non-Muslim accusation that the Muslim Prophet David committed adultery?
May I also ask PM, are you a new convert to Islam and therefore you may not fully understand why the two women here (and probably muslims all over the world) don't believe that the Prophet David committed adultery. In fact a Muslim would feel as strongly insulted at such an accusation as you are regarding Christian scripture ?
Perhaps you're absorbing what suits you in Islam and leaving out what doesn't, conceivably subscribing to a customized mix of Christianity & Islam?
If that's the case then I hope you understand the reason people who don't know this fact would understandably be suspect of you being Muslim.
Finally I'm intrigued to ask what was it that inspired you to convert to Islam.
Maimoona Rahman, You have not made me angry at all. I am rather happy to see your comments.
I did not attack the Bible. I pointed out to the fact that it contains a lot of human writings. Isn't it a fact?
Edifice is talking about the Biblical version of David referring to him as a prophet in Islam. King David and Prophet David are not two different persons. With two different versions we are talking about one person.
Encore, Maimoona! I hope we see lots more of you on QL!
Mandi
I know I've made you angry, Twinkle Twinkle. But your response was my favourite when I first came across the post. I hope someday, you become an excellent preacher. Good Luck!
Twinkle.Twinkle, PM just said that you should show a certain degree of respect to all religions. Why did you attack the Bible? And instead of making your argument stronger you resorted to criticism.
And PM didn't talk about David at all because she is wise enough to know that Edifice is talking about the Biblical version of David, not the Islamic. What do you intend to do Twinkle. Twinkle? Slay the world of Christians and Jews simply because they don't share your views?
I understand why you're angry. So was I. But I just thought about it, and decided to take off on Polite Airline 101.
Plus, being judgemental is no characeristic of a Muslimah. Presuming crude stuff about why PM may have converted may incur Allah's wrath, even more if you're wrong.
If you want people to get the right impression about Islam, then be Islamic, i.e, be nice. Not angry or judgemental or critical. Don't delude people to believing that gunboat diplomacy is Islam.
Remember, an angry warrior never wins, because an angry warrior can't think straight. And you do know that Allah loves people who can suppress rage, right?
Love Islam, Love Humanity.
I liked the way Maimoona Rehman has put it. But leelah people here know what it is but they just pretend to be ignorant. You have to deal with them in a different way.
well said,this the way one muslim should responed,unlike my dear twinkle????????????
a. I'm not going to denigrate the Bible because I've respect for Christian souls, and I've no foul intentions of subverting the Bible.
b. But I'll try to clinch the controversy.
PM, you're right. No one should bad-mouth other religious books. That, in my opinion, is anti-Islamic, because Islam encourages friendly ties with non-muslims and buckets of tactfulness and diplomacy. So, if you're trying to be a muslim, make sure satan doesn't lure you to provoking others.
I know why the muslims are clearly outraged by this post. Edifis started off the post with "King David who is considered a prophet in Islam", which implies that he's a prophet only in Islam and has no significance in any other religion. It seems like that. While Jews and Christians believe he committed adultery, the Islamic word is that he didn't. Since Jews and Christians are free to believe David committed adultery, Muslims should also be free to believe he didn't.
Ultimately, the Muslim prophet David didn't commit adultery. But the Jewish King did. I know they're the same person, but this is just a difference in opinion. I don't know if he's just a King or also a prophet for Christians. So, Edifice, it's wrong of you to say that the man who was an Islamic prophet was adulterous. Rather you should've mentioned that the man, according to the bible was adulterous.
And then you say that if prophets can be adulterous, why is it such a sin? Well, I believe that that very prophet had to pay the penalty for being adulterous. God didn't pat him on the back and say "Well done David. You sure are virile!" So there you go-regardless of whether you're christian, muslim, or jew, adultery is a mortal sin.
We Christians call the Bible the "Word of God" and we do take this designation seriously. But we do recognize the human hand of authorship, hence the names of the books - Isaiah, Matthew, Paul, etc. We do believe, however, that it "contains all things necessary to salvation."
Mandi
And no, my conversion had no man involved (but very rude of you to even say such a thing). Have some respect for yourself young lady before you go off attacking and accusing a fellow Muslimah (one old enough to be your mother) of things you know nothing about. Surely you were not raised to be so nasty???
But btw, it is nice to see you writing in (mostly intelligible) English this time instead of the text-lingo you used as "drywood". :-)
Good night.
I didn't drink the kool-aid! -- PM
and know the feelings of people I have discussed this with. I have no idea why you consider that an "evil agenda" and why you are so bent out of shape, but please don't waste your time feeling sorry for me, as I certainly don't. I am very comfortable in my own faith (Islam) and my family's faith (Christianity), and don't know what I said here that made you say I am "evil".
But I have one correction for you: Most Christians I know do NOT accept the notion that the Bible is corrupt and to call it that is insulting to them. Perhaps you don't know many Christians....
Good night "twinkle".
I didn't drink the kool-aid! -- PM
///Having more than 1 version doesn't mean corrupt. It may also mean improvement by rectification of mistakes(correction)///
hahaha, do you think that? a divine book should be perfect and no need for man hand to mess with it
---------------------------------
"It could be a picture
It could be a medicine
it could be a bullet
depends on how you see it"
///Having more than 1 version doesn't mean corrupt. It may also mean improvement by rectification of mistakes(correction)///
hahaha, do you think that? a divine book should be perfect and no need for man hand to mess with it
---------------------------------
"It could be a picture
It could be a medicine
it could be a bullet
depends on how you see it"
differences actually are, edifis. But Muslims use it to dispute the authenticity of the Bible as containing God's Word and the inauthenticity of Christianity altogether. I am sure you have noted that Muslims feel very proud of the belief that the Quran is "completely unchanged" from as it was revealed to the Prophet (saw). For many, many Muslims this notion that not one word has been altered from the original oral tradition provides the underpinning of their faith that Islam is the only true religion.
On the other hand, most Christians I know consider the enduring lessons of Jesus and their belief in his relationship to God far more important than the notion of the unaltered language of the Bible.
I didn't drink the kool-aid! -- PM
Oh, absolutely, Twinkle! That is in part what I mean about the "perspectives" of the four gospels. Each evangelist had what you might call an agenda and was writing to a different audience. So the Gospel of Matthew, written to a Jewish community, has different details than the Gospel of Luke, written by a Gentile to a Roman audience. That's why biblical studies are so important, so we can know the time and place and context in which they are written. And for me why the story of David is most probably true - it was not in the best interest of the writer to denigrate the greatest king of Israel.
Mandi
Having more than 1 version doesn't mean corrupt. It may also mean improvement by rectification of mistakes(correction).
Yes, although I'm sure that Jesus knew Greek as well as Aramaic and Hebrew. And you are right, sometimes we have to search the Aramaic for a really good look at what the Greek text and Jesus might have said. Most of the NT was actually written by Paul, a Roman citizen who became one of Jesus' disciples after His crucifixion and resurrection. Jesus appeared to St. Paul on the road to Damascus and Paul went from killing Christians to being a fervent believer and evangelist. Paul wrote what we call the epistles,or letters. The four Gospels are different, they are actually mini-biographies told from four perspectives.
Mandi
Mandilulur,
You maybe right. Still one of the criteria of authenticity as you mentioned is the story written at a time close to the time event occurred, is not very convincing. In today's world we see how many stories are 'rigged' on a daily basis. I have a thousands of examples to quote, which of course you know as well.
Do you think every book written is in the best interest of its author? or do we really know the author's internal reason for writing something all the time?
I have no problem with it except I believe that all prophets were innocent and they wouldn't commit such sins.
Jesus (saw), don't you?
I didn't drink the kool-aid! -- PM
So , you are telling me that bible has been written by a language which is not the same language of the prophet jesus???
okeyyyyyy :S confused
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"It could be a picture
It could be a medicine
it could be a bullet
depends on how you see it"
even know about the Bible. They have been taught one line (that there are many versions and are therefore corrupt), and they don't have the scholarly background to even assess it for themselves. Thank you for your scholarly contribution here.
I didn't drink the kool-aid! -- PM
Greek, guys. The spoken language of first-century Palestine was Aramaic, the written language was Hebrew. However, the New Testament was written in Greek, the lingua franca of the Roman world. Much of the NT was written after the destruction of Jerusalem in 70 CE and was addressed to the wider Mediterranean world. SOME of the NT may have been written by eyewitnesses to the events, but certainly not the majority. But as you can see, these facts do not affect the Christian faith. Our faith is in the living Jesus Christ, not in a book. We have a relationship with our Lord, not the printed page.
Mandi
and believe me they find this highly insulting (as did I). It's simply not necessary to disrespect someone's religion by saying that their Holy text is corrupted or imply that there are many different ones. This is a misconception that Muslims have been taught and they really do not factually understand the issue. You did the same by saying :which one" in reference to the Bible.
I didn't drink the kool-aid! -- PM
Actually, PM, as a biblical scholar I really enjoy the rich history of Christian scripture. One of my favorite authors is Bart Ehrman, author of "Cracking the DaVinci Code" and "Misquoting Jesus." And I am continually amazed at how much of scripture is absolutely word-for-word the same after several thousand years. I'm a Synoptic scholar and it's a never-ending mystery story with a really good plot!
Mandi
it was aramic , written by hawarieen (companions of Jesus )peace be upon him
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"It could be a picture
It could be a medicine
it could be a bullet
depends on how you look at it"
is that ur mom;s pic
i don't think it is insulting
on the other hand , which one is the right bible so we can depend on?
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"It could be a picture
It could be a medicine
it could be a bullet
depends on how you look at it"
Greek?
Or was it Aramaic?
Do you think for one minute that Christians might be insulted when you say their Holy text is corrupt? Most Muslims would be insulted if Christians here were posting that the Quran is a fake.
I am really impressed by Mandi's grace in dealing with insults to her faith as a Christian.
And mandi, I am sorry that some Muslims feel the need to denigrate your faith and the Bible.
I didn't drink the kool-aid! -- PM
Yes, Twinkle, I am quite familiar with textual criticism. I haven't found a significant flaw that would challenge my basic faith. Which texts were you referring to? BTW, it helps if you can read the original Greek.
Mandi
Not to be contentious, Twinkle, but these Bible stories fit many of the criteria of authenticity. One, they are reported at a time close to the time the event occurred. Secondly, they show the King in a bad light which would not necessarily be in the author's best interest were it not for its fundamental truth. Third, it fits the other known facts in this story, i.e., it is congruent. If the Jews don't have problems with their iconic King David being human, why should you?
Mandi
Mandilulur, You know how many changes have been made in Jewish and Christian Bible. They are no longer divine.
Edifis, the prophet Nathan declares that God will curse King David with a troubled reign, full of violent civil unrest and intrigue for his sins of adultery and the murder of Bathsheba's husband, Uriah. A further punishment is that his child born from Bathsheba would die. I'd say that these family and kingly issues were directly related to his sins, at least according to scripture.
Mandi
i think bin laden was the big spoon LOLzzzz
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"It could be a picture
It could be a medicine
it could be a bullet
depends on how you look at it"
It is interesting that you are referring to Holy Books.
I may even go as far as to say that by the book Islam is certainly the religion which I would go as far as call best. The Quran has spoke high of King and prophet David. Prophets are innocent and so was the King David.
While the other Holy Books e.g. bible are allegedly several thousand of years old and prone to the contradictory opinions of several authors, who even worse lived centuries apart from each other.
I am sure you are wise enough not to take Rembrandt's painting for real.
You don't believe on Holy Books. If you did, you would not have initiated this post. When you don't believe them, why do you quote them?
I thought Bin Laden had anal sex with a donkey. Now I know who the donkey was. It was Push incognito!
sorry , i mean George BBBBussshhh
not PUSH
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"It could be a picture
It could be a medicine
it could be a bullet
depends on how you look at it"
Oh? And what was that whole subsequent scene with the prophet Nathan all about? He confronts David's adultery with the words, "YOU are the man!" Twinkle, I'm afraid it's too late to delete, this story is in every Jewish and Christian Bible in the world!
Mandi
There is no proof that the family troubles later on in his life has anything to do with the fact that he commited the greatest sin.
Everybody faces some crisis at a certain stage in life! It might be just that.
Depends on what you got your information , and is it a liable recourse???
i can bring you some web sites prove that G. push had an oral sex with osama bin laden
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"It could be a picture
It could be a medicine
it could be a bullet
depends on how you look at it"
Even if I delete this post, no one can delete the texts from the Holy books and the old Testament. It is clearly noted that David committed adultery. Even the great artist Rembrandt depicted Bathsheba being spied by David in his famous painting.
Wow, news flash - 1000 BCE, King David commits adultery! Trouble is, Christians and Jews have known this for a VERY long time (2-3000years.) And if you read a little farther in the Old Testament, you will come to know that he didn't "get away with it." Go on, read some more, I recommend it!
Mandi
edifis, Did you witness this? How could you accuse a prophet and a great historical figure based on a 'myth'? You should delete this bizarre and stupid topic.
They have Chinese tourist packages on Mars, edifis.
There are no women on Mars MD, you better go to Venus unless you are a gay!
Yes Popes used to use a special passage way in the Vatican if they needed to escape from invading armies, but during peace time it was used to smuggle in women and also boys....
I guess Muslims get around adultery by having more than one wife.
I'll stop by when I'm going to go to Mars, edifis.
Yes I am going to be "Edifis the Great" the champion of the moon!
That's right, edifis. Thank God, that we are extraordinary!
So adultery is only prohibited for ordinary men and women.
Or a Pope during the Renaissance.